Job Discussion Forums

[MJS]

Hey Friends,

After a good deal of soul searching and more than a few man hours researching the web I�ve decided to teach ESL abroad. I�m hoping some of you'd be willing to give me an idea what my earning potential is.

Though it�s been some time since I�ve taught in a public school environment (long enough that it�s fallen off my resume), I was until recently a youth pastor and worked interim assignments in that capacity for 5 years. In fact it was my intention, as my final adult career to become a pastor full-time. Sadly a divorce brought that aspiration to an end. It hasn�t however quenched my desire to teach.

Though I�ve given some thought to teaching in the States, spending some time as an expatriate sounds exceptionally appealing to me; frankly becoming a permanent expatriate sounds even better. Family wise I�m an orphan, and though I have a son, he�s 22, left for the Coast Guard at 17, and hasn�t lived at home or anywhere near it since.

In any case, presently I am employed as a Board Certified forensic expert (Vocational Forensics). I have 2 Master degrees, 5 years as a pastor/teacher, 15 years as a counselor with 10 years in management and as an owner of a counseling firm, I have a strong background in insurance litigation and will be completing the Barcelona CELTA course at International House Riviera Maya, before I leave.

What are the best bets in terms of highest wages?

Also and importantly, I will likely only have about $10K cash when I get to wherever I'm going so finding a position with some expedience will be prudent. What is the best way to begin that process before I leave the States?

I had mapped out my first choices in the following order:

#1 Panama
#2 Costa Rica
#3 New Zealand
#4 Japan
#5 Taiwan
#6 Thailand
#7 Korea (assuming the stories are NOT mostly true )

Of course Spain, France or Italy would be fantastic, but from what I've read that's out of the question.

Please those reading take a couple of minutes to write back and give me some idea what kind of wages to expect, how they relate to a standard of living, and whether I qualify for university positions?

Thanks for your time!


I hope all reading are well and happy.


Best regards
Mike

[migo]

Thailand definitely won't get you a good salary, Korea and Japan seem to be pretty good and Hong Kong does as well. Not too sure about the rest.

[vre]

Ever thought of Turkey? Many non- Europeans here. wages usually reasonable and you can live on them comfortably and private lessons with foreigners are highly sought after by locals and can bring in a full extra wage per month with just a few hours per week!

Nice people, good food, interesting country, close to Europe, a lot more liberal than you may imagine.

Good luck. Go to the Turkey forum for more details.

[MJS]

Turkey huh? I gotta say, given it's proximity to Iraq, my American citizenship, my holding a Masters degree in Theology from a Christian seminary and having been a pastor leads me to believe Turkey just wouldn't be the brightest of career moves. Thanks for the suggestion though.

M

[Gordon]

MJS,
It is obvious you haven't been to Turkey before. It is very secular and most Turks would not care that you are a Christian.

What are some of your interests?
What would make you happy?

[bigbadsuzie]

Your thread suggested that money was your main concern,in that case the Arab states is where the money is .
The fact that you are a master holder as well as a christian and an American to boot will not make much difference but don't expect to convert anyone to your faith.
As has already being mentioned Turkey is quite a good place to start ,it is a secular country and they are very actively involved in moving into the E.U. at this moment in time you are unable to work there. When they do get in I wonder if non-E.U passport holders will be allowed to stay ?

[vre]

I must say, with all due respect, you sound like you have really pre-conceieved and narrow ideas about this part of the world, like many Americans, unfortunately. Most of my friends here happen to be North American and the most trouble they've ended up in here is marrying a Turk

Do you know how far Iraq is from here, despite it being one of many neighbours????????? How is your geography?

Who cares what your masters is in?

Yesterday after work, as I was shopping in Istanbul, I stopped to listen to the church bells ringing from the beautiful old church next to me. I'm also woken up every morning by the call to prayer at the nearby mosque

Money is good, especially at universities.

Is it a challenge that you want or are you just in it for the money?

Maybe my email was directed by God. I very rarely post on the General forum

[ls650]

The original post talks a lot about money, but says almost nothing about teaching.

TEFL doesn't pay much money anywhere in the world. If being financially successful is a priority, perhaps it would be better to pursue a different career choice.

[jibbs]

next...

[jibbs]

I'd say Taiwan or Korea. Can save up to USD$1000/month or more in those two countries. Even Vietnam is good if you can make $1400 plus and probably save $500-700. Japan as we all know is expensive but if you can stretch the cash.... And some people have made a lot in the middle east. That's about all I know. If you can get a job at an international school, however, it may not matter which country, the pay will be good. (Education degree required for that I believe)

[Glenski]

What are your master's degrees in? If they are related to teaching or education, they would be your only saving grace from an entry level position at a conversation school (eikaiwa) in Japan.

Such jobs make about 3,000,000 yen/year (about US$27,000 at today's exchange rate). After paying for basic necessities, you have about half of your paycheck left over. So try living on 160,000 yen/month after you have paid for rent, utilities, phone service, and insurance. The average savings is about 70,000 to 90,000 yen/month.

You will probably have housing provided by the employer, which means recycled furnishings just like college days in a low tax neighborhood in a fairly old apartment. Don't expect any raises in pay.

You could eventually earn more by picking up private lessons, or after a year or so, you could change jobs and work in a high school. You said you taught before, so maybe you could even start in an international school instead of eikaiwa.

[moonraven]

Panama and Costa Rica do not pay well at all. If money is your priority, cross them off your list.

[patchwork]

if you are going to travel the world, the first thing you have to do is open your mind.

if you go anywhere with preconceived notions, good luck.

Iraq and Turkey are not very close to each other. there's several countries between them.

[moonraven]

Patchwork, Your mind is so open that several countries from a parallel universe fell into it. Turkey and Iraq do share a border--which is why in the spring of 2003 the US was trying to bribe Turkey into allowing troops to enter Iraq through Turkey.

[PAULH]

Just want to add that Im a Kiwi from Auckland and though I have never taught at home the bottom has fallen out of the EFL market in New Zealand with the number of (mainly chinese) students fleeing to Australia. A couple of big bankruptcies put a lot of ESL teachers out of work. South Island is possible but rather seasonal.

New Zealand immigration makes you jump through a lot of hoops to get a visa but I definitely recommend a visit.


I am in Japan with Glenski, and with Masters degrees i could recommend university work but it depends on your specialty and you would need some teaching experience in Japan as well as contacts. Teaching at a conversation school is OK for a year or two but not well paid and not really a career-track position.