Job Discussion Forums

[mirabelle]

i have one semester of experience teaching university kids. you'd think this would make class teaching easier, but if anything, this semester i wanted to spend more time focusing on studying chinese and i'm already burnt out on teaching (when i got here at least everything was a novelty at first). so, i'm still trying my best. but this oral english class of mutant engineering/physics/mathematics students i had tonight....

i started off with a brief introduction of myself and divided them up into groups. since it was the first class thought we'd start class off talking about the sorts of activities, excercises etc. they had in previous oral english lessons (what they liked, didn't) for maybe half an hour and from there talk about the class, expectations and all that stuff. i split them up into groups and let them discuss (alone they're pretty hopeless). immediately i had an uprising on my hands.

a bunch of physics/engineering students sat in a corner not talking to each other. i asked them if there was any problem and one student spoke up to say they didn't know each other. "maybe you could introduce yourselves to each other." "No. it is not that. this is boring. we need some girls to make it more interesting. there are no girls in our group." other groups seemed to be talking and figuring out what to say in english.
when it came time to talk:
one student said he said something to say, and he professed his love for china, his willingness to die for china, his commitment to studying hard so he could contribute to the motherland and also, in case anyone was wondering, he would not rest until china was number one in the world.
i called on another girl. she didn't understand anything. she was just someone's girlfriend sitting in on the class.
"our other foreign teacher took us all to KFC and paid for our dinner, and also, we could not discuss anything because there were no girls in our group." [blatant lie!]
"this is a bad format for the class."
"This is what we should do, and it includes watching the movies and then playing some games."
"Maybe we should not do this activity, maybe we can have a topic and you can give us an opinion...."
[this is only supposed to be a brief activity...]
last semester i started the first class off with a game and they complained games were for babies. my other classes are much more easygoing. part of it is definitely that i don't want to waste my life thinking of intricate lesson plans or try to please them. part of it is that i am burnt out (and who isn't though) but mainly i just don't want a headache this semester, these classes aren't always taken so seriously by students or admins, so i have no idea what's wrong with these engineering kids. some of the kids in the class i think are serious about learning, but they didn't get the activity at all (which was only supposed to be 30 minutes or so ) even though i explained to them it was just to get a sense of what their previous experiences were like. anyway, even though i don't want to dedicate my life to making up lesson plans, i still have no idea how to set up my lessons with them (no training,learn as yo go here).
um. help????

[Brian Caulfield]

Your class lacks structure . OK here are some ideas . Make up cards with the names of famous Chinese . On the cards you write things like
Yao Ming age 27 , ocupation air traffic controller , marital status single
hobbies eating at Macdonalds . You give each stutent one of these cards with a famous person name and have them introduce themselves to someone in the class . You then have them work in a group of four people they them must introduce the other person. "This is Yoa Ming he is from Shanghai and works as an air traffic controller ,,,,,,,,,"
This is good practice for them because they all have problems with he and she . You make them fill in a form with three other people and their occupations hobbies age and marital status on it . This is how you check their attendance .
If the class is small a good ice breaker is write five questions on the board Like what is my chinese name ? What do I like to do ? What do I like to eat ? What is my lucky number ? Anything You then elicit the answers from the class . Give them three guesses and then supply the answer . You then pair students nd have them guess the answers for each other . When they have finished tell them to go talk to the person and see how many they guessed . You then have them introduce each other to the class.
It's classroom dynamics . Get them out of their seats and talking to other students . You provide an opportunity for them to talk to the cute girl or hansome guy with the new car .
Group work at the beginning always flops . And before you do it you must make and assessment of their abilities . You want the good students in a group and the poor students in a group and the so so in a group and then you must give them work they can handle .

[hesterprynne]

I agree with you that these students ought to more interested in their own education and more motivated. Failing that, go to the bogglesworld website to the survival English section, which has many roleplays which are extremely structured and teach them many things, probably more than any textbook you have. Search for additional roleplays in the archives. Never let them do any of these roleplays face-to-face. Make them do them back-to-back, so that they must listen to each other. Walk around like a cop, saying "Bu yao kan kan!!!" each time they try to talk to each other face-to-face. Do one of the roleplays every other class or so. Follow the instructions to the letter, doing the prep exactly as written. After you have done several of these, begin to write your own, based on the class material.
Sit down and write a list of everything you know they don't know and all the errors they make in their speech and writing. Begin by teaching corrections for these. Do a google search for "error transfer esl mandarin" for suggestions. Of course they will tell you they know all these things. Fine- test them- with graded tests- and they will suddenly discover that they are all making the same mistakes they have been making throughout their entire English studying career. Be specific and be organized. Give them small, easy goals, and show them their improvement as they go. I posted some games for another OP recently- search my most recent posts. Games are fine if they legitimately teach something which students were unable to learn by other methods. Take written suggestions from these students as to what they want to learn and how they want to learn it. Do it once, then you are the boss. Subsequent complainers may be referred (sp?) to the original requests!

