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anabelle0
Joined: 25 Aug 2005
Posts: 6
Location: Portland, OR
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 Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:33 pm Post subject: AEON vs. NOVA? |
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I've been comparing teaching programs for Japan and I was wondering if anyone who is currently involved or has been involved through these programs could let me know what they thought of it. So far I think I like AEON the best, it looks like it pays a little more than NOVA and your get more vacation. Is this true? Can you believe everything they have posted on their websites or do salaries/vacations tend to change once you have signed up? If anyone has any thoughts I would love to hear them.
Thanks so much! |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 11:03 pm Post subject: |
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EVERYBODY gives more vacation than NOVA. That's why people nickname the place NOVAcation.
Housing seems to be more of an issue at AEON than anything else. If you are happy to rent their apartments, it's nice to see that they pay up to 42,000 yen/month on your rent. However, they will ask that you pay this amount if you rent another place. Yup, double dipping. |
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guest of Japan
Joined: 28 Feb 2003
Posts: 1601
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2005 1:01 am Post subject: |
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If you are choosing from just these two, go with AEON.
There are three positives for Nova over AEON. One, if you want to exchange days off with someone it is easily done. Two, if you get stuck in a bad school it is possible to transfer. This is very difficult to do with AEON. Three, you can advance up the ranks in Nova far more easily than at AEON, if it is a goal for you.
The housing issue Glenski mentioned is really only an issue if you are married or want to live with a girlfriend. If you are single, they are a great deal. You have no roommates and the rent is very cheap. Those things can not be said about Nova.
I found the Japanese corporate culture at AEON very irksome. I'm sure the same could be said about Nova. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2005 6:33 am Post subject: Re: AEON vs. NOVA? |
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| anabelle0 wrote: |
I Is this true? Can you believe everything they have posted on their websites or do salaries/vacations tend to change once you have signed up? If anyone has any thoughts I would love to hear them.
Thanks so much! |
Just a couple of legal points. A website is not a legal document and a person can write whatever they want on it and it doenst have to be truthful. there is no law against putting false information on a website.
However if you sign a contract with an employer, and he then changes the contract after you have signed it, or the work conditions differ from what was promised in the contract then you have a legal claim against him. Legally speaking, you can declare the contract null and void and demand that he pay your airfare back to your home country. Very few do this though as they usually quit and stay in japan. You have the legal right to demand compensation if you contract with them is FALSE. You can not do anything just becuase they post lies on the internet. I know of several companies where the information on their website actually contradicts itself and many if the clauses are illegal.
Second, your only concern should be whether the contract obeys Japanese labor laws. it really doesnt matter about whether the contract differs from the website, but whether the clauses in the contract are legal under japanese law. having one or two lemons in teh contract doenst make a contract invlaid, but you can challenge the legality of those individual clauses. As for vacations you are legally entitled to a certain number of vacations every year and they may promise more but if they offer less technically they are breaking the law. You may get less than what they promise you in a contract, but more than is legally permissible. This again is up to the company and the individual, and is based on the company7s convenience, scheduling, work performance etc.
as far as believing what the website says, far too often people think that if its posted on the Internet it must be true. this not the case. the internet is simply a medium of communication, like an electronic newspaper, and lies are printed in the newspaper all the time depending on the message they want to convey. Its up to you to do your homework, get a copy of the contract, ask people about what they think and make sure you know what your rights are and what you are entitled to. that is what this website and teacher unions are here for. Do your homework rather than just believe whatever the company wants you to know. That's why you have propoganda and advertising, which is all a webpage is. |
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SEndrigo
Joined: 28 Apr 2004
Posts: 437
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| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2005 6:41 am Post subject: |
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It seems like we hear this kind of question several times a week on the message boards....why not just read the FAQs or do a search?
Plenty has been said about AEON vs. NOVA, etc.
But I too, would recommend choosing AEON over NOVA....it's actually a no-brainer! |
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stillnosheep
Joined: 01 Mar 2004
Posts: 2068
Location: eslcafe
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| Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2005 12:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Never had I expected to find myself in agreement with the previous poster (and with AEON no contract is signed until both parties have agreed on location and school). |
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wangtesol
Joined: 24 May 2005
Posts: 280
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| Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2005 11:18 pm Post subject: no brainer |
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Well, the entire private language school is unregulated, so standards are not that high, but Nova is worse than AEON. There are more than three court cases being fought against Nova by teachers.
NOVA is the largest employer of migrant workers in Japan, about 6000. And they refuse to automatically enroll their teachers into the mandatory government health care plan. So they have precipated the launch of a governemnt investigation. All schools are like this actually, but Nova is the industry leader and leading culprit.
