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leeroy
Joined: 30 Jan 2003 Posts: 777 Location: London UK
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2003 5:52 pm Post subject: A list... countries to teach with no degree: |
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I'm surprised no-one thought of this before, really, considering how many times the question is asked.
Countries (I am aware of) where a first degree is not a visa requirement and a TEFL market exists...
* All of EU (But will need EU citizenship)
* China
* Brazil
* Indonesia
* Mexico
* Russia
* Venezuela
* Colombia
* Vietnam
* Ecuador
Please correct me if there are any mistakes, or any more countries to add... [/list] |
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PanamaTeacher
Joined: 26 Jun 2003 Posts: 278 Location: Panama
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2003 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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Leeroy
What I would like is a statistical breakdown of the improvement made by students who have teachers with no/low quals vs those with qualified or degreed teachers.
Based on your premise, This is how I should think:
I have pulled my own teeth out of my mouth. I think I'll go to * All of EU (But will need EU citizenship) * China * Brazil * Indonesia * Mexico * Russia * Venezuela * Colombia * Vietnam * Ecuador and be a dentist.
Post something useful, like where students in the above countries can find teachers that know what the heck they are doing. |
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dorum
Joined: 02 Jul 2003 Posts: 35 Location: China
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2003 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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A degree is not the only (or, in fact, THE) way to learn how to teach... My degree is not at all useful in any way to my teaching - my teaching cert. is quite useful, though.....
As if a degree teaches you anything |
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PanamaTeacher
Joined: 26 Jun 2003 Posts: 278 Location: Panama
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2003 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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Oh Dorum--come on, be real; a degree teaches you how to use your brain and it shows the world that you have the foresight and determination to do something the benefits of which may not be readily apparent to you.
Based on your argument, why ever go to school for anything.
Listen, sit at a table and think about all that education has done for you, the inside of you. Do you honestly (all being cool and talking BS aside) opine that your education was a waste.
Would you prefer a doctor, engineer, judge, president, etc. with no education? The only smart thing I did in my life was not quitting college even when times were hard. If you are unhappy about your education the best remedy is: get more.
Now once you get a degree you have to get experience to go with it. I think that to get experience without the theoritical underpinnings that college gives you is OK too, but you find yourself re-inventing the wheel.
OK that's enough on this
BYE |
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C76
Joined: 13 Jun 2003 Posts: 113 Location: somewhere between beauty and truth...in Toronto. ;)
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2003 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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leeroy,
Did you set up this thread with earnest intentions?
I just blasted PT for setting up another thread with a similar premise. 'Cept I thought that one was created in jest. |
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PanamaTeacher
Joined: 26 Jun 2003 Posts: 278 Location: Panama
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2003 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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C--u no i am not serious about nada except dogmeat--yum yum |
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leeroy
Joined: 30 Jan 2003 Posts: 777 Location: London UK
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2003 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, my intentions are completely honest!
By making this list I'm not saying "It's OK/Not OK" to teach without a degree, I'm merely trying to share information that is often requested.
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PanamaTeacher
Joined: 26 Jun 2003 Posts: 278 Location: Panama
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2003 8:31 pm Post subject: |
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well leeroy is it ok or not ok
I say it is ok depends |
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leeroy
Joined: 30 Jan 2003 Posts: 777 Location: London UK
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2003 9:49 pm Post subject: ok or not? |
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Yep, I say it depends too.
I spent a long time creating a well-worded super-intelligent reply, which not only concluded the "degree or not" debate for all time, but also solved most of humanity's problems, including war, religion, and globalisation.
The internet disagreed, however, and the whole thing was lost forever. Sod it, can't be bothered to do another one... |
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PanamaTeacher
Joined: 26 Jun 2003 Posts: 278 Location: Panama
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2003 10:23 pm Post subject: |
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darn net |
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naturegirl321
Joined: 04 May 2003 Posts: 9041 Location: home sweet home
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2003 1:50 am Post subject: |
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China, you do need a degree or a lot of experience and a Cert. |
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johnslat
Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 13859 Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2003 2:41 am Post subject: To a degree |
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Regarding what a degree can " teach you " ( well, actually nothing, of course; it's not the degree, it's what you learn on the way to getting it that matters ), the answers:
1. a lot
2. nothing
( Don't you hate multiple-choice questions? )
That's because it all depends on the individual, of course. The old axiom: " You can lead a horse to water, etc. "
comes to mind. I've know those with advanced degrees who were terrible teachers and those without who were great. However, that being said, such examples were the exceptions, rather than the rule. What a person gets from education depends on what he/she brings to it. Yet another axiom ( one of my favorites ):
" He/she who would discover the gold of the Indies must take the gold of the Indies with him/her. "
Degrees don't automatically make good teachers, but they certainly help make good teachers even better ones.
Regards,
John |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 12844 Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2003 5:22 am Post subject: |
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Quote: |
I'm surprised no-one thought of this before, really, considering how many times the question is asked.
Countries (I am aware of) where a first degree is not a visa requirement and a TEFL market exists...
* All of EU (But will need EU citizenship)
* China
* Brazil
* Indonesia
* Mexico
* Russia
* Venezuela
* Colombia
* Vietnam
* Ecuador
Please correct me if there are any mistakes, or any more countries to add |
Depends on what nationality you are, too, as your first notation shows. This makes it very hard to list "correct" answers.
For example, in Japan, you may ( stress the word "may") not need a degree for a teaching job...
1. if you are from Canada, Britain, Australia, New Zealand, France, Germany or Korea, and if you meet the specific requirements for a working holiday visa (limited age group, limited length which varies with country)
2. and if your employer is other than a university, high school, kindergarten, or elementary school.
Other options for non-degreed people in Japan include part-time work on a student visa, or any work where they feel you are qualified with your spouse visa, both regardless of nationality.
So, you can see, your simple question is a real can of immigration worms. |
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dandan
Joined: 25 Jun 2003 Posts: 183 Location: Hong Kong
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2003 5:50 am Post subject: degree |
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I'm always rather amused by the doctor analogy. "Would I want a doctor who was educated?" Kinda depends what he was educated in I guess.
Here's my list of people I would turn to if I was in need of urgent medical attention in order of preference, depending on their availability in the community I found myself in and whether I could afford them.
1) A Doctor of medicine. (Of course with a specialisation in my particular injury and many years of experience if possible)
2) A trained, experienced nurse.
3) A junior nurse.
4) A bloke with a first-aid certificate.
5) A bloke who looks like he's got a bit of common sense.
6) A bloke with a degree.
(And of course we all know the nurse is probably gonna cut it better than the doctor with most day to day injuries) |
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dandan
Joined: 25 Jun 2003 Posts: 183 Location: Hong Kong
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2003 5:52 am Post subject: |
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You may possibly be able to draw some analogies with tefl teaching here (but only if you're well educated, of course). |
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