Job Discussion Forums

[james_tesol]

Yes this is the same post as of 2 days ago before I was told by the administrators to re-post after some problems! Thanks for those who replied on the original post, all your comments were most valuable.

Yes I have posted to numerous other forums since I really have no idea of where to teach yet! Guess that maybe lazy in the eyes of some! For me I was just doing research�.so here is the original post if you want to reply! Thanks!

I have a degree and master degree in business from a UK uni, a 2 week TESOL course qualification, a CELTA, 2 years teaching experience in a college in Thailand, and when i finish my contract at my present job, i will have had 1 years experience in a prestigious Korean university.

My question to all you knowledgeable people out there, is this....

1)What is the best job I can get there with my qualifications in terms of money/hours/holidays etc etc.
2)I don�t need to save money, but I don�t want to lose money from home either. Is it possible?
3)I don�t want to work split shifts. Is it possible to find a good schedule?
4)I would only like to work at 1 institution. Is this possible?
5)Obviously it�s nto a deciding factor, but always worth asking�.What is the dating scene like there, and is there any chance of having a girlfriend?
How long are the contracts usually for and what happens of you want out?


Any ideas or comments would be most welcome!

[butterflyefect]

I taught fot almost five years and I hope these answers could help you a bit :
1. With your qualifications, you could work for an international school or an academic coordinator for a language school. At language schools where I used to teach, native teachers could have more than a month holiday every year. The salary always depends on where you teach. Usually Rp. 6,000,000 - Rp. 15,000,000. We usually worked from 9 to 5.

2. It's possible coz the cost of living is cheap and you can cover it with your monthly salary. It depends on your lifestyle.

3. Yes you can. It depends on the school where you work at. At a language school where I used to teach, we never had split but at another language school where I also used to teach, we worked on split shift. Not everyday, though.

4. For a native teacher, you MUST work only for 1 institution because this institution will take care of your work permit. You won't be allowed working for more than one institutions.


5. From what I've been observing, if you're a westerner, you wouldn't find any difficulties getting a girlfriend. Girls would be easily attracted to you and this is a fact that is undeniable. Trust me, coz this is my country that I'm talking about
Usually a contract is for one year. If you want out, they wouldn't give you your yearly bonus. Usually they'll pay half of your ticket flight once you arrive. Another half will be paid 6 months after you work. So if you leave after 3 months, you will lose half of your ticket money.

[ls650]

[james_tesol]

Thanks butterflyefect.

What does working at an international school in Indonesia involve? I am only qualified to teach ESL, not other subjects. Do international schools have classes JUST in english??

Also what are the students like? I have always enjoyd teaching under priviledged students, but if it means a better wage, then higher class students don't seem so bad!

[butterflyefect]

I'm sorry but I don't know much about international schools coz I never taught there. I have some friends who teach English at international schools and their certificates are TESOL or CELTA. You'll be paid more if you work for an international school. Language schools for under privileged students don't hire native speakers coz they can't afford to pay. A real challenge when you teach high class students is most of them are there because their parents want them to not because they want to learn English.
I'm taking part in the tsunami relief programme at the moment. If you are interested in teaching Acehnese children, there are some NGOs here who hire native speakers to do the job. I don't know much about the pay, though. There's someone from OXFAM who needs to hire native English teachers. Private message me your personal e-mail address if you're interested.

[guruengerish]

A couple of points to consider.

Indonesia is a mainly Muslim country, and as such has a high standard of morals, at least amongst nice young ladies.

I know people who have had serious relationships, and when it comes time to marry, it's always the westerner who has to change his/her religion. Some families take this quite seriously, and one can't become a Muslim in name only. Others don't really care. Some western teachers may also take their religious obligations quite seriously also; it's all up to the two of you.

On the subject of breaking a contract, be aware that a school has to put in a lot of money to get a teacher into the country and working permits issued, and sometimes renting a place to stay, a year up front. Teachers who quit early are usually asked to pay the costs involved, which can be around U$500 per month.

[basiltherat]

without intending to generalize, there used to be several common reasons for an indonesian girl wanting to attach herself to a foreigner in Jakarta (is that where you'll be ?):

1. to be admired by her 'girlfriends' for being able to do so
2. to have 'attractive' children if marriage comes about
3. to get a 'ticket out of the country' which by many accounts is still mired in abject poverty
4. to get a husband quick - especially those 'girls' who've reached 25 or over and seldom find a guy who is interested in such an 'aged woman'
5. local guys are unimaginative, conversationally-boring and unreliable.
6. to rip the white guy off
and of course,
7. there's pure and simple love.

