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kait

Joined: 17 Jun 2004 Posts: 93 Location: Lungtan, Taiwan
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Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2005 10:29 am Post subject: I thought I was legal |
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I don't understand. I don't teach kindy. I work only with the buxiban students at my school. I have my ARC. I thought everything was above board.
However, the other day, my supervisor asked me to hide in a storage room because "the inspectors are here." Uh, ok. So, I sat in the storage closet wondering what it is that I don't know.
Any ideas? |
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TaoyuanSteve

Joined: 05 Feb 2003 Posts: 1028 Location: Taoyuan
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Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2005 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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Do you work at more than one location? If so, that may be it. You may want to take out your ARC card, walk up to a street sign on the road on which your school is located and see if any of the Chinese characters match. If not, then you know your ARC is not valid at the location at which you are working. You said you worked at Hess? The location you're at is likely a franchise. It may not be licensed and you may have an ARC that 's valid somewhere other than where you're working. Call the head office, explain what happened and ask for answers. |
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matchstick_man
Joined: 21 May 2003 Posts: 244 Location: Taiwan
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Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2005 1:48 am Post subject: |
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This happened to me the first year I was here. I was legal but I suspect it was largely due to the low amount of hours I was working. There is a legal amount. |
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EOD

Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 167 Location: Taiwan
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Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2005 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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I have an open work permit and a degree in education. I am not legal because I am working in a public school hired through a third party. |
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clark.w.griswald
Joined: 06 Dec 2004 Posts: 2056
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Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2005 12:35 am Post subject: Re: I thought I was legal |
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kait wrote: |
I don't understand. I don't teach kindy. I work only with the buxiban students at my school. I have my ARC. I thought everything was above board. |
I agree with Steve. Most likely your ARC is through an employer other than the one that you are actually working for. It is not unheard of for schools that are not registered to employ foreigners, to beg or pay an employer who is registered to help them out with this. This is of course illegal, and any school that does this is doing the wrong thing. If the school does this but lets you feel that you are fully legal then I think that you should name them.
If you are in fact working for Hess then there are two possibilities:
a. You are working at a new school that hasn't as yet processed it's licencing and regulatory procedures.
b. You are working for a school that has already met it's quota of foreign teachers (as determined by the number of enrolled students and the number of classrooms).
The easiest way to check if you are working at a school other than the one that you are permitted to work at is to pull out your ARC. You need to ensure that the Chinese name of the sponsor on your ARC is the same as the registered trading name of the school that you are working for. The registered trading name of the school should be on a certificate hung on a wall in the school. If not then it might be on a name card or D.M. etc.
In chain schools such as Hess, your ARC is not issued through Hess itself, but through the Hess school that you are working at. As such, each Hess school has it's own registered trading name, and this is the name that needs to be on your ARC. |
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Aristotle

Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 1388 Location: Taiwan
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Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2005 2:44 am Post subject: |
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Nearly all foreign teachers on Taiwan are working illegally in some way or another. The biggest problem for many of them is that they don't know or don't want to know.
If you are going to work illegally take full advantage of that fact.
No contract, no ARC and no taxes. When the inspectors come you go home.
With the current political instability on Taiwan even if your boss pays all the required bribes there still is no certainty about your job security or protection.
Welcome to Taiwan,
A. |
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TaoyuanSteve

Joined: 05 Feb 2003 Posts: 1028 Location: Taoyuan
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Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2005 4:24 am Post subject: |
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A lot of what is being discussed here is true. Yes, the name of your school as it appears on your ARC card is likely not Hess. They have a trading name different from the one that appears on the street sign. However, the street address will be the same. That is what you need to check. Aristotle has a point. There are a lot of grey areas in employment here. Quite a few-- possibly most-- foreigners are likely illegal in some respects. Mostly this has to do with the issue of working in more than one location, or a location other than the one on your card. I don't agree that fullout illegal work makes sense anymore, though.
I have the benefit of walking my dog every day with an expat who's lived here more than a decade. He's been telling me a lot obout how this place used to be and how it's changing. 10 years ago, you wouldn't have gotten an ARC card for English teaching and you would have been crazy to get one. Your Chinese school visa extension fees were lining hong baos (likely still are) and everyone was happy. It was the best way to work here. The big difference these days is Taiwan has joined the WTO and is looking for international recognition. Democracy has also been here a while as well. Rule of law is taking hold. The government agencies are still corrupt, but much less so than before. The FAP is under some pressure to show they are doing something about illegal workers. ARC now carries numerous benefits and has become the best way to work here. The other way has been getting less and less viable. Just a few of the advantages are the health insurance, abilty to legally own and license vehicles (including getting a driver's license) and entering into contracts and agreements that can only be entered into by residents. Then there is the protection of the labor laws and FAP.
Have you called your head office ? Update us if you can. |
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clark.w.griswald
Joined: 06 Dec 2004 Posts: 2056
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Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2005 2:48 pm Post subject: |
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TaoyuanSteve wrote: |
Yes, the name of your school as it appears on your ARC card is likely not Hess. They have a trading name different from the one that appears on the street sign. |
Just for clarification, I wasn't talking about the Chinese name for Hess itself, but rather the Chinese names of each of the Hess schools. Chain schools cannot just register one name and use it at all of their branches or franchise schools. They need to register a seperate Chinese trading name for each school. Often the names are quite similar, but they are not the same. Of course they use their familiar Chinese brand name on street signage etc., but they have a seperate trading name that they use for official paperwork. Anyone who works at Hess may have noticed new building signage over the last few months. This signage has the registered trading name of the school in small text, with the Hess English and Chinese names in larger print. This signage is a result of pressure from the government to more clearly show what type of school is being run i.e. short term tutorial school, or kindergarten.
It is for this reason that it is important to check the name on your ARC with the name on the wall of the school. You will not find a match for the generic Chinese name for Hess schools.
TaoyuanSteve wrote: |
However, the street address will be the same. That is what you need to check. |
I am afraid that I don't agree with this. The address of the school that you are working at is not indicated on your ARC. The address on your ARC is (or at least should be) your home address. Remember, your ARC is pretty much an ID card while you are here in Taiwan, not just an employment card. As such people want to know your home address just as they do with local ID cards, and other forms of ID back home.
I realize that sometimes schools or individuals may register with their school address which then goes on the ARC, but this is not the correct way to do things.
Like your friend I have been here for about a decade. In the past the police were able to come to your residential premises and check your ARC in much the same way that they go to schools and check ARC's. It was for this reason that you needed to ensure that you kept your residential address updated. |
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TaoyuanSteve

