Job Discussion Forums

[bnix]

The Wolf's Lair(Polish Vlky Szaniec(sp)? is in near Ketrzyn(SP) in northern Poland,not so far from Olblag.
During WWII,when the Nazis controlled part of Poland,Hitler had this place built as sort of a secret retreat.The bunkers,mostly covered with moss are still there...although they have turned the one Hitler stayed in briefly(just visiting) into a sort of motel..and now you can stay overnight there.An interesting place

[grahamb]

bnix, isn't that where they tried to blow him up in 1944?

[bnix]

You are right.They did try to blow him up there.It was a conspiracy among German military men who wanted to get rid of Der Fuehrer.I believe they were having some kind of briefing,and one German placed his"briefcase"(containing a bomb) next to Hitler.For some reason,though,the case was moved further away from Hitler,and hence he was only injured in the blast.I do not recall all of the exact details,but I think other people were killed.In retaliation, hundreds(including some people who were completely innocent of any involvement) were executed.I believe(I am not sure) that somehow they implicated Rommel in the plot.Of course,several movies have been made about it.I could very easily be wrong on some of the details.But yes,you are right.

[grahamb]

Just to add a bit of gory detail, some of the conspirators were hanged with piano wire. Their death agonies were filmed, presumably for Adolf's amusement.
If only he hadn't been rejected for art school.

[Alex Shulgin]

Yet more inaccuracies from the self appointed guru on Poland. Shame he hasn�t spent more days here before awarding himself expert status.

Anyway here are the facts (to be repeated in an article on the place to be published in the Warsaw Insider in September)

The Polish name is Wilczy Szaniec and it is a long way from Olbag (which is a suburb of Lublin). It is 83 kilometres from Olsztyn. Olsztyn is 97 kilometres from Elbląg so I guess it would be about 170 kilometres from Elbląg to Kętrzyn.
The area was called East Prussia and was part of Germany for many hundreds of years. It became Polish only after WWII. It was not a secret retreat, it was one of the Fuhrerhauptquartier (residences of Hitler). It�s existance was not secret and its location was well known to the Russians, Americans and British. That�s why the bunkers had walls 8 metres thick, so bombs would have no effect on them!
Hitler did not stay there �briefly just visiting� he spent more than 800 days there between 1941 and 1944. His bunker is most certainly not a motel. To claim so is an insult to the Polish people. Hitler�s bunker was blown up in 1945 (altho� the explosives packed inside only partly destroyed it). What is now the restaurant and hotel on the 2.5 square kilometre site is a rebuilt building which stands on the site of what was the SS security detachment garage and barracks for drivers.

If you want to know about Poland then check out some of the online versions of publications such as the Warsaw Business Journal, the Warsaw Insider, the New Warsaw Express and In Your Pocket (different versions for different cities). Don�t bother listening to a word bnix says!

[grahamb]

"Self-appointed guru on Poland?" Self-awarded "expert status?" Methinks the gentleman doth protest too much.
bnix is one of the most sensible people on this forum. He doesn't strike me as having an inflated opinion of himself.
By the way, Alex, East Prussia wasn't "part of Germany for hundreds of years" because Germany wasn't unified until 1871. Wilhelm the first was proclaimed Kaiser in (if I remember rightly) the Hall of Mirrors in the Palace of Versailles, just after Prussia's victory over France.

[bnix]

Alex.S.,I am not the "self-appointed guru" on Poland.Nor did I award myself"expert status".Those are YOUR words! As a matter of fact,in my original post,I state I could very well be wrong on the details.Does that sound like somebody assuming the mantle of "self appointed guru?"Sheesh!

Maybe Alex was just having a bad day or something.It is very nice that he provided all of those exact distances and all of that.Of course,anybody can check that out fairly easily through reference books,etc.

Lordy,I guess some people will use any excuse to flame,even a little innocent post on Poland,in which the poster states explicitly he might not be right on all of the details.Maybe Alex wants to be The Guru of Poland?

