Job Discussion Forums

[vindice]

Neusoft Software University, Dalian, Liaoning

If you are considering an offer or interested in knowing
more about Neusoft Institute of Information Technology, Dalian, please
email me at: [email protected].

We are present and former teachers of Neusoft Dalian and are
alarmed at the conditions and treatment we have received.
We want the truth to be known.

[ChinaMovieMagic]

Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2004 9:27 pm Post subject: Web-based ChinaSchoolBlacklist/Greenlist--Seeks evaluations

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http://www.buxiban.com/schoolBLKCN.asp

China School Blacklist
The China School Blacklist and China School Green List have been compiled from the information contained within our extensive database of schools and recruiters. Each institution listed within our database is afforded a rating according to the number and category of verifiable comments made. The rating system is as follows:

The Rating System Used on Our Site
***** Denotes institutions that have a consistent record of positive comments made about them, or are considered otherwise outstanding. These institutions automatically become Green Listed
**** Denotes institutions that have had positive, as well as some rather minor negative reports made about them. These institutions can be considered to offer quite good opportunities.
*** Denotes institutions that have received no positive nor negative comments, or an equal number of positive and negative comments. These institutions are considered to offer reasonable opportunities.
** Denotes institutions that have had more negative than positive comments made about them. These institutions are considered to offer rather poor opportunities, but could still be considered.
* Denotes institutions that have received a significant number of negative reports, or reports of a serious nature made about them. These institutions automatically become Blacklisted.


We are fully aware of the shortfalls of blacklists and therefore the aim of our site is not to encourage teachers to avoid institutions that may be contained on our sites blacklist. Our aim is to enable teachers considering positions with certain institutions to identify problem areas up front so as to avoid encountering problems that others may have encountered in the past. In order for an institution to be placed on our site�s blacklist, it must have received consistent and verifiable complaints, or must have committed a serious and verifiable offence against a foreign employee. Each institution that becomes blacklisted is informed of this fact, and given the opportunity to respond to the comments made. Replies from institutions can be viewed within the blacklist wherever available.

To add your comments about a school please click here.

[vindice]

thanks, Chinamoviemagic.
very helpful post.

[Nauczyciel]

Very helpful indeed! There are no schools blacklisted, so we can go ahead and feel the real China - no danger whatsoever!

[ChinaMovieMagic]

"Better to brightly light a blacklisting candle...
...than to darkly curse the darkness..."

[vindice]

here's an update of the goings on at our school.

We had an end-of-semester staff meeting, at which point our teachers put forth our some of our concerns (i.e. sub-par accomodation, blatant lying by management, and the general opinion that our contracts were not being adhered to).

The reaction of management was interesting. They said something along these lines:
We are trying our best to fulfill your contract, but our hands are tied because of our budget.
But you teachers are Neusoft employees, and therefore should comprimise of these issues.

They went on further to criticize us for reading our contracts so closely, and told us that we were "EVIL" because we did so.

It was only recently that we even managed to obtain copies of our contracts, as the school had told us that they only had two - one to be held by them, and one by foreign affairs. But shortly after we questioned foreign affairs directly about who is supposed to have copies, the school handed over our contracts - which were rightfully should have had long ago. It's almost as if they don't want us to learn what rights we are entitled to.

the saga continues...
(stay tuned for a plot twist)

[vindice]

New in the land of Neusoft:

One of our teachers, fed up with the continued "antics" of management, pulled a runner. He didn't come back after Spring Festival. Those of us who remain, understand his reasons. And we wish him all the best.

The majority of the teachers here will leave in June, Japanese teachers included.

Here's an excerpt of his farewell letter to the school:

I have grown tired of being compromised on my ethics
and having to constantly request what is rightfully supposed to be given
within the contract that both parties signed.
The lies and deceit have left feelings of hopelessness across the English faculty and distrust
towards our superiors. This is not an environment that I am willing to
work in. I feel like I was a good teacher that went above and beyond, and
genuinely cared for the well being of my students.

Neusoft are presently recruiting for a summer camp.
If anyone needs information about the summer camp, we can put you in touch with all the teachers who worked there last summer, so you can know the truth about everything. Just email the address in the original post.

[vindice]

Many people have been contacting us in the past few weeks wondering about Neusoft.

Here's an update:
we've had water go out on us many times during the semester.
no big deal. we can rough it every now and then.

however today we were informed that today's water-outage will be for at least 3 days, due to a f---ed up pump. All students and teachers will have to make due with flushing toilets, bathing, and washing clothes with bottled water.

