Job Discussion Forums

[amandabarrick]

Hello fellow teachers,
I have a complex situation and am confused about the visa. I am looking for a teaching job in Changzhou city, Jiangsu province, but all of the schools I have seen are hiring in September when the new semester begins. I will be arriving to China in May. What should i do? Should I come to China on a Tourist Visa, extend it throughout the summer, then change it to a Z visa before the semester? Is it very difficult to change a Tourist visa to a Z visa once you are in China? I have heard some teachers have done this without any problem, but I am nervous.
AB
[The cat doesn't even have thumbs Focker!]

[Roger]

I don't see any special problem, maid: what ye wanna do during all those months PRIOR to taking up your job - the answer to this will determine what kind of visa you need to obtain beofre.
Surely you can get a six month tourist visa and cruise across China, or wait a few months and come here shortly before reporting to your school?
What is the opinion of your employer? Do they sponsor you? If so, you certainly can get a work visa through them - when they need you!

[Spiderman Too]

Hi AB

When I first came to China I applied for a 3 month tourist visa in Australia (by mail) but my passport was returned with only a 1 month visa. Since being here, I�ve met quite a few Canadians who were issued with 3 month tourist visas. One fellow told me that he ticked (�checked� for my American friends) the 1 month �box� on the visa application form, yet they still gave him a 3 month visa. I know China discriminates against certain nationalities when it comes to visa fees and it might also discriminate in respect of duration.

So, you could try and get a 3 month tourist visa.

I have been told that it is relatively easy to have a tourist visa extended ONCE within China. With a 3 month visa, you would get a 3 month extension / one month visa � 1 extra month. I have been told that a good excuse is needed to get a second extension.

You may like to consider going to Hong Kong first where 6 month and 12 month �F� visas are apparently quite easy to obtain, via visa agents.

There are several threads on this forum naming the visa agents, and giving their addresses.

Alternatively, send a PM to jolly Roger; he knows Hong Kong like the back of his hand!

[Voldermort]

Like Roger said, it really depends on what you want to do in those months prior.

In most countries, to obtain a 3 month tourist visa you would have to show evidence that you only intend to stay in China for up to 3 months ie. produce a return ticket or itinerary, failing this they will always give you a 1 month visa, this also applies in Hongkong.

It is not as easy as some people make out to extend a visa once in China. The PSB in Beijing have recently introduced a new law stating that they will no longer give a 3 month tourist extention. Another fact is that you can only extend a visa 3 times. This of course changes depending which province or city you are in, and of course how much guanxi is used to do this.

My advice is to get a 6 month business (F) visa, which you can later change to a work (Z) visa.

On another note, it is quite legal to work on a business visa for a period of up to and no longer than 6 months, though you will have to research the details and legalities yourself about this.

[Roger]

Two clarifications:
EXTENSIONS: You are only eligible for an extension if you have a legal resident status, i.e. are staying at an approved hotel (look out for that plaque in the lobby that says "Approved by the PSB to house foreign tourists" or something like this!).
The PSB will NOT extend your visa if you do not stay LEGALLY, i.e. they cannot find any records of where you have spent last night!
In some locales they may be a little more cooperative; in JINGHONG, Xishuangbanna, for instance, I got an extension with no verifications done on where I was staying! This is quite unusual, though; don't make the mistake of taking this for grtanted!
However, extensions are given grudgingly, and for specific reasons: either you must travel to Hong Kong, or you are continuing your tourist jaunt. The latter reason might or might not be acceptable to some PSB! I don't believe your visa status is taken into consideratiion either: wheter you have a multiple-entry or single-entry visa, or how long it has been valid may be totally irrelevant to the PSB! Thus, in some place you might walk out with a 2 month extension, in another with a mere one month.
To substantiate my clai I would point to my experience in Jinghong: I requested a 3-month, multiple entry visa, and the receiving officer grunted agreement. A day later, I took possession of my passport with a single-entry, one month visa. The officer couldn't explain why they had not granted my wish.

The other point concerns the LEGALITY of a business visa: Most emphatically, it does NOT entitle you to work in China. It is often done and tolerated, though. Technically, there is no difference between a tourist visa and a business visa. You may even be liable to paying a tax for business transaction done on mainland soil.

[no_exit]

If you're American (like me) you may have trouble getting a tourist visa for longer than a month. Americans have more visa obstacles these days than most other nationalities.

When I was last in Hong Kong, they wouldn't give me any visa that lasted longer than one month. I had a previous F visa in my passport and I was told that if I got another F visa (a one month F visa), then after that, with 2 F visas in my passport, I could get a 6 month or 1 year F visa. I ended up just getting a regular L visa though, because I didn't figure it would matter (a school was arranging Z visa for me at the time, but that fell through).

