|
Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
BCopeland
Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 24
Location: Damascus, Syria
|
 Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:24 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| calsimsek wrote: |
Let me be the first to welcome you,  BCopeland. Don't worry about the money thing. If your kids are old enough your wife might want to work then you will do well. No part of Ist can compare with some areas in Cario or other middle east towns. If your like me and want to be in a stress free relaxed area, then you should set up in the Kadikoy area. Yes prices are high but the living is good. Without question you know more about the place then alot of people who have come over. One thing Turks in general don't like Arabs. So don't find to many similarities.
Good luck and keep us poasted. |
Thanks, I know what you mean regarding the Turks opinion on the Arabs. A lot of bad blood historically!
However, I will take your advice and look at the Kadikoy area as well as many others. I guess that we have been in the Arab world so long that my wife's jaw dropped when she saw Istanbul. Even some of the worst Istanbul neighborhoods can become havens compared to Egypt. Not to mention, that I was a student in Cairo in the dormitories. Let me tell you, it doesn't get worse than that!!!
B. Copeland |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ghost
Joined: 30 Jan 2003
Posts: 1693
Location: Saudi Arabia
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2005 5:52 pm Post subject: Arabic question |
|
|
It would be interesting to learn which methods were used and the length of time it took Copleland to learn Arabic.
And does fluent Arabic refer to the street vernacular or the classic mode (modern standard arabic).?
At the Dept. of Islamic Studies, McGill University, students take many years to master spoken arabic. They learn to write it pretty quickly, and within one year produce essays in M.S.A. but the spoken part is the bit which takes many years to master.
At the Islamic Studies Dept. students make much more rapid progress in both Farsi and Turkish which are both more "user friendly" in comparison with Arabic.
Comments from Copeland would be received with interest.
Also: Arabic language Instructors are sought at the Institute in September. Contact ghost for more details. Study for an M.A. and Ph.D at the same time.
McGill University, Institute of Islamic Studies, Montreal, Canada.
Go to: McGill University. Job postings. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
31
Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 1797
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2005 10:03 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Some crap business he is in that they cannot afford to provide him with the basics. Even a tefl job could sort him out with the a shared dump.
Why the secrecy?
Why is he asking for help here if he is not a tefler?
Does his employer who presumably have an office in Syria et al not have ANY info about Ist? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
31
Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 1797
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2005 10:08 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| molly farquharson wrote: |
Time to jump in... If you are going to live in Fatih, my understanding is that the rents there are cheaper than some other places. However, rents in istanbul have been rising at a rapid rate, so even $400 is on the way low side. You can buy new furnishings on payments if you get a Turkish someone to sign for you. Sometimes the landlord will have extra furniture around. Also, there are lots of places that sell used furniture,
Great Molly. How you all live.
which is fairly cheap, though I would recommend new beds
????????????????????????????????????????????????????
With kids it will be easier to meet the neighbours and I thin
k they would be very helpful once they got over their curiosity. Fatih is a rather conservative neighbourhood, but I imagine you are used to that in Damascus (Turks pronounce it Sham, BTW). |
Like he doesn`t know that.
ET forever |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
31
Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 1797
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 3:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
[quote="Bahcevan"]BCopeland-
I think you can definitely do it with the 1500 USD per month, and
subsidized housing. Disregard the usual naysayers, who disregard the fact
that on the local earning scale (i.e. compared to what Turks earn) , you
will be earning well above most ordinary locals. Since you will earn more
than most Turks, who obviously live their lives on that amount of money,
you should be able to make it, provided that you take a few basic
precautions:
By the same logic the average wage in Bangladesh is 40 dollars a month so could you and a wife and 2 kids live on 80 dollars a month? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BCopeland
Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 24
Location: Damascus, Syria
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 4:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
In response to your comments, it took me roughly 6 months to start speaking the Arabic language with full fluency in about one year. This is due to the fact that I lived in Egypt for 3 years, Jordan for about 2 months, and Syria for about 5 years now.
Yes I speak fluently and you probably wouldn't know the difference if I spoke to you ghost or another arab. I also understand both the Egyptian & Levantine vernacular in addition to classical Arabic. Including works like "Qatr An-Nada", "Sharh Ibn Aqil", & "Awdah-Al Masalik" if your familiar with these titles. In short, hardwork is what it took to learn the Arabic language.
