Job Discussion Forums

saint57 · Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 12:51 am Post subject: Back to Salaries

This is for all the people who claim 20,000 yuan a month is possible in China. Why not go to Korea? The absolute minimum starting salary is 15,119.72 yuan per month and the lowest end of the private scale is 250 yuan per hour? People actually approach you on the street to do privates. Why would someone with money on the mind choose China over Korea? Culture? How do you enjoy the culture if you're busting you're ass all the time? Cost of living? Korea and China are both what you make them.

Spiderman Too · Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 1:20 am Post subject:

I think that South Korea, Japan and Taiwan are great locations for young, energetic F.T.s who have not been in the EFL game for very long (and are, therefore, a long way from approaching the burn-out danger zone).

For a mid 40s (approaching) 9 year veteran, the mixture of teaching duties (no kids!) / salary / working conditions / living conditions (no sharing apartments!) needs to be far more balanced.

But, sure, if salary is by far and away an F.T.s primary concern (perhaps due to student loans, car loans, building a nest egg to return home and do an MA), then China is not the place to be, nor are Thailand, Vietnam, Cambodia, Indonesia et al.

saint57 · Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 1:28 am Post subject:

Agreed Spiderman Too, but my experience showed me that there are just as many people chasing money in China. Korea paid my tuition and China gave me the experience to get where I wanted. Busting your ass in language schools to earn "big bucks" in China makes no sense to me.

Joe C. · Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:13 am Post subject:

Could it be that in Korea, Japan and Taiwan higher qualifications are required that some of those who end up in the Mainland cannot meet?

In any event, I don't think the equation is so simple. Many people end up in China because of some fascination with an "ancient" society, the language, future growth possibilities, et al. Heck, I know two people who are here simply because China has no extradition treaty with America (Am I allowed to name names???).

To pull in 20k a month one really doesn't need to work themselves to death here. Also, I am certain that 20k goes much further here in China than it does in Taiwan or Japan. Not sure about Korea though.

jammish · Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 1704

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jammish · Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 1704

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jammish · Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 1704

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jammish · Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 1704

Hmmm... most jobs in China pay 4000-8000 a month, with some in Beijing and Shanghai (a city which can be more expensive than London!) paying a bit more.

20,000 is not easy to come by as a regular salary. It may be possible for those willing to work all hours in various extra jobs, or for those with the qualifications to work at certain select establishments, e.g. those teaching Academic English which require a Masters Degree, or an International School. But for a regular, 20 hour a week, ESL job, 20,000 is way over the odds.

On the other hand, you can get that in Korea just for a bog standard position.

That said, even 8000 a month isn't bad for saving reasonable amounts, at least compared to my prior experience of living in London, and life being so expensive that it was very difficult to save anything at all.

Joe C. · Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 3:52 am Post subject:

bendan · Joined: 18 Jun 2004 Posts: 739 Location: North China

Voldermort · Joined: 14 Apr 2004 Posts: 597

Everybody keeps talking of student debts, credit card payments, mortgages etc... But in all honesty I have yet to meet any FT who meets any of this criterea. The closest was sometime two years ago when I was working alongside a Canadian. He told me of his commitments back home, property and credit cards. Yet when I asked him "Why come to China..." his reply was quite logical. Apparently he owned a few apartments which he let out, these covered all his expenses. On top of that he left all his financial affairs with his brother.

I will second or even forty second the fact that China is not the place to be if you want to make money. Who the hell cares about these 20k jobs? 5k is more than enough to have an enjoyable life here. On less than 5k I support me, my wife and her family. I by am not restricted to cheap restaurants, infact I still manage to save a large portion of my salary. And before anybody says anything, no I do not live in a backwater little village where 10yuan can buy a new Merc.

It simply annoys me to hear people complaining about or demanding high salaries, only to send/take the money back out of China. Why do you think our contracts state how much we can exchange? Yes I know schools are rich, teachers are poor, or so they like you to think. Why not ask these "oh so poor" Chinese teachers how long they have been working for a particular school, and what their real salary is, including perks! You would be shocked to discover they are earning closer to 4k.

Sure you can find jobs paying 10-15k and more, but they will expect you to earn that wage. Infact you have a better chance of earning that figure simply by staying with a school for longer that a few years. Any newly opened school, will be unwilling to pay a higher salary for any new teacher. Those older schools (with FT experience) will know that teachers are easy to come by and also know that good teachers are not. Most Chinese think in terms of contracts, an FT contract being 1 year and CT contracts being 5+ years.

Roger · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 9138

High salaries are not for "footloose" (not my word) tourist teachers, amateur English instructors or oral pedagogues; these high-salaried situations are for those that commit themselves and plan on climbing career steps in the same school.

We are seldom expected to stay more than one year, and hardly any FT wants to commit himself/herself to a term longer than one year. Hence there is no need to crow about poor pay in Cathay! What we get is ample and fair enough

vikdk · Joined: 25 Jun 2003 Posts: 1676

Roger how has your status as a non-qualified teacher and non-native English speaker effected your pay scale in the 10 years you've been here - and since the time you were fired as the Shenzhen manager of Altec were you again ever able to command a similar sallary - for example during the two years you worked as a kindergarten teacher?

stillnosheep · Joined: 01 Mar 2004 Posts: 2068 Location: eslcafe

Itsme · Joined: 11 Aug 2004 Posts: 624 Location: Houston, TX

And so you finally hit the nail on the head.

Why run around like a fireman just to make a little extra cash?
I have found in my little time back that I would much rather have the evening off for visiting friends than having an hour and a half block of time in the middle of the night for teaching, which thus rules out doing anything either before or afterwards with friends.

As for Korea, my main qualm with that was the bad bad contracts that I received. They were not willing to fill in the huge gaps because other Fts were happy to take them as they were.

My main point was not that one SHOULD go after 20 K a month but that one CAN. There are more jobs than just teaching English. Some people do voice recordings and some people are bar bouncers. It comes down to your level of satisfaction.