Job Discussion Forums

[MsJana]

Has anyone ever heard of the Santana (English) School in Zhuhai? The employer's name is Johnson and I have spoken with him through email and over the phone for a job vacany. I have been trying to dig up information on the school but only found one review. Check this out: http://www.eslcafe.com/jobinfo/asia/sefer.cgi?display:1014950673-10188.txt

This was written in 2002 and was bad review..but doesn't really go into details.

He sounds like he needs teachers and has told me he has 8 (I think) foreign teachers at the school at present and offered one contact (head of the foreign teachers department) to me. I'm waiting for his reply. In the meantime, if anyone has ever heard of this school, or know anyone who might, please post in this thread.

He's offering 5000RMB for 88 hours per month. Accomodation (2 bedrooms, living room, kitchen, blacony, ac, furniture) and flight is reimbursed. One year contract. I asked him about the work visa, and he told me that I could get a tourist one here and then he will change it to a work visa. Medical certificate will be done in Zhuhai as well. Sound good?

I appreciate any comments and help. Thanks!

[cujobytes]

They're an excellent school, I'll tell Johnson not to hire you whatever he does.

[MsJana]

Thanks Cujobytes!

What makes the school excellent?

I have checked if the school is blacklisted but it does not appear to be.

Recently, I found really bad review on The Royal Language School which wanted me to teach at their school (well, only 2) that went into extensive details.

If it wasn't for some of these helpful sites on school reviews and blacklists, I don't know what I would do.

[Volodiya]

What happened to your stated plan to work for four months, then return to finish your degree? You planning on stiffing this, "Johnson", and quit at the end of the four months?

Or, are you planning to get a Z visa, in country (which, without a degree, may prove to be impossible, and you'll find yourself working illegally)?

Not wishing to discourage you in the least, do you (or your parents) have deep enough pockets to save you if you have a "meltdown" in China, for any reason? With the degree completed, you'd have a shot at a legal job in China, with all the usual benefits, including a Z visa before you leave home, which, as I recall, is where all your inquiries to this forum began.

[cujobytes]

The reason I wouldn't recommend any school hire you is that no matter the school, I think you are the type of person who would be writing bad reports on them. Reading your previous posts I honestly don't believe you are mature enough to cope with living in China, I think you would have unrealistic expectations and would be a complaining whining pain in the butt.
I personally know the operators of Santana and the teachers there, they generaly treat their staff well, pay on time, take care of paperwork issues (Visa's etc.) promptly and provide reasonable accomodations. I also know they are in a bind at the moment and need teachers, but I still wouldn't recommend you. Did you tell Johnson you only want a 4 month gig ?

To the previous poster, getting the Visa changed to a Z visa in Zhuhai isn't a problem, and if it becomes one it's a matter of walking over to Macau or a 1 hour pleasant ferry ride to Hong Kong. Zhuhai is extremely convenient.

[MsJana]

In all honesty, I am not on this thread to do any harm. The moderators also understand this.

The employer understands that I am only working for 4 months. I have not lied to him at all. I have no intention of lying to him. All I want is to experience China. The reason why I want to go to to Zhuhai is because it is located in Guangdong, the province where my parents were born in and I have some relatives who will also be visiting in the summer. My parents also have some friends still in Canton city in Guangdong.

Zhuhai looks like a gorgeous city. I am not one to bad mouth about schools but only to look for feedback.

Please do not base your conclusions about me from a forum. I am not a bad person. You teachers here seem genuinely nice and helpful and I only plan to be the same in return. I am very sorry if I have been disrespectful in the past.

If you want, you can meet me when I arrive in Zhuhai, you will see and meet the real me. A little frustration did get to me before and I deeply apologize for it.

Yes I am naive but only because I put a lot of trust in others. I like to see the best in each opportunity and each person.

I am hardworker and although I am young, I do present myself with maturity in person because that is the real me. All I ask is for a chance.

[cujobytes]

I would be very interested to meet you if you get to Zhuhai, but be aware that in Zhuhai you are not experiencing the real China but the polished version.