If you're being recruited by neusoft, for either the summer camp or the fall semester, keep these points in mind:

1) the facilities were build by cheap prison/peasant laborers, as hastily as possible. Work was still being done for months after we moved in. We've experienced massive leakage when it rains, and water/power outages as well.
2) Re summer camp: this will be used as a probation period to see whether or not you're submissive enough to be a part of the full-time neusoft team. proceed with caution.
3) If you speak to us and get all the information about Neusoft's shady past - but for some reason, you still choose to sign with them... Then you are not dissuading them from continuing to behave like this in the future.

Saying that they have 15 foreign teachers is a big selling point for them. They do not have the resources nor the cash to handle the quantity of foreign teachers that they possess.

Bottom line: all but a few of the western teachers and all the japanese teacher as well will be leaving at the end of this semester.

[rick_martin_78]

I worked at Neusoft last year. I had a beer the other night with a guy who worked there the year before, and we got to talkin about how lousy they are. I expect they have hired a substantial portion of Christian fundamentalists, as they really hate to see their teachers have any backbone.

Anyway, I'm over it. Neusoft is in the past. But in hindsight, choosing neusoft was a mistake.

So I'm making this post so that others don't get suckered into the same job I did. Or if they've already been suckered in, at least they can be on their toes and be ready to dodge the poo that will inevitably fly their way.

Good luck to the new Neusoft crowd for this year! God bless you all!

=================================
Beef number 1: Grading our students� exams (this one is only minor)

�Fudge� (or �tamper with�) your marks to fit the bell curve. Not an entirely unheard-of practice, but a really silly one nonetheless.

No 8s or 9s (i.e. do not give grades of 58 or 59%, but instead give either a 57 or a 60%.

Neusoft�s rational was that children and/or their big scary rich influential parents will come to the English department and complain, and �we don�t want that.� Stick to quota of As Bs, Cs, Ds, etc�

NOTE: Can anyone tell me why these geniuses don�t just round to multiples of 5 (50, 55, 60, etc.)?

Beef Number 2: MOD EDIT
MOD EDIT, liason to Neusoft foreign teachers)

MOD EDITBlunder #1:

One teacher worked for Neusoft (along with many others) in a short-term summer camp in 2004. This particular teacher was a bit off the wall, and Neusoft may have been entirely within their rights to let him go (which was what they did). But the manner in which they went about firing this guy was unbelievable! Here�s a quick run through of,

How to fire an employee, Neusoft style:
1) Re-acquire his Foreign Expert Card (Red Book) and Residence Permit (Green Book). Without these, a foreigner is in a world of Chinese hurt.
2) In order to avoid arousing suspicion of the upcoming firing by requesting the Red and Green Books of this one individual teacher, instead request the Red and Green Books of ALL the foreign teachers as well. That pesky laowai won�t suspect a thing!
3) Again, in order to avoid arousing suspicion of all the foreign teachers, tell them that a foreigner has died in the city and the police are the ones requesting the Red and Green books. Not Neusoft. They won�t suspect a thing!
4) When confronted by angry foreigners about the above deception, tell them it was just a joke.
5) When angry foreigners say that joking about dead foreigners is not funny, look really sad and regretful, and promise that it won�t happen again.
6) Re-group at International Office, and prepare for next mission.

Very strange situation, and I�m not entirely sure of the reasoning behind their actions. But when your employee uses management tactics that involve whipping up lies about dead foreigners and mass city-wide visa inspection, you might consider taking a second look at your personnel choices. Am I right?

If anyone at Neusoft is reading this, pay close attention. If you lie to a foreigner when doing business, be prepared to never do business with that foreigner again. After this fiasco happened, we as teachers knew that the International Office did not have any respect for us (not that we didn�t have our suspicions already!).

MOD EDIT Blunder #2:

MOD EDIT request to pass his relative, sent via cell phone text message.
�Hey man, do me a favor pls. I have a relative�s kid in ur class. His name is MOD EDIT, Chinese name in MOD EDIT, of coz boy. His daddy phoned me he is so afraid to pass oral English exam of tonight. I was heard it is u will take this exam tonight, will you let him pass�I�ll be very appreciated what u will be done on my behalf�I�ve been thinking about when we should have beers together? Thanks for your attention. Call me if any problem��
Nuff said�


Other thoughts regarding the International Office:

MOD EDIT� the head of the International Office - says she�s been abroad, and has learned so much about Western business. What did she learn? It seems to me that she�s imposed a Chinese bullsh*t system that purposefully impedes getting things done. It�s a Hierarchical ladder-type system, designed to minimize contact and conflict between the top and the bottom by inserting an unnecessary gap between them. It just hinders productivity. Usually there�s a span of a week or two between us putting a question to the boss, and finally getting an answer. In my opinion, this is why everyone in China wants to be a boss. Everyone under you is working continually, not to solve problems, but to dilute them as they move up the ladder towards the company head. By the time they reach you (usually a week to ten days later), the problem isn�t much of a problem at all.

