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waltgomez
Joined: 03 Jul 2014
Posts: 105
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 Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 4:10 am Post subject: Vinnell Aviation |
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The thoughts below are an opinion of the poster based on the poster's observations. Another person can have a completely different opinion/impression of the place.
If you are offered a job by Vinnell and are assigned to Vinnell Aviation, here are some things to keep in mind:
1) It is run very much like a military operation, hence you will be expected to look and act like a military person or, at least, like a clean-cut Mormon type. Or, if you can remember a movie about life inside a submarine and the people that work in there- that's the kind of people that succeed at Vinnell Aviation.
One person got seriously reprimanded for such small things as loose shoe laces and a belt bag. A tiny little glitch in appearance or improper communication can cost you your job. The manager's power is absolute. He can just fire you at a moment's notice without giving you any explanation.
2) It is run by younger CELTA-type teachers ( 30ies), and many of the employees are older ( 40ies- 60ies) with MA's and even PhD's.
3) Observations are weekly, with forms and reports and follow-up counseling. Even if you have a PhD in TESL, you will still be treated as a CELTA "practicumer".
4) The teachers are expected to use course books as little as possible, but instead, create or find " adapted materials". Thus, even though you are given books, you are basically expected to teach from something that you need to prepare every day; not so much from the books.
The good things: Vinnell, in general, is very efficient at getting you all the documents for the job, very slick with medical tests, bank accounts, etc.; the location is quiet, the Internet connection is pretty good, the lab facilities are very modern. The food is American.
If you think you can handle it, then go ahead; the money is good- some $4500 after tax. However, it is very stressful, and the greatest emphasis is on maintaining spotless military appearance. The younger management treats the employees as military subordinates.
If you are more of a college/creative type, then do yourself a favor and look for a job in a university environment. You don't want to go thru the hiring process and then lose that job because you did not look and act like a neat airman.
Last edited by waltgomez on Fri May 04, 2018 11:40 am; edited 2 times in total |
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hash
Joined: 17 Dec 2014
Posts: 456
Location: Wadi Jinn
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| Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 5:32 am Post subject: Re: Vinnell Aviation |
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| waltgomez wrote: |
1) It is run very much like a military operation....... |
I worked at Vinnell in the ‘70s – the 1970s that is – which is technically in the last century. From your report here, I see that nothing much has changed. Actually, you seem to have had it better since in my day, we were “issued” regulation “clothing” and “gear” and had to wear it every time we “taught”.
Long-time readers to this forum will not be surprised by what you report here. Vinnell, along with the other “military” gigs in the Kingdom, has long been known to be among the most difficult ESL jobs around and among the least satisfying from a “professional” (ESL) point of view….. (and therefore, among the better paid….you get what you sweat for). It has often made cameo appearances on ESL forums and the comments have invariably been negative.
But in my opinion, Vinnell (and his brothers) have gotten a bad rap – or rather, an unfair rap.
From day one, from the first contact an ESLer may have with the company, Vinnell makes no bones about what its mission is and what its nature consists of. (One of its most ballyhooed enticements to accept the job is to inform you of the many opportunities you will have to visit "Thailand". They go on and on about this).
Even going in with half-open eyes, an ESLer should be under no illusions what he’s getting into and what type of “personnel” most of his co-workers will be like. I mean, what does he expect? Tree-hugging graduates of Bryn Mawr, Swathmore or Bennington? (BM’s graduate school is coeducational).
Vinnell is run like a military operation because guess what, that’s what it is. It’s contractually obligated to train the SANG (KSA National Guard) to be an effective fighting force. For all intents and purposes, you might say, it’s the West Point of KSA, love it or leave it.
Vinnell has never wanted the ESL unit in its midst precisely because it knew the kind of employee it would get. However, as in so many places, this kind of training was forced down its throats and they had to go along with it (if they wanted the contract)….but they’ve always been unhappy with it. It’s like having the proverbial elephant in a china shop…the two just don’t mix.
Nevertheless, I’ve always said and continue to say that as a first ESL job in KSA, there’s no better “training” for an ESLer than one of the military gigs that still exist….Raytheon, Vinnell, BAE (for the Brits) and a few others. After a couple of years teaching in one of these, SESP and anything it can throw at you, will feel like a tea party.
Finally, just remember that you’re not there to “teach”. You’re there to train and to keep ‘em off the streets. If you do get something academic across to your classes, more power to you….but that’s not your real mission. If you can accept such a mind-set, you should have no trouble completing your contract. (Strangely, that’s what a high school principal in San Pedro, California once told me upon my accepting a job offer) |
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revilo
Joined: 05 Oct 2013
Posts: 181
Location: Mos Eisley
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| Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:18 am Post subject: San Pedro? |
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You taught in San Pedro?
My condolences.  |
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In the heat of the moment
Joined: 22 May 2015
Posts: 393
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:24 am Post subject: |
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| Was anyone else waiting for the above message to self destruct? |
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waltgomez
Joined: 03 Jul 2014
Posts: 105
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| Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 12:36 pm Post subject: Re: Vinnell Aviation |
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| Quote: |
| Nevertheless, I’ve always said and continue to say that as a first ESL job in KSA, there’s no better “training” for an ESLer than one of the military gigs that still exist….Raytheon, Vinnell, BAE (for the Brits) and a few others. After a couple of years teaching in one of these, SESP and anything it can throw at you, will feel like a tea party |
That's provided you will survive the former and can hold down the job for " a couple of years". Some guys get fired from the former ones within the first months - if they don't get approved by the managers.
Plus, the "tea parties" may have other problems, such as disorganization and middle east- style management- delays, mistakes, broken promises, lies, latenesses, omissions, etc. |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 10:19 am Post subject: |
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I remember Vinnell and some of its EFLers and military types from my time in KSA. Big bucks but there is a price to pay for that.
Even though they had big salaries some of them took moonlighting evening jobs at ELS and Larsen-Nielsen (LANSA). |
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SaabFanatic
Joined: 27 Oct 2015
Posts: 28
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| Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 4:42 pm Post subject: Re: Vinnell Aviation |
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| Quote: |
| Nevertheless, I’ve always said and continue to say that as a first ESL job in KSA, there’s no better “training” for an ESLer than one of the military gigs that still exist….Raytheon, Vinnell, BAE (for the Brits) and a few others. After a couple of years teaching in one of these, SESP and anything it can throw at you, will feel like a tea party. |
I just gave a current rundown on SESP in a new thread.
Here is the link: http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=115076
Some of the things that SESP can (and does) throw at people now can not be recovered from.
As an example, SESP locked two first-timer South Africans out of the country in April when they went to "renew their business visas" in Bahrain.
In that case, SESP:
(a) let them leave the country to "renew their business visas" with only a single bag each for the (supposedly) same day round trip
(b) refused to help them back into the Kingdom after they were denied re-entry by Immigration, and then
(c) completely ignored them even after they returned home to South
Africa two days later with only the clothes on their backs!
SESP never even made an effort to help them recover their things that were left in Saudi Arabia...
And these are not the only ones. Even those with Iqamas have been INTENTIONALLY locked out of the Kingdom by SESP as recently as a month and a half ago.
IMO, a position at SESP should not currently be a real consideration for anyone, but I would especially advise first timers to avoid the company like the plague.
At least until the current Managing Di | | |
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