[MsJana]

Please also don't base your judgments on me simply posting on the forums. The only way to really know a person is to meet face to face over a period of time to witness a consistent personality.

I really do love wroking with kids. They're full of energy and a lot of fun! I have a litttle sister myself and I have taught and volunteered with children in the past. I am by no means wanting to go overseas to pocket money. Money is not an issue for me at this point. I really want to go for the experience and to teach. This is why I have decided to go to China and not work in Canada (where I am now) because it is not about the money but the experience.

[Roger]

I happen to know Judy, owner of ROYAL ENGLISH in Zhuhai, and am a little surprised that she should have been reviewed negatively. On one hand, I tend to agree that her working conditions do not necessarily satisfy the greedier among us (apparently in the majority, especially in Guangdong); but I had a most pleasant impression from discussions with her and with her then French teacher who was a French national; he was very fond of her and of his job (and I asked him in French, which Judy couldn't understand). To put it in his vernacular "cette ecole est vachement bien".

As for SANTANA, I don't know them in person (nor do I know Mr Johnson), but again I feel the bad reports originate with bad people of whom we have an unfair number among the forumites.

You must understand that a 4 month contract is not a regular thing, and asking a training centre to employ you for such a period of time is asking for a FAVOUR. In this case, you should do as they ask you to do: come to Zhuhai on a tourist visa, pass a probation period and get a work visa in Zhuhai.
I know some regulars disagree with me over this; the regulations are that you should have a work visa from day one. True - but in your case a school is unlikely to agree that 4 months is worth the risk of making a poor investment in a foreign national's work visa (including medical exam).
If you have "bad luck" with SANTANA you can, perhaps, move on to another place either in Zhuihai or in Guangdong at large.

[Plan B]

After hanging in the right circles, I get a general impression for what Santana is like.

It belongs to a small group of private language mills which include English First, Santana, TPR, and the "F" school - which I will not comment on further in case I purjure myself. There are also two "total immersion" schools in the city, and numourous kindergartens and public schools.

Out of the five private language mill schools, the pick of the lot at the moment is somewhat surprisingly probably English First - good money and a great DoS, but in each of the schools, you can fully expect to find yourself working 6 days a week - occassionally 7 (taking into account promotional activities), and each will attempt to be as tight as possible with the coffers - don't expect to walk into a nuturing supportive environment.

The Santana teachers I have met seem relatively content, and although I have heard cases of contractual holiday days not being honoured, everyone seems to get paid on time, and the atmosphere seems supportive.

Doesn't someone on the forum called Timmo work at Santana? Maybe I'm getting confused.

[Spiderman Too]

Santana's employment contract is transcribed below.

[Pepsi-Bones]

Interesting thread. Seems like MsJana may have had a lucky escape. Below is the Santana Contract and details of how many teachers at Santana have had theirs violated since May - when MsJana first posted.

Johnson actually isn't the owner of the School. He is the Vice Principal (in fact a meaningless position - as Johnson holds little authority and commands even less respect apparently from his expatriate staff) The Principal is a Mr Jiao - but the real eminence grise is Mrs Lio - a businesswoman with no background in education....(surprise, surprise)

EMPLOYMENT CONTRACT

SANTANA ENGLISH SCHOOL, ZHUHAI, CHINA, hereafter referred to as �School� and__________________________________ hereafter referred to as �Teacher�, do in a spirit of friendly cooperation, agree to sign this contract and pledge to conscientiously abide by all conditions and obligations stipulated within

As you will soon see, the spirit of friendly co-operation isn�t taken seriously by Santana. Numerous articles in this contract were ignored and broken by them. This School is operating illegally for reasons which will be explained below. Santana isn�t the only School whose operations are arousing the interest of The Zhuhai PSB, Labour Ministry and Police. Fountain School and TPR appear to be in the same boat. My advice to anyone wanting to work for Language Schools in Zhuhai is :- Don�t. You will be laying yourselves open to exploitation by people who don�t give a damn about you or Education or for that matter The Law. You will also run the risk of falling foul of the Local Authorities. You have been warned!!!

