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asiannationmc
Joined: 13 Aug 2014
Posts: 1342
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 Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 10:53 am Post subject: |
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| Outside ESL, no employer would ever dream of asking for 10 days of your time, unpaid. And if they did, the employee would laugh at them. |
Just a quick question.....are not many internship in Britain and other places, companies who hire them legally obliged to pay a national minimum wage and yet do not pay a wage?
Don't companies get round it by deception or by calling the internships work placements or work experience. Now I somewhat agree with you if nothing else is on the table, work for pay, never pay for work and that is why I have always shy away from folk who want something for a favor paid forward...however, it would seem that even in jolly ole England, there are those who work for free and those who hire illegally.
Actually, I just thought of another question ... you in Britain right now.... why work for a Chinese employer when you have a multitude of universities in England that have franchised programs through out china dealing with payment in BP's where as you would teach in a 2 year program (students going to Britain to complete their last year perhaps on to masters and beyond) All you likely would have to do is cold call a few uni and find out the lay of the land.. look... if a British uni hired me.... and employed me for 10 years certainly with the credentials you have professed, you would be a shoe in....all the problems you encountered would suddenly disappear and the students you would be subject to would be of a better quality.
Think bout it...... I have often said, I dont have any interest in embracing culture... well this is part of the culture that I dint want to deal with thus I found a way out.. be smart... with the warning signs that have already come down the pike, it is time to consider staying with a western run program...
Last edited by asiannationmc on Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:06 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Spelunker
Joined: 03 Nov 2013
Posts: 392
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:04 am Post subject: re: china ft's...... |
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| Sorry, but you're not just someone who complains about a fair point now and then, you're a chronic complainer who never seems satisfied with anything. |
Given how FT's in China like to go after each other based on salary, savings, beatiful chinese girlfriend/wife, and the "I know what I know, but I'm not letting you know" syndrome, and then the yanks, canadians, brits, and their respective cliques and getting along with fellow FT in China/Asia....even from your own homeland, can be like trying to walk through a vat of treacle on the hottest day of the year in the middle kingdom, ie, a waste of time.
I'd say the percentage of FT gripers with a grievance in China is in the higher figures than the lower ones. Just something about being in China seems to bring out the worse side of a lot of people, when it comes to money/status. It is the oppressed minority syndrome which causes FT's to generally distrust and hate each other. |
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7969
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:25 am Post subject: Re: re: china ft's...... |
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| Spelunker wrote: |
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| Sorry, but you're not just someone who complains about a fair point now and then, you're a chronic complainer who never seems satisfied with anything. |
Given how FT's in China like to go after each other based on salary, savings, beatiful chinese girlfriend/wife, and the "I know what I know, but I'm not letting you know" syndrome, and then the yanks, canadians, brits, and their respective cliques and getting along with fellow FT in China/Asia....even from your own homeland, can be like trying to walk through a vat of treacle on the hottest day of the year in the middle kingdom, ie, a waste of time.
I'd say the percentage of FT gripers with a grievance in China is in the higher figures than the lower ones. Just something about being in China seems to bring out the worse side of a lot of people, when it comes to money/status. It is the oppressed minority syndrome which causes FT's to generally distrust and hate each other. |
I won't disagree with you, but I will relate my somewhat different experience. I'm just starting my 11th year at the same school (13th year in China). In that time I've seen a number of people come and go, and the ones who were as described in my quote above were the same people who (via following them on QQ, Wechat, or through the grapevine) revealed that they were unhappy with work/life regardless of where they were or what they were doing. Some people are just programmed that way. Fortunately I haven't met many like that, and the majority of FTs I've become acquainted with during my time in China were the sort that just kept to themselves and didn't hassle anyone. They're usually a bit older, more seasoned and mature, and while they may come across as strange or eccentric, they don't cause problems and aren't toxic in the workplace. Some griping now and then is normal, but some people are way over the top.
