Job Discussion Forums

garbotara · Joined: 15 Sep 2003 Posts: 529 Location: China

Attention Beijing teachers,
I am actually writing this on behalf of 4 teachers that will have to go down to Hong Kong over the holiday to get their Z visas.For some reason the school I am working now says they can not get them.Another teacher and I worked in China before and pointed out that L visas are routinely changed to Z visas all over the country.We also pointed out that our L visas had been changed at the school we had worked at before.
It doesn't make sense that they have to make that trip at their own expense.I have my Z visa already.they just had to have mine extended.I want to know if anyone else in Beijing was able to get their L visa changed to a Z visa successfully.
The AD got flustered when the only other experienced teacher when we said that our L visas had been changed before.Then a foreign teacher had the nerve to say that no where in China it can be done.What a liar.Maybe he had just worked for this company and does not know any better.I want to give the guy the benefit of the doubt.Or maybe he is just the school stooge.
At any rate, if I can save these teachers an expensive trip to HK I would be happy.So if you have any information , please, respond to this thread.
I am having serious doubts about the legality of the school I am working at presently.Also, they will not give me my red and green books.I am not sure what to do about this.Another concern and their Chinese co-teachers take too active a role in the foreign teacher's class.This would be alright if their grammar and spelling was up to snuff, but it isn't.

burnsie · Joined: 18 Aug 2004 Posts: 489 Location: Beijing

It's very difficult to change from a L to a Z visa is possible in Beijing, but it comes at a price.

My school said I had to go to HK to get my visa too.

I was very lucky though. I was doing some work for an Agency who can do Z visas.

At the end of the day it comes at a price - 2000-3000Y. It's who you know and as my agency is a registered agent and has good relations with the Foreign Experts Department in Beijing I was able to do it.

There are other people who can do the transfer, check out www.thatsbeijing.com classifieds under the visa section.

Sorry I have to go to class. If you want more info send me a message.

Ludwig

Spiderman Too · Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 2:34 am Post subject:

It is my understanding that you cannot lawfully obtain a 'Z' visa inside China; even if the school is licensed to employ foreigners and the foreigner is suitably qualified.

Perhaps not altogether relevant but this situation is no different from South Korea and Thailand where 'visa runs' to Japan and Malaysia respectively, are commonplace (in these 2 countries foreign teachers secure employment AFTER they arrive [on a tourisit visa] and then set about converting [obtaining] a 'working' visa).

However, converting 'L' visas to 'Z' visas within China is quite common.

On my first visit to China I entered on an 'L' visa and my employer-school converted it firstly to an 'F' visa and then a 'Z' visa.

In July I read a message on another forum reportedly posted by an expat. manager of a Beijing based recruiting agency in which he warned that a 'crack down' was about to begin in Beijing in respect of 'Z' visas (apparently part of the government's drive to eliminate corruption).

When I entered China this time, in August, my employer-university were most insistent that I obtain a 'Z' visa. Indeed, when I told that that I entered on an 'L' visa on the last occasion they told me that was illegal.

smalldog · Joined: 04 Feb 2004 Posts: 74

Converting L to Z in Beijing is not an easy procedure. To do it, you will need to get your school to write a letter explaining why it was not possible to obtain a Z visa before coming to China (many schools are unwilling to write this letter), and pay about 2000 yuan to an agent with sufficient guanxi. Patrick on 86879581 should be able to help.

millie · Joined: 29 Oct 2003 Posts: 413 Location: HK

Spiderperson2 wrote:

Spiderman Too · Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 11:52 am Post subject:

I wrote:-

Roger · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 9138

If you folks have special problems with your passports in Peking then the PSB in Peking are handling such cases DIFFERENTLY, and you might have to find out why that is.
Here in the South you can always get a work visa locally, and you can have your tourist visa changed into a work visa - abso-bloody-lootely no problemo!

May I suggest that you enquire as to what to do when the first one-year contract expires? Are teachers requried to fly out of China and return with a new work visa?
PRobably not! They will probably have a solution for those who continue staying in China after one year; that's where you can start having hope!

Besides, I am not sure you have to be physically in Hong Kong to get a work visa; can one of those guys act on bhealf of the whole gang?
(Of course, those remaining behind must keep photocopies of their passport and residence permits...).

millie · Joined: 29 Oct 2003 Posts: 413 Location: HK

hello Spiderman2,

Do we agree on what?

viz you wrote:

ymmv · Joined: 14 Jul 2004 Posts: 387

Converting an L to a Z visa was talked about here:

http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/job/viewtopic.php?p=136417&highlight=#136417

As others have pointed out on this thread, it IS being done in many places. However, other places do/will not. I remember reading an article in April or May of this year that was a report of a new policy that the Beijing Municipal government was about to implement new restrictions on those seeking to teach in Beijing. They included checking credentials more closely, requiring a B.A. and 2 years experience, and a TEFL cert. requirement. As part of that crackdown, the refusal to change an L to a Z-visa in Beijing may also have been on the list. Sorry, I can't find the link to the original story I read. I have also heard anecdotal stories of the same - that Beijing will no longer convert an L to a Z in-country.

I was told by a non-Beijing FAO who attended the FAO conference in Nanjing this year that those Beijing regulations could possibly be extended throughout the country eventually.

But as we know in China, "the mountains are high and the Emperor is far away". Which is why many of the outlying provinces will still convert an L to a Z despite the fact that that technically they shouldn't. The reasons they do anyway are mentioned in the above-cited post (9th item down).

OP, I think your FAO is being straight with the foreign teachers in Beijing. The options are to either go to HK or go through one of the "brokers" as others mentioned.

Roger mentions:

Spiderman Too · Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 1:19 pm Post subject:

There are so many 'experts' on this forum that it gets a little crowded at times!

http://www.chinajob.com/service/faq.php?news_id=82&faq_keyword=

Sinobear · Joined: 24 Aug 2004 Posts: 1269 Location: Purgatory

My former employer issued an invitation letter to prospective suckers which allowed them to obtain an "F" visa in their home country. That visa was coverted to a "Z" visa without problem or question (in Beijing). Nowadays, they insist that suckers arrive in country with an "L" visa on a one-way ticket (their first experience trying to explain to Chinese bureaucracy how desperate they are to work for a sweatshop company). The suckers; however, encounter no problems with the conversion of the visa because the school (now) has sufficient guanxi with the PSB to do so.

I would personally take the safe route and make sure that you have obtained a "Z" visa prior to coming to China. I do agree; also, that now there are "services" in Beijing where one can purchase a "Z" visa cash-in-hand.

ymmv · Joined: 14 Jul 2004 Posts: 387