1. CONTRACT PERIOD AND PAYMENT
1.1 The period of service will be from _________to _______.The first one month of the contract period will be a probation period. The school has the right to cancel the contract if the teacher is fails to meet school requirements after the probation period.

This clause allows the School to exploit teachers. Technically the School could employ teachers during a busy period (for example Summer School) rake in money and then fire the teacher on the flimsiest of pretexts.

1.2 The monthly salary will be paid in cash before 15th the following month.

Sadly for teachers at Santana, pay has not been punctual. On at least three occasions when staff have gone to get wages, the bursar has contrived to be absent as her �daughter was sick�. The same excuse was given every time. Not only does Admin at Santana have apparent problems with reading a calendar or honouring a contractual obligation � they appear to assume that Westerners are gullible fools of limited intelligence. This attitude is self defeating as it can only get rogue Schools like Santana into trouble. Apparently over the past year, 40 such Language Schools in the Zhuhai area have been closed down by the Authorities for non-compliance of regulations newly issued by Guangdong Province at Beijing�s behest.

1.3 The salary to be paid to the teacher is 6,000.00 RMB per month.

Santana has exercised a flexible attitude towards wages. Desperate for teaching staff for their Summer School as the OP mentions - they offered teachers 6,000 RMB. Other teachers already there were in fact being paid less. This unprofessional and unethical way of operating didn�t seem to bother Santana. Naturally, Santana were keen on keeping this state of affairs secret from the other teachers. But � hey, 6,000 RMB is in the contract so that is sacrosanct � isn�t it? Why � of course not. This, after all, is China, a developing country, where there is much scope for cultural misunderstanding and breakdowns in communication. You�ve heard these excuses for commonplace sharp practice before. Suffice to say, that for convoluted reasons Santana have unilaterally deducted contracted wages from their teaching staff. Their rationale? Money has to be withheld in case teachers break their contract!!! And the bursar (bless her) laughed in teachers' faces at this. As well she might at the irony of Santana again dishonestly and flagrantly breaking a Contract � but hey because business is not going too well � they have to claw the money back somehow even if this means robbing their teaching staff.

In terms of salaries in South China many schools will only pay their teachers something in the realm of 3,000 to 4,000 RMB a month. Even on a salary of 6,000 RMB a month you can be sure that a School is making some 2,000 RMB profit from you monthly. Santana, for example, charges about 130 RMB per lesson. You as a teacher will be lucky to get half of that amount.

1.4 Benefits:
a. School will provide free accommodation. The teacher is responsible for paying all utility fees to include: water, electricity, gas, telephone bill and any properties� monthly management fees. If the teacher does not elect the option of renting their own apartment, the school will pay 700RMB per month to the teacher.

Santana has one dirty, grubby apartment which they expect its staff to live in. All mod cons were promised and of course none were there. The toilet doesn't flush, and the cupboard doors in the kitchen were held together by sellotape. Dirty floors and dirty walls with cracks in, and a fridge / freezer which is filthy. Over the past 5 months at least 6 teachers to my knowledge have refused to put up with that substandard accommodation. One teacher managed to last in these digs for about one month until he left Santana (He hadn't been paid because of "visa problems") Most recently, two newly arrived teachers literally just in Zhuhai refused point blank to be housed there the moment they saw the accommodation. They were put up in a local hotel whilst suitable accommodation was found for them. This costs Santana money which, of course if our experience is anything to go by, they will later claw back by failing to pay the agreed contracted monthly salary.

One thing will remain constant though - Santana will not pay any money to upgrade the "free" but substandard accommodation they offer to newly arrived teachers. Any outlay on providing decent accommodation will be clawed back by hook or by crook.

If teachers object to the poor accommodation provided, Santana will then in turn object to paying the 700 RMB per person accommodation allowance - despite it being in the contract! - as �we (Santana) have never had to pay for other private accommodation before� This is simply a means of Santana trying to cut costs despite their failure to provide basic acceptable living accommodation in the first place. On top of this, Santana has later on deducted half of a teacher's monthly wage without consultation in order to recoup the cost of Santana's share of the deposit paid for the teacher to move into better accommodation.

b. For a one (1) year contract, the teacher shall receive 5000.00 RMB for the cost of flight tickets. This payment shall be paid upon the successful completion of the specified term of the contract.

