Job Discussion Forums

[randerso]

This is just a heads up about Xi'an Siyuan University. Both the FAO and the recruiter (C.E.S.) are somewhat creative when it comes to the facts, and are happy to stay that way. I've waited about a month after I left to let some 'revenge' out of the posting, I hope what follows will help in any decisions about the school. It's not the worst school I've heard of, but it's well out of the top spots. There are things to recommend it, but go in with your eyes open! Feel free to contact me if you want any more advice/info. Also a coworker from last year offered his previous posts to give another opinion. Check out his thoughts under the user name peabocardigan.

Good:
Pay: Min: 4350RMB/16hrs a wk, Max: 6000RMB/24hrs a wk. Good wage for a Xi'an private Uni. Pay is on time (though check your amounts) and easy access (ATMs on campus)
Food: 7 canteens with lots of Chinese food, supermarkets on campus and in the small 'village' behind, restaurants in the 'village'. A knowledge of Chinese is a must for the restaurants and will help in the canteens. Great prices.
Freedom: You work a minimum of hours (compared with private schools in the city) and have all your free time to yourself. There are several 'outdoors' areas close to the school worth exploring, and you are close to the mountains (Hua Shan) and the Terra Cotta Warriors.
City: There is tons to do in Xi'an. Lots of tourist stuff, great bargain shopping and a very cool area known as the Muslim Quarter. Western stuff, but not overly westernized. It's not Beijing or Shanghai, and the 'realism' is a welcome break.
Metro: Every Sat (though you may have to remind them it's Saturday again!) there is a private round trip mini bus to take the teachers to Metro, a German based bulk goods supermarket. You can find anything you need there, Western or otherwise. The prices will reflect that, but the bread & cheese selection make it a destination anyways.

Misleading:
Location: The school is NOT in Xi'an. It is a 45 minute bus ride from the center or 10 min to the boon-dock edges. At least a 25 RMB cab ride to the centre.
Housing: free, hotel style rooms, but in a central dorm building housing all other teachers. Doors locked at 11 {need to wake up the door man to get in}, hard to bring Chinese guests in, 'no students after 10� rule.
Curriculum: There are textbooks, but they absolutely suck. Most of the teachers didn't use them at all - they simply did whatever they felt was appropriate. Good if you have any idea what you are doing, can be bad if it's your first time out!
Levels: There are none. It works on a year (sophomore, senior, etc) basis, so you will have high intermediate with absolute beginners. And class size is a minimum of 50, can get to 80+. Also, your class schedule will change frequently with little to no warning for the teacher. Most of the teachers this year found it hard to make personal bonds with students due to these constraints.
Mandarin Lessons: They say they provide them, but they have never been scheduled by the Admin. What they mean is that you can arrange with one of the Chinese English Teachers or one of your students to learn on your own. But most people here who want contact with the foreigners want to practice English, not teach Chinese. Possible, but problematic.

Bad:
Pollution: It gets pretty bad, especially in the summer - but one of the perks about living outside the city 'on the hill' is that the air is much cleaner and the wind keeps the smell away.
Administration: At best they are hands off. But in reality getting (reliable) info is like pulling teeth - they seem to take it as a personal affront if you want advance notice. Like most Chinese admin.
FAO: if they keep the current FAO, get used to doing everything yourself. His answer to everything is either 'yes' (which means please go away) or 'it's not my responsibility' (which also means please go away). He's not only useless, he has perfected the art of last-minute, problematic-filled stress.
Motivation: Of students, Admin staff and other teachers. The going code seems to be, if you can get away with it, do it. You will, of course, have those few ultra-motivated students who make it all worthwhile, but the majority are too tired out by the system to give a damn. So is the Admin.

[clark.w.griswald]

What an excellent and very informative review! It would be great if every school review here followed this format as it certainly covers all bases in a fair manner. As someone who reads reviews daily, it is refreshing to see a non-emotive, but information packed review. I really believe that this not only adds credibility to the review but serves the purpose of enabling future teachers to decide whether or not to work at this school.

Thanks randerso for taking the time to post it.

[peabocardigan]

Read my posts for more information about this place. In all fairness, I had some (not all) of the same information that is given here and still had an amazing year. However, it is a good idea to prepare oneself for the challenges of the workplace. I would actually like to hear from some of the new teachers there and what they think about the place.

