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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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 Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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| D.O.S. wrote: |
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| As for being the "Oracle", you learn a lot about the country in 19 years of living here. |
Some people can live in a place for a long time and still get things wrong. Each individual is different. |
calling your boss a racist which you obviously take great offence to is not always wrong as many ARE racists and discriminatory, as you can see the above poster is talking in generalities and hypothetical situations. I can therefore answer generally or hypothetically.
Either you are simply being politically correct or are simply here to start an argument.
I dont know all things about Japan, just after 19 years here I know a lot more than most people, as I also speak the language and have a family here. Im not an expert on JET ALTs or dispatch companies and last worked for an eikaiwa in 1992. |
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shikushiku-boy
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 49
Location: Melbourne
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 1:11 am Post subject: Message received and understood |
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PAULH, you have made your position very clear.
I understand your advice.
I sincerely thank you for taking the time to respond
to my original posting.
Enough of the questions already!
I never expected the Spanish Inquisition!
Clearly you are of the aquiesce or "quit and move on"
school of thought. If that works for you, that's great.
I wish you many more happy years of teaching in Japan.
Message received and understood.
I will continue my (naive?) quest for a 'middle way'.
I thank you. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 1:19 am Post subject: Re: Message received and understood |
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I am of the "call a spade a spade" school of thinking. You asked how to get on with your boss but it sounds like it may be you thats part of the problem. Unless you are willing to acknowledge what it is that makes you get offside with your boss there wont be any progress. Blaming your boss for problems that are of your making and your refusal to assimilate in a foreign culture doesnt solve anything. You seem to think that people behaving in a 'Japanese' way is a cop out and a sell-out. No wonder you are having problems. Its like being the obnoxious Yank in Europe thinking hes still in Kansas or Detroit and everyone must bend to his way.
You are ultimately dealing with people, not nationalities and most bosses I have found to be reasonable and open to negotiation. those that aren't you cant and wont change so you work around them and just grin and bear it, or change jobs.
Yes, quit and move on, rather than try and move mountains. Know what your legal rights are and dont be antagonistic, and self-righteous for its own sake. You are no longer in your country and can not expect them to bend to your way of thinking and behavior that you expect in your own country. You are dispensable so they see no real reason why they should accomodate or negotiate with you.
| shikushiku-boy wrote: |
PAULH, you have made your position very clear.
I understand your advice.
I sincerely thank you for taking the time to respond
to my original posting.
I thank you. |
Last edited by PAULH on Mon Mar 13, 2006 2:29 am; edited 1 time in total |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 1:27 am Post subject: Re: Message received and understood |
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| shikushiku-boy wrote: |
I will continue my (naive?) quest for a 'middle way'.
I thank you. |
If you are naive it means you are basically ignorant and gullible and you are using that as an excuse for inaction and letting him walk all over you. I am giving you advice that you should educate and arm yourself and speak from a position of authority and equality. You wont dominate your boss but you will at least speak to him on equal terms rather than dig your heels in and refuse to budge from your position.
Saying there are lines you wont cross simply indicates you are stubborn and obstinate and want the mountain to come to Moses.
You havent said in your post yest what it exactly is that you are doing that causes problems with you and your boss. Not knowing that its impossible to give constructive advice. Your posts tend to speak in generalities and hypothetical scenarios. |
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D.O.S.
Joined: 02 Apr 2003
Posts: 108
Location: TOKYO (now)/ LONDON
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 2:33 am Post subject: |
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| calling your boss a racist which you obviously take great offence to is not always wrong as many ARE racists and discriminatory, |
But you accused the original contributor of being racist and an "uncle Tom". Try re-reading what you wrote.
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| Either you are simply being politically correct or are simply here to start an argument. |
No. I'm simply objecting to words that you wrote. Perhaps if you were more careful in your writing you wouldn't have people calling you out. So "sue me."
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| I dont know all things about Japan, just after 19 years here I know a lot more than most people, as I also speak the language and have a family here. |
You aren't the "only" one who has been in Japan a long time.
In fact, I have read many of your contributions here and find many of them simply 'wrong.'
You may be describing your reality, but it's yours. I find my personal experiences to be vastly different than yours. That may be due to our nationalities, our backgrounds, but I disagree with many of the things you write. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 3:14 am Post subject: Re: dangerous combination |
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| shikushiku-boy wrote: |
E
A big, inflexible, bureaucratic, obdurate, overly officious Japanese corporation. |
This sounds to me like a stereotypical racist comment. It probably wouldnt be racist if he didnt mention Japanese and he implies that all Japanese companies are like that.
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| I wish I could tell you that I quit my job with the big, etc., etc. Japanese corparation, and went on to a better, higher paid job...but I didn�t. I raised the white flag and ran away home. I fought the Corparation, and the Corparation won! |
Again, labelling his company by race or nationality.