Teachers need to be alert to clauses like this. Invariably the clause is worthless. Here's why. Last Summer, staff at Fountain Language School in Zhuhai (the best Language School in Zhuhai apparently if you believe their blurb) had their contracts terminated conveniently just before their year�s contract was up and The School would be bound to pay the staff�s airfares. This obviously- is very sound Chinese Business Practice as it saves the School money � and no doubt the cheated teaching staff will have been expected to swim home. This shining example of ethical Chinese Business Practice hasn�t been lost on Santana. Remember one recruit over the Summer hired - God forbid - to market Santana lasted one month. During which time, Santana paid him no wages, didn't have to pay for decent accommodation as they put him in the "free" substandard apartment, gave him the run around with his visas / work permit and then happily waved him goodbye when he left in disgust - without having to cough up any airfare remuneration.

c. The teacher shall have at least one day off every week, and all statutory Chinese holidays.

That�s kind of them. A six day working week which means that you will have no time to travel and explore China. That Oriental sense of humour again. Remember the job ads �Come and explore China�.� ? Also, some local schools expect Foreign Teachers to accept the Chinese concept of a holiday. You have two days off � you�ll then have to work two extra days later on to make the time up. Busy little beavers are our friends! No rest for the Westerners!

d OverTime will be paid at the rate of 100 RMB per teaching hour, after completing the required 24 hours of teaching per week specified in the terms of the contract.

No teachers to my knowledge have been given any overtime. That would entail having to pay teachers promptly, regularly and on time with money. We can�t have that now � can we?

eThe school is responsible for the costs of obtaining the teachers work visa, and work/ residence permits. The teacher is responsible paying the cost of obtaining the required Health Certificate.

On arrival in Zhuhai some teachers had current and valid Z Visas. They told Santana when these would expire. All Santana had to do was to renew them before they expired. Did they? Of course not. The teachers were then obliged to go to the local PSB and sign a statement saying that we had been working illegally in Zhuhai. The teachers were then fined 2,000 RMB. Santana, culpable of negligence or incompetence, refused to foot the bill. I tell you, these Schools do have a problem with understanding contracts. But hey � you�ve got to understand that China is a developing country. They�re all having a long march towards being reputable and honest. C�mon guys � Rome wasn�t built in a day �was it?

So the teachers get new Visas. They are valid for 11 months. The contract is for 12 months. The one month discrepancy? Catch up people. The teachers will get the chop one month before Santana has to cough up the cash for flight reimbursement (5,000 RMB each) stated earlier in the contract. Santana stand to save 10,000 RMB on this particular deal!

This discrepancy is also noticed by customs in Guangzhou where teachers' freight is held up. (clothes, furniture, school related books and materials etc) They won�t let this stuff through. Will Santana help? No. They could cancel teachers' existing Z Visas and issue new ones BUT they are afraid that the local Education Board may not accept this �as they are not ratifying the status of some other newly employed teachers at Santana. The Education Board and Customs clearly smell a rat. As should all of you reading this!

The teachers' freight is still held up in Guangzhou.

For some reason teachers with Santana haven�t been required to obtain a Health Certificate � which again makes a mockery of the contract.

f) The school is responsible for providing the proper travel allowance when the teacher is assigned to teach at other locations within the city of Zhuhai, Guangdong, P.R. China.

This allowance is meant to be 20 RMB a day. But times are hard and the School was last attempting to reduce this amount to the cost of bus fares (2 RMB a journey) As already mentioned though � there are other ways of cost cutting like a) not paying teachers the monthly salary specified in the contract or b) deciding to suspend the contract altogether. What genius!!

g) The school will provide thirty hours of free Chinese classes each year to the teacher.

No such lessons were offered teachers back in the Summer. In November, two new teachers asked Santana about this as learning Mandarin would be useful. Santana tells them that no such lessons are provided. Oh dear!

h) The school is responsible for obtaining accident insurance for the teacher.