[limits601]

Lock them all in a room and set them on fire. I think you would be doing them a favor.

[Mydnight]

I agree with Brian totally about the structure, but don't blame yourself totally for their lack of motivation. There are some other factors that play into this equation that may or may not have anything to do with you.

1. Did they have a foreign teacher before you?

If they did, what was the style of his/her classes and how was the relationship with the students. If he/she did very little with the class before, the students will expect the same treatment from you...that is, you should only play with them and let them watch movies like the other teacher did. Remember, the Chinese aren't the most adaptable of people and they don't take change well. I came upon this problem once in a primary school and it ended up that I just let them watch movies for the rest of the term because their behavior was beyond redeemable and their English was so poor. Their other teacher just stood there and yacked at them for 10 minutes then would just let them do what they want for the rest of the class. My intregity you ask? Let's just say that the administration used us solely for PR and could care less.

2. What do their other teachers think about FTs and their classes.

Worked in a school where some of the teachers told my students that they could do whatever they wanted in my class because my class was useless due to the fact that exam scores only mattered in their education. If some of the admin and other teachers dislike FTs, this can seep through to your class.

3. Is it a real University or a waste of space storage facility for kids that are destined to become garbage collectors because the system gave up on them?

I work in a "Vocational School" right now teaching a bunch of kids that are going to factory workers, inevitably. They are the remainders. When no where else will take them, this school will; for a fee. It's a pity...some of them are quite smart and capable.


I'm just saying, don't be too hard on yourself and keep trying. Remember the style of education they are used to: Teacher talks, students shut up and listen.

[Roger]

If I was burnt out I wouldn't want to face a Chinese univesity class for a lesson that you described as "oral English"... I wonder whether you have lost the fire that you must have had before. In this profession you need stamina and enthusiasm.
I have had too long a holiday and was literally missing classes - and my class took off very well.
But then again, I don't think it is a good idea giving students many options in what they can choose for me to do with them. They are used to being ordered around. They are not used to making up their own minds. GIve them 2 options - and they will waver until you suggest a third one...

Perhaps you should think of what they need rather than what they want. Their answers - "I want a girl in my group" - sound rather puerile to me. They don't normally approach opposite sexes in class. They were pulling your leg!

Have you assessed their needs yet? Too large a class? But it is absolutely necessary to know where they stand in English!
Here is an activity that might add a little life to your class: force them to copy texts that you have placed on your desk. Require them to walk to your desk, memorise as much as possible, then walk back and jot it down.
You can ask them to form groups and to practise cooperative writing with several guys acting as messengers that walk back and forth and dictate to the writer in their group the English text; one can then proofread it.

This has various advantages: first of all, students get to move around, and for students this no doubt is a novel and inspiring way.
Second, you can test their memory, which adds fun too.
Third, you can force them to note the qualitative differences between their different groups' performance: who finishes first? Whose text has the most/least mistakes?

At the end of such an exercise you can have any sort of discussion.

As for group formation: ask 5 boys or 5 girls to come to the front, then they choose their partners. They must choose an appropriate number of girl and boy students.

Works always pretty well for me. For pronunciation practice, you can have them read aloud their texts. You can choose riddles, newspaper articles, short poems, jokes, short stories...
Just make sure they have something to do, and they get your feedback on their performance.

[NorbertRadd]

The suggestions given are outstanding, also check the idea cookbook here, lastly take a deep breath and remember: he who laughs last, laughs best.
Try to see the humor in it. They'll still be saddled with their poor language skills after you've moved on. And they'll be penalized via lack of opportunity, return customers, or the inability to reach the highest heights because they can't get their stuff into the journals and have no one to write for them! Pity the poor schmucks.
1. Years back I was at a convention in San Francisco and this guy mumbled through a speech in front of a 1000 folks, put some illegible transparencies on the overhead projector and I doubt a single person listened because everyone stopped listening and started talking with each other. What was most sad was that he seemed the only guy with a thing to say but my technical background was too low to understand everything.
2. I had a gig as a tech writer in Taipei and witnessed 7 project managers give presentations and demonstrations in English. I was writing about the projects and couldn't understand my team members!