Job Discussion Forums

[goeastyoung(ish)man!]

[quote="Roger"]I am a white (do not call me "Caucasian" because that drives me mad - I hate being mislabelled, call me white, call me European, but never call me "Caucasian", only ignoramuses do that - ) /quote]

What's the difference between "white" and "caucasian" in reference to people? I'm white and self-refer either as white or caucasian when it comes up. I've never known caucasian to be anything but a generalization of physical characteristics typified by Europeans or originally, I suppose, by those living near the Caucasus mountains. "White" isn't a meaningful term for a person by itself, but we all have biases and expectations that come into play when we hear that someone is white, black, etc.

I agree that one of the best ways for China to learn about black people (or white people or English speaking Asian people etc., etc.) is to hire black teachers, and lots of them. One or two teachers wouldn't do. How many times have you heard "you're not like most _______s, most are *beeps*?"

I haven't yet come to China, but have read in this site quite often about the racism in China. Have any non-blacks in this forum had many experiences where you are assumed to be racist against blacks, and failed to correct that notion, if it needed to be corrected? For example, have you stood silent or laughed politely at racist jokes? I'm not holier than thou: I have not always spoke up, particularly with people that I'm just trying to get away from or pass the time with as quickly as possible. I just think we all have an obligation to stand up for what we think is right.

[GONZALVESB]

I just wat to add to the issue about African Americans in China. If you ask me I do think Chinese are ignorant as far as far as African Americans are concerned. I got to know a little ten year old who often spoke to me to practice her English and she believes that black people are violent and bad. Before I started teaching at this school they had a teacher from Kenya but she never approached him to practice her English. I also get the impression that even the college students at this school did not like him. Apparently they were told not to go and visit him in his apartment. I also believe that Chinese employers would prefer employing white people. I had four agents contacting me and after determining that I was from SA, the obvious next question was, are you white? Chinese women buy cream to lighten their skin and yes, they definitely believe that white is beautiful.

[Roger]

Interestingly, there are textbooks for the TEFL teacher in China that specifically talk about anti-black racism in the USA, and many name Martin Luther King. In a dialogue between a Chinese that had just returned home from his studies in the USA and his former classmate who had not gone overseas, the discussion swiftly turned to how Americans supposedly treat African-Americans and Chinese.
Now if you ask any Chinese how they perceive Africans, I do not expect them to have any overly praiseful opinion, and I would not be surprised if they even defended their own students who many years back beat up Africans at Nanjing University for "consorting with our girls".
But don't get me wrong - I know there are mixed African-Chinese couples. It just happens a lot less often than it does between whites and Chinese.
And just as some whites are helping create bad vibes with Chinese, certain Africans create anti-African sentiments too. Especially Nigerians. It is amazing to see how many of them roam the streets of Guangzhou and Shenzhen - not TEFLers, to be sure, but "business" types that stay in rundown ramshackle hotels but wear designer clothes.
Oh, I have committed the crime of lumping criminals together with bona fide travellers! Sorry, but a few years back, Hong Kong withdrew the visa-free status from Nigerians precisely because of certain goings-on. They were then seen streaming across the border to Guangdong.

[Linda L.]

My employer demands a current picture of every applicant.

If you are not white, your education, experience, ability, charisma etc. do not count. First you must be white and then from UK, USA, Australia.

Racism? You betcha. And, he says that is how it is with most foreign affairs officers who just came back from a National conference in northern China and will attend another one in late August in southern China.

[GONZALVESB]

goeastyoung(ish)man! When the little girl told me that Africans are violent and bad, I told her that that is not so. She told me that someone said that to her, I can't remember whether it was her father or teacher. Anyway, I told her that they are just like you and me.

Yes, as a SA it is also not as easy finding a job in China because most schools are looking for people from the USA, Canada, Australia, UK and NZ. They don't consider SA as an English speaking country.

[Kapt. Krunch]

I don't want to go on a rant here so I'll keep it short.
1)I am not the most positive person and I rarely pretend to be. I am blessed/cursed with a bitingly sarcastic tongue and a critical eye.
Even I can see good things in China.
There is lots of fuel for every emotion here(there are 1.5 billion people here) , it's what you want to run on that matters.

2) If a white male goes through a negative experience in China(and most places in the world)...it is multiplied in frequency, amplitude, or both...for a black male.
Please don't take this the wrong way but ...I am not going to lie and say that we're ALL just "foreigners".

[NumberOneSon]

[China Pete]

[Kapt. Krunch]

I agree...yet it seems that people (being people) still react according to their own guts when confronted with (not asked about) any situation.
Case in point...ask about Mao (as in Chairman, not Tom&Jerry) and you'll get the same answer...he was our greatest leader, father of China etc,etc,etc. In private some have told me that "the gods have given China a second chance...only one son of Maos survived...and he was retarded."
And the outlook on personal matters as in attraction and revulsion are much more varied when the peer pressure and "face" are removed from the equation.

[beerdang]

Yes, the chinese history has taught the people in power the easiest way to rule is to to make them conform and let you do the thinking for them.

Does that mean chinese can't be changed by offering something new and some fresh air? Wouldn't that be one the contribution you guys make.
It is true that you can't criticize China in your classroom. But you can teach them how to define racism, how t started and how it has shaped your societies. Why african american are struggling? Is is because how they look? Medical science has told us all the difference in humans are only skin deep.

I doubt the chinese will not take a second look at themselves by looking at someone else. Who can deny all the changes have taken place in the past 20 years after finally opening up doors to the outside world?

[beerdang]

I was saying things based on my personal experiences. I've never met anyone who is black while I was in China and I've never had the right education about discrimination there.

I've changed simply because I am still a human and have a heart.

[nanxi]

deleted

[beerdang]

[Linda L.]

The pioneers do establish the base information upon which future generations generalize. Prejudices arise from first impressions.

Are we not all ambassadors for our respective countries?

Those [teachers] who come to China to party, have a sex holiday, or trip out by tripping around China make it so hard for the real foreign teacher to get any respect in China.

Yes the pioneers do establish the image and in China it is not good.

[NumberOneSon]