In a normal company, professionals work their asses off. It�s called a rat race. Here in China, higher-up professionals often enjoy privileges. Kinda like the rat�s winner�s circle after the race, where you play maj-jong in the back rooms of restaurants, carry the latest Italian leather man-purse, wear your belt near your arm-pits, enjoy top-of-the-line zhonghua ciggies, and drive a black tinted-out government-like Audi. You also shake your finger (like it�s on fire) at people who displease you, and wear really big spectacles that cover half the surface area of your face. If you�ve been in China, you know exactly what I�m talking about.

Neusoft management is no different the many other private language mills. Don�t let the �University� moniker fool you. Neusoft is, in every way, run like these private language schools, and a below-average one at that. I don�t want to sound bitter on China, cause there are some decent schools out there. Many of the Universities are ok. Much better than the private schools, for sure. Just please don�t think that Neusoft falls in the same class with the other colleges, because it really, really doesn�t. It�s the equivalent of a mid-low quality private school at best.


Other assorted beefs:

Apartment problems:
- Leaks
- Often without electricity
- Often without water
- Temperatures as low as 13 degrees celcius in winter, when city law requires 18.
- No restaurants or buses nearby (though we can�t really fault Neusoft for that).

Usually things didn�t get fixed on a timely basis. Neusoft just didn�t seem to have an accommodating attitude whatsoever. They did however respond very quickly to our complaints when we brought it to the attention of the State Bureau of Foreign Experts.

Note to anyone holding a Foreign Experts Card: The Foreign Affairs Office exists to protect your interests. If you have questions as to what your rights are, or if you feel you�re being done up the anus, feel free to pay them a visit. Most of us were of the attitude of �Yes, this is China, and nothing is perfect, blah, blah, blah,� and we left this option as a last resort. But they were very helpful indeed. For more information go to http://dalian.caiep.org/ or email [email protected].

[Roger]

In my opinion, complaints that name a school or training centre and even personnel should be more complete than what the op has supplied. FOr instance, I am curious to know what exact position he or she was hired for? What kinds of lessons she or he does? Does the OP have legal status?

These titbits of information were withheld and this makes me a little suspicious. However, there seems to be some substance to the OP's complaints as another poster made detailed points.

Let me say, though, that water outages do not give a solid enough reason
for lambasting a school. This is common even in the most developed parts of China (I lived in a brand-new high-rise for over one year, and every week we had either a water outage, a power outage or both).
As for "lying", I find this word crops up way too often in our forum. Every time you were misinformed you call it "lying"? I would be a little more economical in the use of this verb;lying presupposes INTENT to mislead, and that is not nearly always the case.

The case of raising marks is a more serious one, but I wonder how experienced you guys are? Why does nobody ever criticise the fact that TEFL newbies are given the power to attribute marks to Chinese students?
I question the wisdom of teachers acting as examinators in the first place! In a professionally-run school none of us would grade our own students' performances, full stop!
We should therefore not be surprised that parents and our superiors are trying to prevail upon us in granting their students a higher mark.

The case of this school may or may not be one of cheating the public and cheating its FTs; next time give a more well-rounded picture instead of a one-sided rant. To me, Neusoft sounds like hundreds of Chinese schools - neither too bad nor really superior, just ordinary.

[rick_martin_78]

[Mr. Kalgukshi]

Please let's not have any naming of names and no taking shots at other members because you don't happen to agree with what they have to say.

Please stay on topic and refrain from anything that will cause this thread to go bye-bye.

I deliberately did not put this in bold lettering. I'm trying. Really, I am.

[Zero Hero]

[Mideatoo]

[voodikon]

interesting. i was considering a position at chengdu neusoft (yes, that's the exact name) ... until i found out it was actually THREE HOURS outside of chengdu. (i found this out after scrounging around on their chinese web site and asking various people for translations and information.) and from the looks of things, they're having trouble recruiting: three different recruiters sent me the same position.