Job Discussion Forums

[JZer]

Andy and Glenski,

Thanks for the help.

Another question, how hard is it to get a job with NOVA or AEON? I have a MA in German and Foreign Language Education, I am white, and I have lived abroad before. Is there a chance that they will think that I am not a good teacher or capable? I will be working in China for two months this summer so that I will have some experience to put on my resume when I start apply for jobs in September.

[Glenski]

[siggywiggywald]

Hi Moore,
After doing a lot of researching, trying to find the company I could save the most money with, I am starting work in March in Osaka at Aeon/Amity. Aeon pays for airfare for your return trip, they cover health insurance, your rent is subsidized, you pay your own utilities, and you make 250,000 yen per month. With all of this, and a budget that is fairly comfortable, it seems like I will probably be able to save between 6,000 and 7,000 USD this year. One thing to note though, when you arrive you don't get paid for a month and Aeon recommends that you come with 2,000 USD in your pocket.

Another thing I learned, after taking my job, is that my friend who worked for NOVA earned a sick amount of money by doing something I never considered. (Probably because I don't have enough money to float on if nothing worked out). He worked part-time for NOVA and then did a ton of tutoring on the side. He was able, obviously, to use his NOVA connections to find people who were looking for a tutor and this worked awesome for him. At Aeon though, you can't work for anyone but Aeon; so keep that in mind when your deciding.

Good luck!

[JimDunlop2]

NOVA is technically the same way -- even though many NOVA teachers do it. At NOVA, you can get in trouble (even fired) if you are seen fraternizing with students outside of the NOVA school building.

At these large chain schools, if you want to pursue teaching privately on the side, doing it quietly and discreetly is the key...

[JZer]

Glenski,

Well I do not see myself trying to create my own curriculum. I do not really have so much experience so I do not feel like I am qualified to do that. Also, I am trying to save some money to invest, so I want to be working more hours and not spending lots of hours planning lessons. I am from the U.S. My only concern is that I might not speak the clearest and am worried that it might hinder me from getting a job. The only reason I say this is that some foreigners have a hard time understanding me but then again that is in a conversation and when you teach you do not speak at the same pace as when you are conversing with someone. When I worked at an ESL summer camp last summer I never spoke more than 5 words at once and repeated things two or three times.

[Sweetsee]

I have always saved heaps and blown more, teaching in Japan.

[JZer]

Sweetsee wrote:

[Sweetsee]

Before I left after 10 years I was averaging 350,000 a month and taking 2 months off a year. My best month I made over 700,000 and near that many times.

These days I'm working less and making more, finally.

Never did NOVA but I would imagine you could supplement that income with as many privates as you'd like, I may be wrong. Back in the day I new a mate that was getting 10,000 yen for chatting to some guy on the train on the way into town, so he says. My highest private was 15,000 for 2 hours with a coffee break at the couple's Jewelry factory. They were bank.

Get after it, mate.

[JZer]

I will get after it as soon as I can. I just have to drudge through 11 more months of grad school and then I will be on my way!!! I can't wait....

[Sweetsee]

Easy there partner, I'm sure there are more than a few of us here that would gladly trade places with you, myself not included. You are now in quite possibly the best time of your life. Life is short and the finality of it becomes more apparent with age. Enjoy each day as if it were the first and the last.

Why do you want to come here and teach anyway?

[JZer]

Sweetsee,

Are you sure that you would really want to trade places? At least when you are done with work you can go home and rest in peace? At grad school, I have to teach, attend class, and spend time preparing to teach, read books in German that takes me a while. I would say most of my weeks run together, non-stop. This is not undergrad where you just party every night and your parents pay the bills!!! Of course the last 4 months in Germany have been nice. A scholarship and no work!!! Now I bet you are envious but as of February 7, it will be back to non-stop weeks. Who knows when I will see a bar again.

[Sweetsee]

You are right. I wouldn't trade places with you in a million years.

We are at opposite ends of the road, as far as efl goes. You waiting to begin and me enjoying the trappings of a cushy position after many, many years of graft, mate.

[JZer]

Sweetsee,

Well I am not looking to make a career out of this. I would just like to experience living in another foreign country. I have lived 1 and 1/2 years in Germany. I would like to experience Japan and save up to make an investment. I plan on staying four years!!! Is it possible to learn conversational Japanese in four years?

[Glenski]

This topic has deviated, but here is what someone posted about a year ago on learning / studying Japanese. If he sees this, he might want to update people on it. I'll leave out his name until he chooses to identify himself. Just remember, the bottom line is that you only learn what you put the time into studying, and while you are working FT in a foreign land that you want to experience, you are very tempted to do everything except make time to study.

Ok, here it is.
I have been in Japan for a little less than 11 months. I am currently working at NOVA's Multimedia Center in Osaka.

Ｔhere are some things you should consider. I want to offer you my own perspective in addition to reiterating what has already been said by others.

When you get home from work, you will likely be quite tired and in the mood for a beer or for just going to bed. When you get into this routine, it is quite easy to put off studying until "tomorrow." When you work at an eikaiwa with a regular schedule, every day is essentially the same. The same number of classes, the same working hours, the same low-level English conversations, and the same tired or resigned demeanor when it's time for you to punch out and go home. "Tomorrow" will keep coming and going and before you know it, you will have been here for three or four months and will still be vowing to study "tomorrow" even though you're frustrated and disappointed. So if you really want to study Japanese, you have to break this inertia somehow and force yourself to study.

