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XiaoWren
Joined: 05 Aug 2016
Posts: 54
Location: Asia
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 Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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TEFOFF
The other posters are right I think. You are better off fixing up a post yourself directly with the uni or school. You will surely get better terms.
In general it is usually better to be contracted with the workplace, not a 3rd party intermediary.
Moreover, EF have a bad reputation. I embarked on the recruitment process with them myself and after being much messed about came away feeling I had a lucky escape. |
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danshengou
Joined: 17 Feb 2016
Posts: 434
Location: A bizarre overcrowded hole
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| Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 12:25 am Post subject: Re: EF Academic Partnerships China |
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| XiaoWren wrote: |
| I concluded that the company has grown so fast that it relies on staff (management, HR etc) that are young, inexperienced, incompetent which, coupled with a poor company culture, results in such shoddy behaviour. Otherwise, I don't know what the game is. |
The game is profits. Everything else is secondary. If you sign on, you accept this, at least for while you are there. |
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XiaoWren
Joined: 05 Aug 2016
Posts: 54
Location: Asia
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| Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 3:48 am Post subject: Re: EF Academic Partnerships China |
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| danshengou wrote: |
| XiaoWren wrote: |
| I concluded that the company has grown so fast that it relies on staff (management, HR etc) that are young, inexperienced, incompetent which, coupled with a poor company culture, results in such shoddy behaviour. Otherwise, I don't know what the game is. |
The game is profits. Everything else is secondary. If you sign on, you accept this, at least for while you are there. |
Yes, indeed profits. Are you suggesting that their dreadful recruitment process is deliberate? That by tying up inbound teachers (that they have no intention of hiring) not just for months but potentially a year or more, they have kept you away from competing with them? Seems a scewy way of fixing the market. |
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danshengou
Joined: 17 Feb 2016
Posts: 434
Location: A bizarre overcrowded hole
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| Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 9:24 am Post subject: |
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Why would EF giving you the runaround prevent you from working for someone else? The main thing about the job hunt first of all is already to have a job and to be selective, so them putting you off shouldn't matter much since you would have alternatives. Barring having a job while looking for one, you should have savings so you don't have to settle for the first job that comes your way. Finally, if no job or money, you can't afford to wait for the likes of an EF because filling the job search should be your absolute main priority until you close an acceptable deal. And even if EF was your top choice (heaven forbid), you still go with number two in order to keep money coming in.
Last edited by danshengou on Tue Aug 09, 2016 9:54 am; edited 2 times in total |
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XiaoWren
Joined: 05 Aug 2016
Posts: 54
Location: Asia
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| Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 9:49 am Post subject: |
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| danshengou wrote: |
| Why would EF giving you the runaround prevent you from working for someone else? The main thing about the job hunt first of all is already to have a job and to be selective, so them putting you off shouldn't matter much since you would have alternatives. Barring having a job while looking for one, you should have savings so you don't have to settle for the first job that comes your way. Finally, if no job or money, you can't afford to wait for the likes of an EF because filling the job search should be your absolute main priority until you close an acceptable deal. And even if EF was your top choice (heaven forbid), you still go with number two in order to keep money coming in. |
I don't know why EF have such a rubbish recruitment process. Both Pioneer and I have been through it though. |
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danshengou
Joined: 17 Feb 2016
Posts: 434
Location: A bizarre overcrowded hole
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| Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 9:56 am Post subject: |
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| But I mean how could EF prevent a job applicant from searching elsewhere. One should never stop working or looking for work until the work visa has been issued, and that goes especially for places like China and Saudi. |
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LarssonCrew
Joined: 06 Jun 2009
Posts: 1308
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| Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 10:07 am Post subject: |
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Let's face it, another layer on top means someone else creaming profits.
If you get 12000 from EF, that means they are getting 16 from the college, who are getting 20 from whoever is in the HR.
So cutting out a layer means you can get more yourself. |
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XiaoWren
Joined: 05 Aug 2016
Posts: 54
Location: Asia
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| Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 10:41 am Post subject: |
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| danshengou wrote: |
| But I mean how could EF prevent a job applicant from searching elsewhere. One should never stop working or looking for work until the work visa has been issued, and that goes especially for places like China and Saudi. |
Nothing is stopping a person from searching.
However I don't sign multiple contracts simultaneously, with more than one employer, knowing that I am not going to be able to keep one or other them. That is to say, renege on it before it has started.
Especially if I am interested in living and working in a particular locale, Shanghai for example. That would be to mess in your nest before you have even got there.
EF, Wallstreet, Meten and others are based in Shanghai and you can't have simultaneous visa applications going through the same office.
You could (but I wouldn't) sign contracts with employers in other provinces, (or countries) if you want to hedge your bets, but that would involve the candidate, namely me, producing multiple sets of (sometimes costly) documents. |
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jimpellow
Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Posts: 913
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| Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 8:19 pm Post subject: |
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| XiaoWren wrote: |
| danshengou wrote: |
| But I mean how could EF prevent a job applicant from searching elsewhere. One should never stop working or looking for work until the work visa has been issued, and that goes especially for places like China and Saudi. |
Nothing is stopping a person from searching.
However I don't sign multiple contracts simultaneously, with more than one employer, knowing that I am not going to be able to keep one or other them. That is to say, renege on it before it has started.
Especially if I am interested in living and working in a particular locale, Shanghai for example. That would be to mess in your nest before you have even got there.
EF, Wallstreet, Meten and others are based in Shanghai and you can't have simultaneous visa applications going through the same office.
You could (but I wouldn't) sign contracts with employers in other provinces, (or countries) if you want to hedge your bets, but that would involve the candidate, namely me, producing multiple sets of (sometimes costly) documents. |
It's is indeed an ethical dilemma about accepting more than one position.
But I think this dilemma is now a non-issue. As has been discussed previously, the new national system will lock out any attempts to initiate the work visa process once one school has started one.
The idea about looking out of country is a good one, ethical issues aside.
Question then becomes if this gives the employer too much leverage once a teacher accepts a position. |
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danshengou
Joined: 17 Feb 2016
Posts: 434
Location: A bizarre overcrowded hole
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| Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2016 3:16 am Post subject: |
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| A job acceptance to work in a foreign country (where you don't have the right to work) is meaningless without a work visa. If you suspect that you might not get the visa, it is common sense to continue looking while it is in process to avoid potentially losing months of income. |
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XiaoWren
Joined: 05 Aug 2016
Posts: 54
Location: Asia
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| Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2016 10:23 am Post subject: |
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| jimpellow wrote: |
| As has been discussed previously, the new national system will lock out any attempts to initiate the work visa process once one school has started one. |
I have searched for info on this new national system for issuing visas that you mentioned. I see new regs came in 2013 which created some new visa categories. But I can't find what you refer to.
Can you point to some info? A topic for a new thread perhaps? |
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