Also, there is a big difference in learning a language second hand in a country that doesn't speak it than it is to learn it to live by. Not to mention, that my course of study was in complete Arabic(i.e. lectures, term papers, etc.).
And to 31, your negative comments are not needed here. Everybody here has been gracious enough to voice their opinions without the negativity even if they disagree. Number one, I don't work for a crap company! Number two, they are doing footwork on their end to legitimize everything for me to be there including living. I haven't fully accepted their offer due to the fact that I want to research this decision before I make it.
Details of this type are coming to light everyday as the more inquiry is being sought, which means they very well may be taking care of housing as well. I was a bit proactive in coming here to wade the waters before just accepting a position without doing the research. I do have children and a wife you know!
However, to everyone else that has been cordial enough to answer my questions without the sarcasm...thank you very much!
B. Copeland |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BCopeland
Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 24
Location: Damascus, Syria
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 4:16 pm Post subject: |
|
|
In response to your comments, it took me roughly 6 months to start speaking the Arabic language with full fluency in about one year. This is due to the fact that I lived in Egypt for 3 years, Jordan for about 2 months, and Syria for about 5 years now.
Yes I speak fluently and you probably wouldn't know the difference if I spoke to you ghost or another arab. I also understand both the Egyptian & Levantine vernacular in addition to classical Arabic. Including works like "Qatr An-Nada", "Sharh Ibn Aqil", & "Awdah-Al Masalik" if your familiar with these titles. In short, hardwork is what it took to learn the Arabic language.
Also, there is a big difference in learning a language second hand in a country that doesn't speak it than it is to learn it to live by. Not to mention, that my course of study was in complete Arabic(i.e. lectures, term papers, etc.).
And to 31, your negative comments are not needed here. Everybody here has been gracious enough to voice their opinions without the negativity even if they disagree. Number one, I don't work for a crap company! Number two, they are doing footwork on their end to legitimize everything for me to be there including living. I haven't fully accepted their offer due to the fact that I want to research this decision before I make it.
Details of this type are coming to light everyday as more inquiry is being sought, which means they very well may be taking care of housing as well. I was a bit proactive in coming here to wade the waters before just accepting a position without doing the research. I do have children and a wife you know!
However, to everyone else that has been cordial enough to answer my questions without the sarcasm...thank you very much!
B. Copeland |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BCopeland
Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 24
Location: Damascus, Syria
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 4:20 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Sorry about the double post, my computer went a bit screwy!
B. Copeland |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bahcevan
Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 39
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 5:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| 31 wrote: |
By the same logic the average wage in Bangladesh is 40 dollars a month so could you and a wife and 2 kids live on 80 dollars a month? |
-------------------------------
Yes, genius, that's right. Because if you live like the locals do
(at the same level of expenditure), but earn much more than they
do- the math will add up. Especially with subsidized housing,
and a family who is used to living near the local standards in
Egypt and Syria.
MOD EDIT |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ghost
Joined: 30 Jan 2003
Posts: 1693
Location: Saudi Arabia
|
| Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2005 1:59 am Post subject: Language woes |
|
|
| Quote: |
| In response to your comments, it took me roughly 6 months to start speaking the Arabic language with full fluency in about one year. This is due to the fact that I lived in Egypt for 3 years, Jordan for about 2 months, and Syria for about 5 years now. |
Your response is rather confusing. The first part - one reads that you attained fluency in 6 months to one year, only to read on and learn that this may have been preceded by 8 years of living in other Arabic speaking countries.
One can assume, therefore, that it took you more than 8 years of practice before attaining the coveted fluency in Arabic, and that figure would seem more realistic, because, from what ghost has observed, at the McGill University Islamic Studies Department, and other places, students generally find it takes a long time of assiduous study to make headways in Arabic.
And Arabic is not a language that you will just pick up by living in the country for many years (as might be the case with languages like French, Spanish and Italian). To master Arabic, all the experts say - it takes years and years of dedicated study and practice. And that is why many foreigners who teach in Arab countries simply decide to leave things as they are and live in English, and leave Arabic to the natives. Sad, but true. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BCopeland
Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 24
Location: Damascus, Syria
|
| Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2005 10:13 am Post subject: Re: Language woes |
|
|
| ghost wrote: |
| Quote: |
| In response to your comments, it took me roughly 6 months to start speaking the Arabic language with full fluency in about one year. This is due to the fact that I lived in Egypt for 3 years, Jordan for about 2 months, and Syria for about 5 years now. |
Your response is rather confusing. The first part - one reads that you attained fluency in 6 months to one year, only to read on and learn that this may have been preceded by 8 years of living in other Arabic speaking countries.