What does this mean?

This means you choose to study Japanese even though your friends are out boozing up and singing karaoke. I'm not saying don't have fun; I'm saying you have to prioritize.

This means you choose to study Japanese if you are lucky enough to get a free period at work. Most of the other teachers spend their 40-50 minutes of free time gossiping or cracking jokes about their students or what happened when they went to the bar the night before.

Prepare to be isolated from your coworkers and other foreign peers. They may ostracize you for being "high on Japan" or "hardcore" or "wannabe Japanese" or whatever. And because you're living in a foreign country, you're going to want to rely on the "support network" they provide, even if they are disingenuous, for the simple fact that they are foreigners too. So you may not devote as much time to studying as you would ideally like to or should simply because you're lonely and dealing with culture shock.

I came to Japan with only some basic knowledge of grammar (only the present and past tenses), all the hiragana/katakana, and about 75 kanji. Now I'm up to about 600-700 kanji and am able to hold a fairly interactive conversation in Japanese. I can do more than order food at a restaurant or ask when the last train leaves. I would estimate that my Japanese ability places me somewhere between 3-kyu and 2-kyu (I want to take 2-kyu of the JLPT this winter). But I didn't get there by hanging out with my friends after work four nights a week or watching the BBC or CNN in my room and renting English videos.

I got it by isolating myself and enduring occasional ridicule from other teachers whose Japanese ability is limited to "biiru kudasai." I got it by going to bars and restaurants that foreigners usually don't go to and striking up conversations with the bartenders and the regulars. I got it by taking the handbills people distribute on the street and trying to understand the kanji written on them even though I obviously could care less about the product they were advertising. I got it by watching Japanese television and only being able to pick up isolated words and phrases. I got it by riding the subway around Osaka just so I could get free listening practice as the subway approached each stop. I got it by striking up random conversations with the Japanese staff members at my job and asking them what various kanji mean.

Validation of your progress with the language comes in unexpected ways. I remember one time a few months when I decided to venture into a tiny izakaya by myself for the first time. The menu was entirely in Japanese, with the kanji written in cursive strokes, thus making them even more difficult to read. The waitress and the cook were obviously very shocked to see me, and I am confident their English ability was limited to "hello" and "thank you." But I looked at that menu and was able to recognize a few items, and I was even able to ask the waitress what various entrees contained. And I was able to successfully order something I liked, much to my relief as well as that of the waitress and the cook. To me, that was more than enough validation for me to realize that I am indeed progressing with this language and that the approach I have to it is working. Now I'm a regular customer at the izakaya and the cooks regularly talk with me about many different subjects.

I now consider myself to be fairly self-sufficient with this language. I can make out the gist of unfamiliar conversations, I can understand the most important points of any official correspondence I receive, I can tell when other customers in a restaurant are talking about me, and I am able to look up the meanings of various unfamiliar kanji without knowing their hiragana translations of them. And I've become friends with some Japanese who speak no English at all and am able to talk about enough things and understand them well enough for the friendship to survive in a meaningful capacity. But I won't lie--it hasn't been easy.

Japanese is not a language that you can approach in a lukewarm fashion. And you won't learn the language if you don't USE the language. You won't use Japanese if you're hanging out with your fellow English teachers after work. You won't use Japanese if you're reading an English newspaper and watching English movies. You won't use Japanese if you're drinking at the bar with your coworkers. You won't use it if your Japanese girlfriend only speaks to you in English. You really have to force yourself to stick with it.

If you have never undertaken foreign language study before, you may be unfamiliar with how languages are acquired. You may retain a lot of new information easily at first. But then there comes a time when your brain will feel "full" and your Japanese may actually regress a bit. But you have to be patient with yourself and keep trying before you're able to retain more information. And then you'll plateau again...So be prepared.

My goal is not to become a translator. I would, however, like to pass Level 2 of the JLPT this year. Your experience in Japan would be MUCH more rewarding if you have some language ability to assist you. The Japanese will treat you quite differently too. The whole country will open up to you in a way it can't for those who can't speak or understand the language.

Before you come to Japan, I would recommend that you at least learn the hiragana and katakana. They are fairly easy to pick up (I personally had more difficulty with the katakana, as several of the characters look alike) and will allow you to write down every word in Japanese. Romaji (that is, the letters you see in this post) is rarely used here except for a few street signs and maps in larger cities. So at least learn the hiragana/katakana scripts first. There are only about 45 of each. Mastering these will allow you to write down every word in Japanese. Then learn some of the most basic kanji (numbers, days of the week, basic verbs, etc.).

And lastly, if you're only going to stay in Japan for about a year, let me tell you something important. It's not necessary for you to endure the torture of trying to learn 1000 kanji if you will only be in Japan for a short period. I'm all for ambition and the desire to try and fit in with the locals. But you have to be practical. And realistic. I want to speak fluently too. But I'm patient. Walk before you can run. And don't be too hard on yourself when you find that this language just doesn't "click" with you sometimes. Even I have my "dekiru/dekinai" (can do/can't do) days. I'm not where I want to be just yet, but I'm much further down the road than when I first got here last summer.

[PAULH]