There is an expression for the less-admirable type ... 'mata bensin'

Anyway, yes, go for it, but I suggest keeping the above in mind. In my time there, I witnessed some horrific cases of foreigner-local girl relationships, some due to the disgusting behaviour by the foreign guy and some, many, by the despicable intentions of the girl.
guess i was lucky.
best
basil

[guru]

Many westerners marry Indonesian women. Many Indonesian women believe in chastity. Many western men convert to islam.

Some western men choose not to date Indonesian women. Some Indonesian women are not chaste (chech out any night club!). Some western men do not convert to islam, and some muslim women convert to Christianity.

[blueboyguru]

Sure dude...you can get a decent job with a decent wage.......hmmm....about the girlfriend part......well....err.....hmm...there really is no adequete way to describe or define the type of attitude that you will see from a true Indo girl. Proceed with caution.....real hazardous to your health if you push the wrong button.

They are without a doubt the most jealous, insecure of creatures. The best advice that I can give you is to avoid any "blue-eyed" Indo woman....also you may want to make sure that their long flowing mane is real.......least it come off in the heat of the moment. Pretty amazing how real that hair can look under the lights at the night club or bar....after a few piss warm bintang beers.

Most guys have about on average three sms cards (sim cards) for text messaging. Believe me.....no matter how much of a gentleman you are by nature.....no matter how well -behaved you are......no matter how nice + sweet and cute she looks, the time will come...when you are sleeping or showering (in the oh so fun.... stand-up in cold water mandi) and she will rifle through your hand-phone (mobile phone in Europe...cell phone in USA) and question you about every girl's (even names that are gender neutral....ie..Pat) name saved in your phones directory. They also love to call any numbers that you have called or have received a call from (only the number will show..if this is not a contact thay you have saved). It is a bit crazy and embarassing when they are calling up your female friends (Indo woman...believe that it is impossible for a man to have any friends that are female) and say "siapa" who is this.

Lesson to the wise....I agree with the earlier posts that you will have absolutely no trouble attracting a girlfriend and obtaining a job. Getting a "nice" job or a "nice" girlfriend....well...best of luck. It is possible...but just remember the credo..."if it seems to good to be true....it probably is".

Good luck.

[Cardinal Synn]

[butterflyefect]

Blueboyguru...I'm so sorry that you had such a bad experience with an Indonesian girlfriend....I can see how it has taken its toll on you..you're growing bitter...full of prejudice...and narrow-minded...
Guru..You're a real Guru...Your comments are concise and meaningful...
I spent 5 years working as an ESL teacher before and now that I'm working in a humanitarian organization, I realized how low the average payment for ESL teachers in Indonesia is..It would be a nice try if you could work for an NGO but the thing is you might be stationed in Nias or Aceh and I don't know if you're interested in this..
About girls..There are huge cultural differences between western girls and Indonesian girls...Good girls here usually don't go to bars or smoke (but not in Jakarta and some other parts in Java coz more and more girls are smoking there)..About jealousy...you just happened to get one...I have a fellow teacher who's been married to an Indonesian woman for 10 years..He'd travelled around the world before and he told me many times this woman was the most understanding woman he'd ever found..with common sense and gave him freedom the most..and I'll tell you what...He's not rich either...From what I notice, most of western men had their first relationship with some kind of women who hung out in bars coz that's where they went to the first week they arrived in this country..and they had a relationship with these type of women and they drew conclusions based on this experience...

[blueboyguru]

Butterflyeffect:

Thanks for the sound advice......it is true. Too generalize women in any country or nation is dangerous.

I agree that jealousy, spite whatever you'd like to call it...is truly universal. Yes butterfly....I really am a teacher, that is time permitting. My part-time job as Minsiter.....I mean assitance minister of fuel misinformation takes up an increasing amout of my time.

One bad experience with an Indo girl.......not need to consider this tragic....I actaully consider it "not bad". But then again, I have not developed the meglamania of many bule males in this country. I am old enough and sometimes wise enough to know how the story is goinna end. Let's face it....there are really two types of Jakarta style girls.....1- the mormal or nice girl..........2- just like you said...the kind that you are going to meet in a bar because that is where you always spend your free time.