AEON is much easier to deal with in labor disputes. Just join the General Union or one of its sister unions such as National Union of General Workers Tokyo Nambu (www.nambufwc.org) who know of the details of AEONs problems. One of their teachers died on the job of massive organ failure. Apparently AEON used to pressure its teachers not to take sick days even when teachers were sick. Now someone has died because of that policy. As a result, they do not want any trouble with a teacher who knows her rights and has the power of the union behind them. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2005 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| The housing issue Glenski mentioned is really only an issue if you are married or want to live with a girlfriend. If you are single, they are a great deal. You have no roommates and the rent is very cheap. |
I was under the impression that ANYONE who did not want to live in AEON apartments still had to pay for them, whether that teacher is living alone or cohabitating.
Any clarification on this? |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2005 11:56 pm Post subject: Re: no brainer |
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| wangtesol wrote: |
NOVA is the largest employer of migrant workers in Japan, about 6000. And they refuse to automatically enroll their teachers into the mandatory government health care plan. So they have precipated the launch of a governemnt investigation. All schools are like this actually, but Nova is the industry leader and leading culprit.
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The largest employer of foreign workers is the government JET program with about 6000 JETs CIRs and SEAs on the program at the moment. First year JETs number about 2900. 2nd year JETs are 2149.
http://www.jetprogramme.org/e/outline/statistics.html
In the private sector NOVA is the largest employer with about 4000 foreign employees, in about 250 branches (at last count) around the country.
Last edited by PAULH on Fri Sep 02, 2005 2:23 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Nismo
Joined: 27 Jul 2004
Posts: 520
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 2:13 am Post subject: |
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| AEON's housing policy is that you must pay for the AEON appointed apartment, whether you live in it or not. It is subsidized, so you only pay up to 42,000 yen per month. |
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guest of Japan
Joined: 28 Feb 2003
Posts: 1601
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 3:53 am Post subject: |
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| Glenski wrote: |
| Quote: |
| The housing issue Glenski mentioned is really only an issue if you are married or want to live with a girlfriend. If you are single, they are a great deal. You have no roommates and the rent is very cheap. |
I was under the impression that ANYONE who did not want to live in AEON apartments still had to pay for them, whether that teacher is living alone or cohabitating.
Any clarification on this? |
The apartments are for single occupancy. As a single person, they are a great deal, and there is absolutely no reason to look for another place. However, married people will probably not get hired anymore, because the schools are unwilling to give up an older investment for the sake of an incoming and untested teacher.
You are not incorrect Glenski, but the apartments are not a scam. They are a great deal. It's only a problem if you want to live a more luxurious life or if you want to live with others. |
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anabelle0
Joined: 25 Aug 2005
Posts: 6
Location: Portland, OR
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for everyone's input. Last week when I was looking at schools I got a better feeling about AEON over NOVA, but I just wanted some other input as well.
As for the housing with AEON...I know you can't share it with a partner, but what are the chances of getting placed in the same city? My boyfriend and I are trying to do this together and it wouldn't be a problem if we had different apartments, but is it hard to get placed in the same city together? I couldn't find much on the AEON website about this and I'm still waiting for a reply from them... |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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guest of Japan,
Are you saying that if a person doesn't want to take the AEON housing, that he WON'T have to pay AEON the 42,000 yen in addition to the rent on his other housing? If a person has to pay this "double rent", I call that a scam.
anabelle,
Your "chances" of getting places in the same city depend on the vacancies they have at the time of placement. I'd be willing to bet they can't tell you anything until it's almost time to move there. |
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snooky
Joined: 12 Feb 2005
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 10:25 pm Post subject: |
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| No its not a scam at all. You go into your contract with Aeon well aware of their housing policies. They aren't hiding anything from you. If you so choose to move out of your Aeon sanctioned apartment, then good for you, pay double rent. That's not a scam, it's just the way it is. If you're going into the gig assuming you are going to want housing different from what Aeon is providing, then maybe Aeon just isn't the option for you. |
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guest of Japan
Joined: 28 Feb 2003
Posts: 1601
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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Glenski, I don't think I'm getting my point across very well. I seem to lack the time to write long messages.
As a single person the apartments are a great deal. It would be silly to want another apartment, so the idea of paying double rents is a non-issue.
The apartments are a big issue for married people. After I had gotten married, I looked into going back with AEON. They were very interested in hiring me again, but I couldn't live with my wife. They said a school would be unlikely to give up one of their apartments to get a bigger one especially for me. I didn't go back. If a teacher already on staff got married, then the school would probabley support the situation. It's not really that it is a company policy. It's just that schools operate on incredibly tight budgets trying to get ridiculous sales targets, and they don't want to make their lives harder.
Annabelle, the chances of what you ask are strong if you request the Tokyo area. When they offer you a contract they will say where and when as well. |
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