Job Discussion Forums

Marika · Joined: 17 Jun 2004 Posts: 32

Ahhhhh you see my point and understand...well we just agree. Thanks for the reply Nagoyaguy.
Cheers

Sweetsee · Joined: 11 Jun 2004 Posts: 2302 Location: ) is everything

Nismo,

I noticed you were sporting a USCB sweatshirt. I grew up there, SB that is. You going there now?

Cheers,
s

crazyteacher · Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 34 Location: Tokyo

Perhaps by talking to people you dont know you are invading thier "virtual privacy". In Japan theres not much privacy so they create "virtual privacy" by simply ignoring others. This is how a salaryman on a packed train can be alone in his own little world and this is how Japanese people can live so close to each other. They become experts in not noticing things.

Another idea is that you are acting too familiar. The thing is that you havent "broken the ice" but you are acting like you have just because the other person is a forigner.

The message you send by demanding this level of familarity is basically "You are a forigner! So am I! Wow!"

This gets old rather quickly.

I would suggest that you break the ice before trying to act so familiar. Its not that difficult.

Noodle · Joined: 06 May 2004 Posts: 588

Why should foreigners feel obliged to say hello to each others in the street? So chinese in North-America should say 'ni hao' to each others?
That is weird...

crazyteacher · Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 34 Location: Tokyo

Sorry that I`m responding to my own post but i was at work before and didnt have time to write all I wanted.

Heres the rest...

A suggestion: If you want to talk with a forigner you see on the street go up and say "Sorry, Do you know any good bars around here. I need a drink." You will most likely get directions to a decent bar. Go to the bar and chill out. Next time you see the forigner say "Hey thanks, that was a really good bar"

I know this seems like a lot of work but human relationships require work. Perhaps you think you have done that work simply by coming to Japan but to long term residents you havent. This is why you get the icy stares. YOU didnt break the ice!

What I take exception to is the fact that you assume that there is something wrong with the other people. Your life will be a lot easier if you just realize that 99% of the time we have no idea what other people are thinking or feeling (unless they tell us and even that isnt foolproof!). If noone wants to sit next to you even though the train is crowded you could either assume that they are all racists or you could just accept that this is what is happening and that you cant be sure why it is happening. If someone gives you an icy stare it could just be a hangover! Comments like " But I've also meet those people who think they're just to good" assume you know what these people are thinking. Do you?

Nagoyaguy went off on the same trip. He said:

"For some foreigners, they want the illusion that they are the only foreign face in Japan."

" Plus, a lot of foreigners like to delude themselves."

How does he know all this?

"Plus, some people are just naturally arseholes. "

well this I cant argue with......

" When I lived in Kyoto, I would see some gaijin literally cross the street to get away from me, so that we wouldnt pass each other on the sidewalk. Others would see me, then deliberately turn away or turn their backs and totally avoid any eye contact. "

Thats the way people would treat..............an arsehole.

Just something to think about.

If I was doing something that kept generating bad vibes in other people I would stop doing it. The fact is to a lot of long term residents you are just being annoying. Like the drunk guy in the bar who comes over to talk to you even though you wish he would go away. Most drunk people get the message after a while........

But really I do remember how you feel. When I first got here there were just SO MANY JAPANESE PEOPLE! I`m used to more of a mix so when I saw a gaijin in shibuya I wanted to talk to him. I didnt (I guess you are braver than I am). I felt a connection between me and the other gaijin simply because we were both gaijin in Japan.

In the end if someone said "Hi" to me on the street I would return the greeting simply because its easier to do that then to scowl.

Nagoyaguy · Joined: 15 May 2003 Posts: 425 Location: Aichi, Japan

Lynn · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Posts: 696 Location: in between

Nismo · Joined: 27 Jul 2004 Posts: 520

crazyteacher · Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 34 Location: Tokyo

Nagoyaguy said

" You know the type....."

Well I`m glad to say that I dont. Things must be different in your part of Japan.

You should move to Tokyo!

Noodle · Joined: 06 May 2004 Posts: 588

Sweetsee · Joined: 11 Jun 2004 Posts: 2302 Location: ) is everything

I was on a train recently standing beside a non-Japanese person and we didn't acknowledge each other. I wanted to but didn't feel like hassling. Had I been able to I would have asked if they were teaching and how it was going. This person seemed absorbed with themself and gave no indication of wanting to chat so I let it slide.

As a rule though, I will take the initiative as it is more in line with my character than most people, I believe. I might add that I often end up becoming friends with people that I strike up a conversation with. I might also add that I am just as inclined to strike up a conversation anywhere, say for example while on holiday abroad, I always meet lots of people and end up becoming good friends.

So, I believe the people who avoid you or are unreceptive to your greetings are people who you are better off forgetting about.

grampus · Joined: 14 Mar 2003 Posts: 18

I see hundreds of people every day. Why should i say hi to everyone? Just because it is another non-Japanese face? Give me a break.

Maybe people are day dreaming, have more important things to worry about or simply do not feel the need to say hi to everyone they meet.

You may get a smile or a nod if you are lucky.

Gordon · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Posts: 5309 Location: Japan

It really depends where you live. I live in a small city and other than my friends or colleagues, I walk past about 3 foreigners a month. Usually we nod at each other or sometimes strike up a conversation depending on the social context. No big deal. Most of the time they are not English teachers.
When I go to Kyoto, I see more foreigners in a day than I do in a year where I live.

Celeste · Posted: Sat Oct 09, 2004 9:28 am Post subject:

I am neither one way or the other on this issue. My husband always says hello to other foreigners, I usually don't unless they make contact first. We live in a city with a large foriegn population. I will make polite conversation if someone initiates it though. I have met a few people on the subways here who are from smaller towns who seem a bit starved for English conversation. I don't mind talking to them because I imagine how I would feel in the same situation.

crazyteacher · Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 34 Location: Tokyo

Nagoyaguy I think your last post had a double standard. You claim to be able to know people without ever meeting them

You said" They are the same kind of people who....."

and

" You know the type, "

But you dont think they can do the same to you.

"Well, I may very well be an arsehole, but the point is that THEY dont know that yet"

The thing is they do know that already. Or at least they think they do, the same way you think you know about them.

Thats the magic of generalization. It greatly simplifies the world so that you can have the illusion that you know whats going on. The world is complex. Life is much simpler to deal with if you can just assume that everyone who is not kind to you is just an arsehole.

To help this process along, you can have various categories or "types" that you can put the offending people into. The only problem is when you find out that other people are doing the same to you.