I find it a lot harder and much more demanding to be able to somehow get a bluebird home"Without" a girl from Blok M. This takes nerves of steel....a good taxi driver and the willpower to somehow tell yourself........"I have seen this movie before".

Was actually at "My Bar" in Blok M last night for the first time in months......and there is a reason for that. Depite all the rubbing....and spontaneous touches by the"chickens" it really doesn't impress me very much. Maybe....Jakarta is like a drug and my tolerance level has peaked.

At any rate......please don't feel too sorry for me...I was probably half pissed when I wrote the post about the Indo girls. I have been "lucky"...the same Indo girlfriend for 11 months. Although she is incredibly insecure and jealous..(of even my computer) she has a eart of gold...and I or rather we are hoping to get married (not in this country though).

Take care butterflyeffect and please keep up the good, soundavice.

[blueboyguru]

Butterflyeffect:

Thanks for the sound advice......it is true. Too generalize women in any country or nation is dangerous.

I agree that jealousy, spite whatever you'd like to call it...is truly universal. Yes butterfly....I really am a teacher, that is time permitting. My part-time job as Minsiter.....I mean assitance minister of fuel misinformation takes up an increasing amout of my time.

One bad experience with an Indo girl.......not need to consider this tragic....I actaully consider it "not bad". But then again, I have not developed the meglamania of many bule males in this country. I am old enough and sometimes wise enough to know how the story is goinna end. Let's face it....there are really two types of Jakarta style girls.....1- the mormal or nice girl..........2- just like you said...the kind that you are going to meet in a bar because that is where you always spend your free time.

I find it a lot harder and much more demanding to be able to somehow get a bluebird home"Without" a girl from Blok M. This takes nerves of steel....a good taxi driver and the willpower to somehow tell yourself........"I have seen this movie before".

Was actually at "My Bar" in Blok M last night for the first time in months......and there is a reason for that. Depite all the rubbing....and spontaneous touches by the"chickens" it really doesn't impress me very much. Maybe....Jakarta is like a drug and my tolerance level has peaked.

At any rate......please don't feel too sorry for me...I was probably half pissed when I wrote the post about the Indo girls. I have been "lucky"...the same Indo girlfriend for 11 months. Although she is incredibly insecure and jealous..(of even my computer) she has a eart of gold...and I or rather we are hoping to get married (not in this country though).

Take care butterflyeffect and please keep up the good, soundadvice.

[butterflyefect]

You're very welcome, blueboyguru...
The fact that a lot of guys (including local guys) have a habit of cheating has made more and more Indonesian women develop jealousy or spite...for those who wanna play around, girls in bars should be the best choice..They are professionals..They know how to deal with guys who just need a temporary relationship....Just don't try to mess up with innocent girls like 2 former fellow teachers I knew..One rushed back to his country after knowing the girl was expecting..the other one really wants to dump this girl after sleeping with her a couple of times but found out that he's the first man she ever gets involved with and that she's gonna suffer a nervous breakdown if he leaves her. It's not very common for a woman to live under the same roof with her boyfriend. My fellow teachers always thought this was something weird. For most of the locals, the idea of living together that is weird. That's why most of them look down on this type of girls. The reason why the girl still sticks to the western guy who lives with her, is either because of the money or because she really loves him. if the reason is the latter, then..it's not her fault if she gets jealous easily if her boyfriend has a lot of friends *who are girls* but....kiss and hug them...or even more than that.

[TEAM_PAPUA]

While in Indonesia my friend's girlfriend pretended to be dead to see what his reaction would be! She called him up pretending to be her sister & told him that her 'sister' had died - then she continued to call and offer a shoulder to cry on. She turned up at his house around a week later after putting him through hell - incredible but true!

I had a an Indonesian girlfriend who quickly married after we broke up 'to spite me' but ended up in a loveless marriage having an affair with me later on

I've heard from friends of girls scaling walls & fences & fighting with the security (security - guys smoking & watching tv).

For the most part I was dating an Indonesian/Chinese girl & had no problems apart from those caused by her racist narrow-minded parents.

I rather like the jealous & insecure girls, they boost my confidence