Would be be less racist if he said big British company or big US company? Does it matter that the company is Japanese?
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| I approached the big, etc., etc. Japanese corparation for re-employment. I called them; their response was so cold I think my ear was frostbitten. I have definitely burnt that bridge behind me. |
See above comment. Guy quits job and buggers off home with tail between his legs after shi-tting in his own pool. What kind of response was he expecting?
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| I�ve seen some gaijin just bend over and take whatever the company dishes out, while maintaining the appropriate facial expression. And it seems to work quite well. One of these gaijin became a Nova assistant trainer (big whoop!). |
I didnt say the OP was an Uncle Tom but he obviously objected to other foreigners acting like it or being apologists so they could advance in their jobs. he has problems with non-Japanese acting in a Japanese way. it would be like me going to live in harlem and become a gangsta rapper.
And what may I ask is the appropriate facial expression?
The OP did not even complete his contract let alone get a promotion and be in a position to comment about his superiors. Big whoop for someone who didnt even get that far but chickened out.
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| I�ve seen some gaijin become hyper-pseudo-Japanese employees (e.g. going into peko-peko overdrive to get what they want), and that seemed to work quite well too. |
What is a hyper-pseudo Japanese employee? Is there something wrong with acting in that way? This sentence reeks of contempt for employees who act like that. Its not racism against foreigners but racism against Japanese that such behavior is unacceptable if done by foreigners and that when foreigners do that they become 'less western' and compromise their identity.
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| I�ve tried the first approach. But it only lasted about six months. Then my big, fat mouth got me into all sorts of trouble. I�ve never been able to do the peko-peko thing convincingly. I�m sorry, but I�m just not made that way. |
I have no idea what peko-peko is except that he's hungry. Im not familiar with his usage of the term. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 3:27 am Post subject: |
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| D.O.S. wrote: |
| But you accused the original contributor of being racist and an "uncle Tom". Try re-reading what you wrote. |
See comments below. he obviously has trouble with his Japanese corporation and the ass-kissing of his foreign co-workers.
| Quote: |
You aren't the "only" one who has been in Japan a long time.
In fact, I have read many of your contributions here and find many of them simply 'wrong.' |
So where were you when i needed correcting and enlightenment? 56 posts to your name and suddenly get your ti-ts in a tangle over things I write after posting on here for about 5 years.
My posts are not the be-all and end-all but i havent seen your posts here except on the general forums.
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| You may be describing your reality, but it's yours. I find my personal experiences to be vastly different than yours. That may be due to our nationalities, our backgrounds, but I disagree with many of the things you write. |
Maybe you can tell me what your truths are, where I'm mistaken and then we will both be wiser. Much better than chucking eggs and verbal grenades with no supporting arguments from the bleachers. Just saying I'm wrong with no explanation doesnt solve anything. |
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shikushiku-boy
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 49
Location: Melbourne
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 3:56 am Post subject: Poor man... |
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Yes, yes, yes, PAULH.
You have made your position very clear.
Pleae, don't let me keep you any longer.
I'm sure there must be others who need your harangue
(whoops!), I mean, enlightenment.
God knows I've had just about as much enlightenment
as I can take.
Please, stop, your starting to embarrass yourself.
Take your own advice, and quit and move on.
Your turning this into the Battle of Stalingrad.
Your input was valued and appreciated.
I thank you. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 4:00 am Post subject: Re: Poor man... |
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| No goddamn wonder you cant find a job here. Your attitude sucks, and you are still unemployed. |
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mrjohndub
Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 198
Location: Saitama, Japan
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 5:15 am Post subject: Re: dangerous combination |
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[quote="PAULH it would be like me going to live in harlem and become a gangsta rapper.[/quote]
Sorry if it's off-topic, but I'd like to point out that Harlem has been (historically) and today is still known for jazz. You'd be hard-pressed to find any gangster rappers around those parts.
'Gansta Rap' is a West Coast genre born in the late '80s and early '90s. You'd run into some major roadblocks trying to get a record contract operating out of Harlem, PaulH. Try L.A. instead. Good luck in that endeavor. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 6:07 am Post subject: Re: dangerous combination |
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| mrjohndub wrote: |
| 'Gansta Rap' is a West Coast genre born in the late '80s and early '90s. You'd run into some major roadblocks trying to get a record contract operating out of Harlem, PaulH. Try L.A. instead. Good luck in that endeavor. |
At this rate I have more chance of becoming a white rapper in LA than OP has a successful chance of being re-employed here at an entry-level plain vanilla eikaiwa position unless something drastically changes. |
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D.O.S.
Joined: 02 Apr 2003
Posts: 108
Location: TOKYO (now)/ LONDON
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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PAULH
So where were you when i needed correcting and enlightenment? 56 posts to your name and suddenly get your ti-ts in a tangle over things I write after posting on here for about 5 years. |
The only "ti-ts in a tangle" are yours. I post when I have the time and don't see a need to add my two yen into every discussion.