Joined: 05 Feb 2003 Posts: 1028 Location: Taoyuan
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Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2005 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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I was not refering to Hess in Chinese either, Clark. Also, the address (and "trade" name) of my employer is on my ARC card. I have the literacy level in Chinese necessary to read the card's entire contents. I won't say that it's the case for absolutely everybody, but my employer's address--as well as my own residential one-- is on my card, and it's on most people's I've seen.
My employer's address appears on the line 居留事由
My address appears on the line 居留地址 |
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clark.w.griswald
Joined: 06 Dec 2004 Posts: 2056
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Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2005 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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I am not going to suggest that you are wrong, as it is clear that you know what is on your card. As I am also aware as to what information is contained on an ARC, the situation becomes rather perplexing.
It is possible that things are done differently in different areas, as we all know that there are lots of such inconsistencies here in Taiwan.
居留事由 is where your employers name should go.
居留地址 is where your address should go.
I am curious however. If you have the school address listed next to 居留事由 instead of your employers name, then where is your employers name listed on your ARC. |
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TaoyuanSteve

Joined: 05 Feb 2003 Posts: 1028 Location: Taoyuan
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Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2005 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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It seems you're right Clark. I pulled out my card and read it just now and my school's name is on it and not its address. I'm not sure why I thought it was. Sorry, Kait, for any confusion. I'm afraid my earlier advice will not be much use. You'll have to know your cram school's registered name if you're to do any checking on your own. You're likely better off phoning Hess' head office to ask why you were asked to hide in a closet. Perhaps while you've got them on the phone, you could put in for a transfer(?). |
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Aristotle

Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 1388 Location: Taiwan
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Posted: Thu Jan 06, 2005 2:15 am Post subject: |
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It is possible that things are done differently in different areas, as we all know that there are lots of such inconsistencies here in Taiwan.
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Couldn't agree more.
Some people have their work address annotated on the back of the card sometimes on the front.
Some chain schools are able to get just the name of the franchise put on the ARC with no street address, allowing teachers to work at any franchise. Often the CLA gets confused and puts the wrong information on the card. Spelling and "wrong number" mistakes are common.
However any of these variations could be used as an excuse to extort bribes from your employer and have you deported if your employer doesn't pay.
Welcome to Taiwan
A. |
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kait

Joined: 17 Jun 2004 Posts: 93 Location: Lungtan, Taiwan
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Posted: Thu Jan 06, 2005 4:01 am Post subject: |
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Well, it turns out that my ARC states I work at a different Hess branch than the place I show up everyday and act like a professional/clown. So, could I get in trouble for this? It seems like I was hiding in the closet to protect my employer more than to protect myself. Right? |
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Aristotle

Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 1388 Location: Taiwan
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Posted: Thu Jan 06, 2005 4:10 am Post subject: |
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So, could I get in trouble for this? It seems like I was hiding in the closet to protect my employer more than to protect myself. Right?
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Some estimates put the number of teachers deported up as high as 200 to 300 last year. If the central government does keep records of these numbers, they aren't made public. All the deportation documents I saw for people had valid ARC information. People working without ARC's are too difficult to catch. It is much easier for the Taiwan government to issue fraudulent ARC's then deport people for unknowingly having them. Foreign teachers are a huge source of revenue in the form of bribes and extortion for government officials. Your rights and the rule of law are not their concern unless you are willing to pay them for it.
Not only could you be deported but fined and imprisoned if the authorities involved felt like doing so (enough money involved).
Welcome to Taiwan,
A.
Last edited by Aristotle on Thu Jan 06, 2005 4:50 am; edited 1 time in total |
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TaoyuanSteve

Joined: 05 Feb 2003 Posts: 1028 Location: Taoyuan
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Posted: Thu Jan 06, 2005 4:39 am Post subject: |
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kait wrote: |
Well, it turns out that my ARC states I work at a different Hess branch than the place I show up everyday and act like a professional/clown. So, could I get in trouble for this? It seems like I was hiding in the closet to protect my employer more than to protect myself. Right? |
I would think it highly unlikely that you would catch a lot of crap. This practice is so widespread that basically every chain is doing it. If anyone caught too much trouble for it, their employer would complain about everyone else doing the same thing (basically all the other schools) and the house of cards would come crashing down. However, the idea that you are working everyday in a place where you aren't legal must tick you off to some extent.
I'd probably raise some stink about the incident, if I were you. Maybe you can get a transfer to where you will be legal. You may even be able to use it as an excuse to get out of the contract and work for another company  |
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