I got that L visa extended twice in Kunming. I was told at the PSB here that there is a new regulation that allows extensions to be granted if you can provide a bank book -- proof that you have the funds to stay in China and won't end up starving to death (I showed them an account with exactly 1000RMB in it. Apparently this was adequate). I think the actual rules regarding extensions are enforced fairly arbitrarily and it depends heavily on which PSB you visit. The Kunming PSB is notorious for not granting that second extension, so I most likey just got lucky.

As for staying in an approved place ... basically you have to show the PSB your registration papers to get the extension. I'm registered as living in my apartment, not at a hotel. This didn't cause me any problems. However, my passport is literally filled with various visas from China, so it was pretty obvious to the PSB that I'm not a tourist anyhow.

Your school shouldn't have issues changing your visa from an L to a Z once you're ready to work. Most schools can do that without any problems, at least in my neck of the woods.

[amandabarrick]

I will be in China for tourist purposes starting in May and then hopefully start work at a school in September when the semester begins. I know that sounds like a long time to do nothing in China, but I need to get away. I have not yet found a school in Changzhou or signed a contract, etc... But I am hoping the school that eventually hires me can apply my Z visa before I come in May, even though I will not be starting work until September. That way I can just stay in the country under the Z visa without any hassle. I don't plan on working during the summer months, just playing. Because the U.S. only gives out 1 month tourist visas, my other option is the business (F) visa for 3 or 6 months, then changing to the Z visa in September.
I appreciate each of your comments and advice. Keep them coming.
AB

[boxcarwilly]

If you come into China with anything other than a "Z" visa and you then want a "Z" visa later, be prepared for a trip to Hong Kong or ouside of mainland China to secure the new visa. If you are lucky and can do it another way, great for you - but be prepared.

[hujiaoman]

1- No matter what kind of Visa you have while working in China, is it that Visa that also allows you to leave China? (That is, do you need a Visa to leave China as well as enter?)
2- Should I be concerned about my passport being out of my hands (and for what period of time), while my school and agency arrange my Visa to go from L to Z?

Mostly what I'm trying to figure out is, all of the posts here are scaring the hell out of me, and I'm wondering if I should be prepared for the possibility of getting the heck out of China, within my first month there, if I don't like what's going on or if I'm getting screwed over. Let me know your thoughts. Thanks.

[amandabarrick]

Yes, at the airport when leaving the country customs will check your visa and make sure it is still valid etc... They don't spend much time, but they do check to see it is there.
How long has the school had your passport? I think 1 week is enough time for them to get the Z visa, but I may be wrong.... If the worst happens and you don't get it from them, reporting it lost/stolen to your embassy and getting a new passport is possible if you have sufficient documents.
So some are saying that changing an 'F' visa or an 'L' visa to the Z visa is easy as pie, but some say it is difficult or requires trips to Hong Kong, etc...which is it???
AB

[JZer]

Hey everyone. I am also going to China. I will arrive May 27. I have a perspective job lined up with a recruiting agency. I do not have another choice since I can only spend 3 months in China. I am to finish my Master's degree from September-December. I was wondering what everyone could tell me about extending my tourist visa if the company screws me and does not offer me a Z visa!! Thanks for any help people could offer me.

[Talkdoc]

[Roger]

[Talkdoc]

[Talkdoc]

Roger, I have what I think is a great idea. See how you (and others) feel about it.

Why don't you put together a committee of all the current forum members who have been advocating moving to China, in order to teach, on L- and F-Visas. Compose a position paper. List as many advantages, as you possibly can, for doing so. It might even be useful to specify provinces that seem to have a high tolerance for illegal aliens and, especially, the names of private schools and universities that are willing to hire foreign teachers without a Z-Visa. In addition, I would hope you would consider naming specific schools that seem to have no difficulty converting L- and F- to Z-Visas after employment has commenced. At least one member of the committee should be willing to sign the post with his or her real name and contact information (in order to validate it as well as for those with specific questions in the future).

In response, I (as well as anyone else who would care to join me) will write a rebuttal explaining why I (we) think the arguments presented are species and ill-advised. I too will sign it.

After we are all in agreement that each of the statements accurately reflects are best thoughts on the issue, we can then post this position paper on the China (Job-Related Posts Only) forum for all to read and contemplate for themselves. Hopefully, the moderators will make it a "sticky" and, in the future, when Visa questions arise, all we will need to do is refer them to this single, comprehensive discussion.

How does that strike you? I hope you and others will agree because, to tell you the truth, my wrists are getting very tired and my Carpal Tunnel Syndrome is acting up again and I just can�t seem to walk away from this because I feel there is a great deal at stake for everyone involved.

Doc