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PAULH
Maybe you can tell me what your truths are, where I'm mistaken and then we will both be wiser. Much better than chucking eggs and verbal grenades with no supporting arguments from the bleachers. Just saying I'm wrong with no explanation doesnt solve anything. |
Simply, I find a lot of what you write is in error. Not for simple factual things, such as writing a cv, finding a hotel, but in a broader way.
Look at it this way. Clive Owen and Herve Villechaize walk into a nightclub full of young eligible women. For both of them, the music is the same, the decor is the same, the maritinis taste the same. However, at the end of the night both are going to have vastly different experiences.
I'm not saying you are deliberately misleading anyone, only that my Japan experiences have been different than yours, and I arrived here before you did, if that matters.
| Quote: |
PAULH
Guy quits job and buggers off home with tail between his legs after shi-tting in his own pool |
| Quote: |
PAULH
No goddamn wonder you cant find a job here. Your attitude sucks, and you are still unemployed |
| Quote: |
PAULH
At this rate I have more chance of becoming a white rapper in LA than OP has a successful chance of being re-employed here at an entry-level plain vanilla eikaiwa position unless something drastically changes |
Charges of racism. "Uncle Tom". Now "your attitude sucks." Is this needed? Is it helpful?
It leads me to wonder who truly has the attitude problem and who truly has employment issues. |
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MrCAPiTUL
Joined: 06 Feb 2006
Posts: 232
Location: Taipei, Taiwan
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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Hmm. Welcome to the world of being a minority! I think that, ultimately, is what drives people crazy about Japan (at least, that is how it would appear). It seems most are used to being the white majority in a judeo-christian based society. When thrown out of that eliment, they realize that being a minority sucks ass!
The best advice I have is to just observe. Suck it up until you know how to play the game. Take your lumps, learn how to do the dance. Once you figure out the motives behind the action, the mindset, and the strategies others employ (on the job w/YOUR particular employer) to deal with the big man, you can tango, my brother. That goes with ANY job. You have to learn EACH COMPANY's CULTURE!!! Every place is a little different. If you do all of the above and that doesn't work - perhaps look for a different country to work in. Maybe your disposition isn't harmonious w/the Japanese's. It is possible. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 11:15 pm Post subject: |
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| D.O.S. wrote: |
Charges of racism. "Uncle Tom". Now "your attitude sucks." Is this needed? Is it helpful?
It leads me to wonder who truly has the attitude problem and who truly has employment issues. |
Not to brag here, (which you will accuse me of anyway) is I have been posting on this forums a long time, and what both Glenski and i have found time and time again, is you get some newbie asking for advice, and when he doesnt like the answers he hears, right or wrong, he then attacks the messenger, and it gets personal. They then start accusing me of being negative, holier-than -thou, whatever. I'm not the one looking for a job and advice here.
I have nothing to prove here, I still have a good-paying job and I still live here. he doesnt have to accept my advice but seeing as you are not prone to 'giving your two cents worth' this is about the best advice he is going to get. I will also remind him i have worked at NOVA and eikaiwas. My current job i have had for the last 3 years.Rather than shoot your mouth off from the bleachers why don't YOU give him some constructive advice? Your opinion is as valid as mine. All you have said is that mine is invalid. What do you bring to the party?
I only have employment issues because my university contracts are non-renewable and capped at three years. That has not stopped me working here for the last twenty years, and I have close to 90% probability of finding work when my current contract ends.
Im not sure what this has to do with anything though. I have given advice that he needs to change his attitude that his attitude is part of the problem and not part of the solution, and as long as he has a smug, arrogant attitude that says employers should come crawling to him and meeting him half-way on shakey premises he will stay in Australia and not find a job here.
Having NOVA say they wont hire you, in my opinion must be a bit of a blow to his ego, but as long as he believes employers here owe him a living and that they have to put up with his sh-it then he has another think coming. |
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D.O.S.
Joined: 02 Apr 2003
Posts: 108
Location: TOKYO (now)/ LONDON
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| Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2006 11:23 pm Post subject: |
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| i have found time and time again, is you get some newbie asking for advice, and when he doesnt like the answers he hears, right or wrong, he then attacks the messenger, and it gets personal. They then start accusing me of being negative, holier-than -thou, whatever. |
So you attack him first. He's 'racist', an 'uncle Tom', will leave with his tail between his legs. He has a:
| Quote: |
| smug, arrogant attitude |
I find your comments unhelpful and offensive.
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| Having NOVA say they wont hire you, in my opinion must be a bit of a blow to his ego, but as long as he believes employers here owe him a living and that they have to put up with his sh-it then he has another think coming. |
Immature, unhelpful. Ridiculous. If this is the way you give advice I sincerely suggest you stay in the bullpen, Herve. |
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