I for one don�t trust Santana enough to have an accident!!

2. SCHOOL OBLIGATIONS
The school shall:
2.1 Introduce to the teacher the laws, decrees and relevant regulations enacted by the Chinese Government, the school�s work system, and regulations concerning the administration of foreign teachers.

No such help given. Santana also appears to break the The Law on a daily basis. They have no permit to employ Foreign Experts � but at least two of their staff hold or held the FEC. Santana also appears to employ illegally 5 teaching staff on part-time contracts.

2.2 Provide direction, supervision, and evaluation of the teacher�s work.

None given in any meaningful way at all.

2.3 Provide the teacher with all necessary conditions for working.

This I take to mean legal status, proper visas, access to resources and teaching materials etc. So Santana fails on every score. It is also a legal requirement that Schools should provide a canteen for its staff and kids, as well as a playground. Santana had to build a playground on one of its premises recently. It costs money � hence the staff pick up the tab in the form of deducted wages. Other Santana premises don�t meet these new requirements at all. The School is breaking The Law.

2.4 Provide Chinese co-workers to assist the teacher in teaching.

None given.

2.5 Pay the teacher�s salary regularly and on time each month.

See above as to how this has been flouted.

2.6 Provide the necessary teaching reference books and materials.

Staff have had to buy resources (of poor quality in my opinion) out of their own pockets from Hong Kong as Santana don�t have any. They send High School Qualified Teachers to kindergartens with no resources or TAs � and a typical High School Lesson is for some teacher to teach a class of 60 kids with no resources from Santana or the host school on topics like �life in America.�

2.7 Maintain the teacher�s working permit.

See above as to how this has been flouted and how Santana are illegally employing staff.

3. TEACHERS OBLIGATION

Nothing contentious here as long as you accept that all of Article 3 favours Santana at the expense of the Teacher.

The teacher shall:
3.1 Observe all laws, decrees, and relevant regulations enacted by the Chinese Government. Refrain from interfering in China�s internal affairs. The teacher shall respect China�s religious policy, and shall not conduct religious activities incompatible with the status of a teacher.

Fair enough. A shame that Santana flouts Chinese Government Regulations and its own Contract.

3.2 Observe the school�s work system and regulations concerning the administration of foreign teachers, and accept the school�s arrangements, directions, supervision, and evaluations in regards to his/her work.

As stated Santana�s arrangements leave almost everything to be desired -and Santana personnel are simply not qualified or experienced enough to even comprehend what professional teachers do in the classroom.

3.3 Teach all scheduled classes, English Corner, and English Club when reasonably assigned to him/her to host.

The key word here is �reasonably.� Santana also tends to be fond of split shifts. That is for example a gap of three or four hours between lessons. Unprofessional, incompetent and inefficient. One must remember though that this is China and Santana is not at all concerned with the letter of the law or teaching. If you stand up for your rights or common sense this may very easily be construed as being "unreasonable" - and that can spell trouble!

3.4 Participate in the school�s promotion arrangements by providing demonstration classes and English Corner voluntarily.

The key word here is "voluntarily". In other words they can get you to do work without you receiving any money for it. "Demonstration " classes are notorious in this regard as employers and schools in this part of the world expect you to do it for free. It is a bit like attending an interview and not receiving any travelling expenses for it. Also, teachers are regularly expected to do administrative chores that the office staff should be doing.

3.5 Be on duty one day a week to prepare teaching plans, and conduct student placement interviews. Attend the school meeting once a week.

Meetings are in fact infrequent and amount to the Principal ( Mr Jiao � a non teacher) opining in Mandarin whilst his streams of consciousness are badly translated by his Deputy Johnson or Johnson�s friend who is called QS Johnson. QS Johnson is the head of another Language School - and therefore appears to be illegally moonlighting. Placement interviews are conducted by Chinese staff who have poor English and no teaching certification. The professional input and opinions of qualified and experienced Western teachers are simply ignored. Indeed, any meaningful input by expatriate teachers is discouraged.

3.6 No smoking or consumption of alcohol during work time. The teacher should arrive sober and prepared to teach class.

Staff do smoke on the premises and there are obvious Health and Safety ramifications involved. Potential Fire Hazards etc.