[Alex Shulgin]

You're the one coming on here and telling people how you know all about tiny places in Poland. I'm the one who gets paid to write about them. You most certainly didn't say "I could be wrong" in your first post, it was only when somnebody pulled you up on it and appeared that they just might know more than you that you started the "I could be wrong on some details... I don't recall" line (little things like what it is called, where it is and what it was).

There's no need to read reference books for accurate information. Just read a magazine like the Warsaw Insider.

[bnix]

Hey,you are the expert,if that pleases you.I NEVER claimed to be an expert.I have visited the place in question.I have lived and taught in Poland.I do not claim that makes me an expert.I never claimed that.So you write for some newspaper,magazine or whatever.Very nice.If you want to be an expert,fine.As a matter of fact,I have visited a lot of places in Poland.It does not take an expert to visit places.Of course,I have not visited a lot of places in Poland,too.I put up an innocent,innocuous little post on Poland,and you got all bent out of shape,claiming I was setting myself up as a "guru" or something.Don't you feel even a little ridiculous,starting something out of nothing?I am not an expert on the subject.Satisfied? However,I can continue to post,as long as I follow the guidelines.What do you think this is,a literary journal? It is Dave's Cafe,not Alex's Cafe.Or maybe you just wanted to start an argument?

[scot47]

There is lots of stiuff on the "Wolf's Lair" in the "Rough Guide" and the "Lonely Planet", but I suppose EFL teachers in Poland get paid so littlel that they cannot afford to buy books.

It is also interesting that so many know so little about Modern European History.

[Alex Shulgin]

Buy books?! We're so poor that we can't even afford a bus ticket to get to the bookshop! We have to walk to the library. Just ask bnix, he's got all the latest information on what it's really like here in Poland!

[scot47]

So why do people condemn themselves to poverty ? No money to buy books ? And you choose this lifestyle ?

My memories of Poland are coloured by the tangible xenophobia and racism, directed at Jews, Germans, Blacks and Arabs.

[bnix]

Well,Scot,I am sure Mr.Expert,Know It ALL Alex S. will stick in his two cents.
But anyway,Scot,sometimes people go to a country just because they want to...although they know the money is not so great.It is not always a case of condemning themselves to a life of poverty.And although I am certainly not an expert of Mr.Shulgin's calibre,I am certainly not a newbie,either.
Of course,there is much more money in Saudi than Poland(teaching-wise).Racism?Xenophobia?Scot...you know it exists in Saudi....too. For example,what about the attitude in Saudi towards all of those TCNs(third country nationals)?
As a matter of fact,racism is a pretty widespread phenomenon,and certainly is not limited to Poland.Although the money is much better in Saudi...Saudi is not really that terrific,although as you well know,some jobs in Saudi are better than others.But you are still left with Saudi in general... But if you like it...

[scot47]

Different strokes for different folks. My main reason for accepting the horrors of Saudi Arabia is the money. Personally I am always a bit suspicious of those who take vows of poverty as part of their teaching career.

And although I have visited Poland often I would not consider teaching there unless they upped the salaries to a reasonable level. Maybe aroung 2000 Euros a month - with accommodation ? That is unlikely to happen.

What gor me about the racist attitude prevallent amongst Poles was that it was combined with the expectation of sympathy for the Poles who suffered under German, Russian and Austrian occupation.

[Alex Shulgin]

Sorry Scot you seem to have misread my message. Despite what bnix spreads about the pay being terrible it is actually possible to make a pretty good living here. bnix worked for a school where they quickly judged his ability and paid him what he is worth. However schools here are prepared to pay much more than he ever got. In Warsaw the average rate at the better schools is 50PLN for 45 minutes (that's about US$13) but there are places which go as high as 75PLN per 45 minutes. You can charge 75PLN per 45 minutes for private students with no problem at all. I personally make around 6000PLN to 7000PLN a month after tax (that's up to US$1800). I work about 25 hours per week (including writing work and private lessons).

You're right about the racism. It IS gettting better tho'. I've certainly seen changes in the years I've been here. Smaller towns and poorer cities have more of a problem with it but then that is true everywhere in the world!