One can assume, therefore, that it took you more than 8 years of practice before attaining the coveted fluency in Arabic, and that figure would seem more realistic, because, from what ghost has observed, at the McGill University Islamic Studies Department, and other places, students generally find it takes a long time of assiduous study to make headways in Arabic.
And Arabic is not a language that you will just pick up by living in the country for many years (as might be the case with languages like French, Spanish and Italian). To master Arabic, all the experts say - it takes years and years of dedicated study and practice. And that is why many foreigners who teach in Arab countries simply decide to leave things as they are and live in English, and leave Arabic to the natives. Sad, but true. |
I don't agree. Arabic is not as difficult as one would think. I think that it is a common myth that Arabic is so difficult. In fact, considering the rules of grammar that stay pretty constant, learning to speak becomes a bit easier. Like fitting the pieces of a puzzle together.
I lived abroad for a total of 8 years, this does not mean that the full 8 years I spent learning the language and certainly not to attain fluency. In fact it took me only a year to start speaking well enough to enter regular college level coarses. This means that learning the Arabic language for me was a prerequisite to being able to study what I really wanted which was Islamic Studies. I was a student at Cairo's Al-Azhar University.
Sure Arabic can be difficult when learning in the middle of Canada or the Americas without any constant practice of the language. However, that is why I opted to come abroad and start from here in order to use the language on a constant basis.
Not to mention, that most university programs for the acquisition of Arabic language in the western world stink! Not fact, just my opinion. I would constantly meet fullbrighters that would come over for a semester after I had been there for a year that wouldn't no much practical Arabic. I would constantly think that these guys would be paying their universities an arm and a leg to end up not really learning the language very well.
Language emersion is the name of the game, and no better place to do that than in a country who's first language is the language being sought, which was in my case Egypt!
Don't believe the hype, fluency in Arabic language is not that hard!!!
B. Copeland |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BCopeland
Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 24
Location: Damascus, Syria
|
| Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2005 10:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
Just to clarify ghost, I knew nothing of the Arabic language before coming abroad. I started learning the language once I got here.
Perhaps you understood that I lived abroad for 8 years then started to learn the language. No, in fact, I started to learn the language after I got here.
Like I said, I was a student at Cairo's Al Azhar University which conducted studies in all Arabic language. If I wanted to learn and continue in the university, I had to learn the language. Sink or swim sort of mentality! However to reiterate, I did not live abroad for 8 years then decide to pick up the language!
B. Copeland |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
31
Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Posts: 1797
|
| Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2005 3:14 pm Post subject: abuse |
|
|
| Bahcevan wrote: |
| 31 wrote: |
By the same logic the average wage in Bangladesh is 40 dollars a month so could you and a wife and 2 kids live on 80 dollars a month? |
-------------------------------
Yes, genius, that's right. Because if you live like the locals do
(at the same level of expenditure), but earn much more than they
do- the math will add up. Especially with subsidized housing,
and a family who is used to living near the local standards in
Egypt and Syria.
Otuzbir, you seem to like to nitpick over trivial details...
You must be a real pleasure to spend time with in person.
You have 24 hours to delete your abusive post or I will report you to the moderator.
Did you leave your home country, or were you driven out? |
Bahcivan
You have 24 hours to delete your abusive post or I will report you to the moderator. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
calsimsek
Joined: 15 Jul 2004
Posts: 775
Location: Ist Turkey
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2005 9:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
This has nothing to do with you BCopeland. Some of our friends here have to much time on there hands and have used your thread to have ag at each other.
Cool off one and all. live and let live.
Question to you BCopeland, you said I think ( might be wrong ) that ghost was an Arab. How do you know this. I would ask ghost but he never reponds to direct questions. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BCopeland
Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 24
Location: Damascus, Syria
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2005 11:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
No, I wasn't saying that ghost was an arab. I think the wording just didn't come out right.
However, I have no idea if ghost is an arab or not. I just wanted to let him know that if he heard me speak the arabic language, he might just think that I'm an arab! This was in regards to the fluency in arabic question.
It wasn't my intention to insult anybody if my words were misunderstood!
B. Copeland |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