Last edited by 7969 on Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:47 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Spelunker
Joined: 03 Nov 2013
Posts: 392
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:29 am Post subject: re: fair points and a good thread |
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| To be fair I found certain provinces to be worse than others for FT's who were friendly, and those who were not. Hunan seemed to attract a lot of dregs of society from the West, as did JIangxi, and I refused to hang out in either of those provinces for too long. Now I think the whole place is hell and would never go back, the good days are long gone..... |
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joe30
Joined: 07 Jul 2016
Posts: 112
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:38 am Post subject: |
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| LarssonCrew wrote: |
I make no bones about it, I'm here to make money. I want to walk away with $30,000 at the years end in my bank, plus have 4 or 5 nice trips away [4 x 1 weeks during Spring festival], and to then invet this in the future, maybe in me, or maybe in a house deposit etc. |
Yep, exactly why I'm now upgrading my qualifications. More money, less BS from the employer.
There's no pension or savings plan for teachers abroad, you have to make one yourself. Unlikely you'll ever be able to get a mortgage abroad either. That means you need to be making decent coin if you ever want to retire or own your own place. And I want both of those things for myself, as should most westerners.
| Quote: |
| Just a quick question.....are not many internship in Britain and other places, companies who hire them legally obliged to pay a national minimum wage and yet do not pay a wage? |
Unfortunately this is fairly common in the media industry (but is near non-existant in other industries). I don't agree with this practice at all, but I do feel it's a bit different from ESL.
In the media example, the idea is you're getting some work experience which you otherwise wouldn't get, which you can use as a pathway to a job in the future.
In ESL it's nothing of the sort, since even ESL'ers fresh off the boat with no experience can and do get paid for their work. And let's be honest, a Chinese ESL employer has no intention of 'developing' the 'intern', he just wants cheap or free labour. It's an outright joke to ask anyone to do it, but especially so when the guy who was asked appears to have a few years experience already.
If a media job asked me to work unpaid, I'd tell them to shove it as well. I've never worked a day unpaid in my life and I never will. |
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Spelunker
Joined: 03 Nov 2013
Posts: 392
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:47 am Post subject: re: mortgages? |
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| There's no pension or savings plan for teachers abroad, you have to make one yourself. Unlikely you'll ever be able to get a mortgage abroad either. |
As this is in China, yes nothing like that in China, yet still people cling to the place like a barnacle to a pier....the mind boggles  And some of these people still defend China to the hilt, despite being treated so shabbily. But then those with a chinese girlfriend/wife, unable to get one elsewhere seem to be the worst/most arrogant/stubborn. For them, esp the ones with no degree and so can only work in the kindies/open their own kindie, it's a life of obllivion, and a wasteland back in most, but not all cases back home in the west. I knew a fat 40 something with a drink problem, and no degree, who told me he had no desire to return to the UK....with a demanding 30 something chinese wife....and what for his future back in England? No mortages proferred over 40.....
You may not get a pension in the mid east either, but you WILL make savings, which can go into a savings plan or for whatever you want. |
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asiannationmc
Joined: 13 Aug 2014
Posts: 1342
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:08 pm Post subject: |
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| And let's be honest, a Chinese ESL employer has no intention of 'developing' the 'intern', he just wants cheap or free labour |
One of the many reasons I would never work for a Chinese employer and that is why I wonder why Larson doesn't seek work from a franchised British uni. and while the work experience sounds good, many of my former students who took internships reported being a go'fer most of the time. you know when you look at those adverts they rarely mention payment. When I was a young uni tike, internships through the university didnt pay but you received credit....I instead choose to work in a VA Hosp. in the plumbing department where I was greeted with the daily "college boy", still it was worth it to leave at 5 with coin in my pocket...
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| Unfortunately this is fairly common in the media industry (but is near non-existant in other industries |
Dont know much bout them but I think tht the media may be the worst, as a guy I worked with at a comedy club was aiming at a pro base ball career, threw his arm out and worked as an intern sport reporter, unpaid... Brody Stevens... never became a sports announcer ... still plays pick ups and charity ... but went on to be a comic of some standing ... maybe internships do work.... but I still want to be paid....
Last edited by asiannationmc on Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:13 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Spelunker
Joined: 03 Nov 2013
Posts: 392
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:11 pm Post subject: re: larson |
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I do wonder if the op with that name is not related to the producer of a certain 80s tv series about a clever car  |
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