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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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 Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2005 2:10 am Post subject: |
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| JimDunlop2 wrote: |
Now, now people. Remember to give the guy the benefit of a doubt... Not everyone writes like Hemmingway at age 22.
I think the senior forum contributors have done more than enough to answer the OP's original questions... If you have nothing more to contribute, there's plenty of people in China Off-Topic to go pick on....  |
Sorry about that chief. Just rediscovering my wings here. |
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Zzonkmiles
Joined: 05 Apr 2003
Posts: 309
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| Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2005 3:53 am Post subject: |
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One thing that bothers me about this thread (it's not the first time someone has raised this particular question, and I'm sure it won't be the last) is how someone can admit to having no qualifications whatsoever and still feel there SHOULD be a way for them to get over here and TEACH. TEACH. Is the status of EFL teaching really that low? So low that people can fairly equate it to being a paid conversation partner in a foreign land?
When you study a foreign language in high school or at a university, you better believe those teachers are qualified--probably more qualified than the majority of us here. Why should it be different for us when we want to teach in Japan? The fact that most of the teaching gigs here are of the eikaiwa variety shouldn't factor THAT heavily into the notion that someone should feel ENTITLED to work here even though their qualifications are nonexistent.
I really don't understand this. |
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JimDunlop2
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Posts: 2286
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2005 4:06 am Post subject: |
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Zzonk: Are you a Simpsons fan? I think I can totally understand this. It's like when Homer goes to the community college and sees many of the townspeople teaching courses on topics they know a lot about (e.g. tobacco chewing, how to get a man, self-defence) so Homer wants to become a teacher too.... The administrator at the college figures he's qualified to teach a course on how to have a successful marriage because he is married and has children. Hilarity ensues.
Anyway, I guess what I'm trying to get at, is that people feel qualified to teach a language (in this case, English) because it's their native language and speaking it is something they're good at.
I see the same phenomenon here in Japan. 90% of all the Japanese teachers I've had here have been absolutely AWFUL. Why? Because they are not qualified to teach. Sure, they speak Japanese, but when it comes to teaching it effectively, they fail miserably.
Obviously, the Japanese government doesn't see eye-to-eye with you on this one though, because if they did, there would be no such thing as a WHV and you'd need a teaching certificate in order to get an instructor's visa...
At the same time, I've also seen plenty of completely unqualified people make wonderful teachers. I just wish I could meet more of them.  |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2005 4:16 am Post subject: |
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| Zzonkmiles wrote: |
When you study a foreign language in high school or at a university, you better believe those teachers are qualified--probably more qualified than the majority of us here. Why should it be different for us when we want to teach in Japan? The fact that most of the teaching gigs here are of the eikaiwa variety shouldn't factor THAT heavily into the notion that someone should feel ENTITLED to work here even though their qualifications are nonexistent.
I really don't understand this. |
Zzonkmiles
ever heard the saying "those who can, do, those who can't, TEACH"?
Its this idea since time immemorial that gives people who are born in certain countries the belief that they have magical powers to become educators based on the simple ability to speak English. the ESL industry is premised on the belief that all one needs is a native accent and a degree for the visa.
Language teachers in the US etc on the other hand, usually have degrees, teaching diplomas, high school or university teahcing experience. Not only that many of them are bilingual or trlingual.
There is simply this belief that eikaiwa is "teaching" but it doesnt require formal qualifications to be considered a teaching professional. there is a nod and a wink to the notion that it requires training and technical skill to learn how to teach properly, but that doesnt let things like CELTA and graduate degrees get in the way of getting a paying job to pay off loans, visit Japan etc.
I have seen many posters talking about wanting to work for professional schools, but such a thing does not exist. A school is just a group of buildings and classrooms. Owners are running a profit oriented business, and many owners (NOVA) are not teachers. Its not schools that are professional but its the teachers that make up that school,. and one can hardly be 'professional' when one comes here on a semi-tourist visa seeking paying work.
Want to be professional? Get a CELTA or proper ESL teaching qualifications to call yourself professional. Lets see how many step up to the plate then. Otherwise you can not call them teachers, but as you call them, paid conversation partners. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2005 4:23 am Post subject: |
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| JimDunlop2 wrote: |
Z
At the same time, I've also seen plenty of completely unqualified people make wonderful teachers. I just wish I could meet more of them. |
Jim
can I ask you whether you would want such people teaching your kids, or you found out your kids grade school teacher had only a high school education and no formal teaching qualifications? Would you accept that person simply because they were "popular" or had an agreeable personality? This is what passes for teaching ESL in japan. Dont rock the boat, be enthusiastic, interesting and sociable. No one actually asks about formal teaching qualifications and ability. I might be able to fly airplanes well enough but they wont let me take passengers without a pilot's licence.
There are great "teachers" without pieces of paper but doesnt that simply add to the problem, that you think such qualifications are unnnecessary, becuase you happen to think he/she can teach well? How many born-natural teachers do you come across in your lifetime? |
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Ovid
Joined: 24 Oct 2004
Posts: 13
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| Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:07 am Post subject: Re: Making something out of nothing |
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| Jizzo T. Clown wrote: |
| theprof00 wrote: |
I'm also a French-American citizen(dual citizenship).
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Could someone explain how dual citizenship is possible?
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You hold citizenship in two countries...hence, dual.
There are several posts in the Romanian forum concerning this issue including the false rumor that Americans cannot hold dual citizenships or that they must denounce their prior ones. |
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JimDunlop2
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Posts: 2286
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 1:16 am Post subject: |
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| PAULH wrote: |
can I ask you whether you would want such people teaching your kids, or you found out your kids grade school teacher had only a high school education and no formal teaching qualifications? |
I'd prefer if they didn't. But if I found out that was indeed the case, I would probably request to sit in on several classes to find out who this person was before pulling my kids from the class. It's very hard for me to envision this particular scenario in the first place, as I'd say it's pretty unrealistic even for Japan. It's not like you have only high-school-educated people teaching grade school.... An English conversation class maybe, but not as a regular teacher.
| PAULH wrote: |
There are great "teachers" without pieces of paper but doesnt that simply add to the problem, that you think such qualifications are unnnecessary, becuase you happen to think he/she can teach well? How many born-natural teachers do you come across in your lifetime? |
I don't think I ever said that I thought such qualifications were unneccessary. In fact, I was trying to get at the polar opposite... I was saying that the majority of the Japanese teachers I've had were pretty bad due to their lack of teaching qualification... I was however wishing that I could meet more "natural born" teachers in my lifetime. The other part of my post was a response to Zzonk's comment regarding his frustration at people who think they SHOULD have a way to come here to teach without qualifications, and why I thought this phenomenon existed. In no way was I trying to indicate that I disagreed with his point.
Sorry if there was any confusion. |
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