[tw]

Unfortunately, most of what you included in the "misleading" section are pretty standard in China.

Location: many Chinese universities are located far away from city centres because of the amount of acreage the campus takes up. Seeing that China is heavily populated, they do need to situate colleges and universities in rural areas of the city.

Curriculum: Yes, most FT's don't bother with school-provided teaching materials and use their own materials. This is due to the fact that pretty well all text books used by Chinese public schools are, in a nutshell, sh*t.

Levels: While it is every FT's dream to have a class full of students with more or less the same English proficiency, that will never be the case. So in a class, you will have students from absolute beginners to high intermediate levels as far as oral English goes. They are probably all placed in the class based on their score from a written English prociency test given by the school prior to class assignment.

[randerso]

Hey tw,

I realize all the rationales behind your comments. And they are sound. That is why I did not put Location, Curriculum, Levels or Housing in the BAD section. I would dare to say that for most first timers, Chinese schools in general will be misleading about those topics. There are very good reasons for these things being the way that they are - but neither the FAO nor the recruiting agent tell you any of this. I find that the new teachers who came expecting something diferent were unhappy with these facts. Those of us that had been in the game before took all FAO advice with a grain of salt. But I thought I'd give a fair account to those who don't know to look past the statements or needle for the right info.

And as an addition, I wasn't saying that any teacher should expect a stand-alone house; but we are all housed ON CAMPUS in one dorm block with only each other. That can get a bit tiring and can feel like a fish bowl!

[tw]

[Babala]

Great school review.

tw, I think what you are forgeting is that to people who have been here before, these issues may seem common-place, but to a newbie who doesn't know what to expect it is priceless information.

[wigan4]

Great review--what's good about it is I can see myself balancing the good and the bad and happily taking such a job, knowing ahead of time what it's going to be like.

One comment, though--all I know is what I've read in posts, but as an outsider looking in a single room in a dorm, which is how I (maybe mistakenly) interpreted that section, doesn't appear to me to be the norm, at least not at a university. I generally see things like an apartment with one bedroom, living/dining, kitchen, bathroom. Is a single room in a dorm really the norm?

Obviously for me, planning to bring my wife and actually set up a stable 'family life' for several years, that wouldn't be Option A. Or Option B, for that matter.

[peabocardigan]

[wigan4]

Thanks--I was afraid I was misunderstanding the use of the term 'apartment' in ads--although I do still think in reading between the lines its sometimes used with a certain degree of ingenuity. When I see 'single housing' I read that as a motel-type room. I've just seen on another thread a couple that arrived to an unpleasant surprise. It sounds like the sort of thing that an arriving couple needs to nail down about 14 times before going over.

Assuming you have a reasonable description in the contract--bedroom, living room, bathroom, kitchen, that sort of thing--if you arrive and it's not as per the agreement I assume you can walk away 'no harm, no foul?' I understand you'll be jobless and out flight money, but refusing a job on a contractual basis like that wouldn't jeopardize future employability, would it? Am I right in gathering that you don't sign the 'no kidding' binding contract until after arrival? I keep seeing things about the 'real' contract with red stamps and signing after arriving, so I assume if you arrive and things aren't IAW your understandings you can just politely say 'no thanks?'

[peabocardigan]

[wigan4]

That's good advice. I can forsee something like 'Hey, no need to meet me at the airport--I think I'll arrive a few days early and do some sightseeing before I head over to university X--I'll see you there on the 14th.'

[peabocardigan]

[DistantRelative]

Kinda funny. I applied for a job with an outfit today for this university. I made it known I had no Uni Degree. Just a TEFL Cert with prior exp. Shortly after I sent them an E-Mail they sent me an offer and a contract. Other then the housing issue it looked like a decent offer so I respomded by telling them all was cool but that I would require my own 1 bedroom apartment. A bit later this guy responds by withdrawing the offer. He now says that the school can't accept me because I don't have a degree. I'm sure had I not had a beef with the housing I wouldn't have gotten the withdrawal. Oh well. If anyone knows of anyone looking for a Teacher in Xi'an I'd appreciate the heads-up.

Regards,

Shawn

[peabocardigan]

They have given 1 bedroom apartments to single FTs in the past, depending on availability.