3.7 Dress neatly and properly, with no obvious tattoos visible.

Santana aren�t interested in the way you dress. They are interested in how you can make money for them. Hence they currently employ as a teacher of English someone who is Bulgarian. They also employ staff with no prior teaching experience or teaching qualifications.

3.8 Submit quality lesson plans as required by the school.

The Chinese "Management" would not be able to read such lesson plans as their English is so poor.

3.9 Full-time teachers are not permitted to take full-time, or part-time teaching jobs in other school or companies.

And yet Santana flout regulations by employing part-timers.

3.10 The teacher should not ask for leave more than 3 times or more than 3 days off during a semester. Except for reasons dealing with emergencies, the teacher is required to apply for vacations in writing 10 days in advance and obtain approval from the school before taking leave. If the teacher asks for sick leave, the teacher should apply at least one day in advance to allow the school time to arrange another teacher to substitute. .If no one is available, the school will deduct from the teachers salary 160.00 RMB per hour to obtain a teacher from outside Santana, or 100.00 RMB per hour for a teacher teaching in Santana. If someone is available the school will deduct 50.00 RMB per hour.

Note the financial penalties - even if you are sick!

Santana generously allow you a day off at Christmas. There is so much of China for you to explore in the space of 24 hours isn�t there?

3.11 The teacher who takes over other teacher�s class will get an allowance of 10/hour.
If the substitute teacher has 24 hours per week already, the teacher will receive 100 per hour.
3.12 Teachers are required to pay the cost of any medical treatment fee, except the premium.

This seems to contradict the clause above about Health Insurance.

4. REVISION CANCELLATION AND TERMINATION OF THE CONTRACT
4.1 The school has the right to cancel the contract when the teacher is unable to meet their teaching requirements and obligations.

The Devil is in the lack of detail here. One for the local PSB I think! Note though that the clause of the contract is weighted against the teacher. What happens though if the employer fails in its obligations?

4.2 Whenever a teacher disobeys the rules of the school, or violates the laws of China, the school can cancel the contract immediately.

Obviously an insistence on accepted Western professional standards can cause problems. But hey � China is a developing country !!

4.3 The school has the right to cancel the contract when the teacher asks for excessive leave during one term.

I don�t think Santana keep staff long enough for them to ask for leave! What though does "excessive" mean in this case? Woe betide if you ask for a week off at Christmas. "Bah. Humbug!!!"

4.4 The teacher has the right to cancel the contract, if the school does not comply with the stipulated terms, and conditions of this contract. A one (1) month advanced notice to the school in writing is required.

If only the contract was worth something - exploited teachers at Santana would have a field day!

4.5 If the teacher disobeys school regulations, and cause a loss of money, the school has right to fine the teacher and recover lost revenue.

Another scam clause in my opinion designed by Santana to fleece its staff and excuse fraudulent behaviour. Again - what happens if the School is at fault?

4.6 This contract takes effect on the date signed by both parties. The contract will automatically expire on the date specified in this contract. If either of the two parties asks for new contract, they should forward their requests to the other party at least 60 days prior to the expiration date specified in the contract.

This contract has been repeatedly flouted by Santana and no expatriate staff member has any call to feel safe or secure in their job under these terms and conditions.

5. This contract in English or Chinese form is both valid and legal.

A dubious claim! Santana have also not bothered to provide their expatriate staff with a Chinese version/translation of this Contract.

The Moral of this posting?

Think long and hard about teaching in Zhuhai.

Santana English School, Zhuhai Teacher: __________________________

Date: _________________________ Date: ____________________________

Signature: _____________________ Signature

[Pepsi-Bones]

Post Script. Roger mentioned a Royal English School in Zhuhai. I for one have never heard of the place - nor met anybody who has taught there. Perhaps this school no longer exists, has changed its name, or has been closed down by the authorities in Zhuhai since May 2005? If the school still exists I stand corrected.

[chicagojoe]

I noticed you seemed to be fond of this phrase, "Pepsi Bones":

[Mytime]