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shuize
Joined: 04 Sep 2004
Posts: 1270
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 Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:02 pm Post subject: |
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| yamanote senbei wrote: |
UNTIL, Shuize.
Your inability to read the English language doesn't impress me either, Shuize. Luckily there will always be a place for you at Gaba. |
You can hang your hat on the "until" to try and make sense of the earlier post if you like. But if one really knew punitive damages are not used in any cases here, why bother to single out gyomu itaku cases in particular?
| Quote: |
| Until it becomes unprofittable (in the way of punitive damages being awarded) in gyomu itaku cases, the fact that it's illegal probably won't impress many people. |
Last edited by shuize on Tue Apr 25, 2006 3:43 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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JimDunlop2
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Posts: 2286
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 3:04 pm Post subject: |
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Oh for the love of Mike, shuize, would you drop it already?  You're making yourself look foolish.
My knowledge of written English has fewer flaws than you would like to believe, and as for the validity of my statement, I stand by what I wrote. Perhaps I should rephrase it for those of us who may be a little slow on the uptake...
The only way any anti-gyomu itaku law is going to have any clout is if non-compliance results in offenders being punished. No punishment = no one cares = status quo. How hard can that concept be to understand?  |
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shuize
Joined: 04 Sep 2004
Posts: 1270
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| Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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| JimDunlop2 wrote: |
| ... My knowledge of written English has fewer flaws than you would like to believe, and as for the validity of my statement, I stand by what I wrote. Perhaps I should rephrase it for those of us who may be a little slow on the uptake... |
Funny.
You can stand by it or rephrase as you like. However, speaking of being slow on the uptake, here's a little hint: It really doesn't make much sense to offer to rephrase if you're going to "stand by what [you] wrote."
Regardless of what decision you finally reach on the stand by/rephrase question, however, the fact is "punitive damages" are never awarded in Japan. |
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cornishmuppet
Joined: 27 Mar 2004
Posts: 642
Location: Nagano, Japan
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 5:12 am Post subject: |
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Despite what everyone says I still find it hard to believe that any company can be acting as illegally as everyone claims and yet the beaurocracy of Japan does nothing about it. I had to get a form stamped and authorized just to say I had a place to park my car for God`s sake, yet apparently all these dispatch companies responsible for the employment of thousands of people are acting completely illegally, especially when their clients are the government-run Boards of Education?
The system seems so tight on everything else. I mean, who says they`re illegal? Surely if its the government, who should be setting the laws, then they wouldn't be using them?
It just doesn`t make any sense to me. |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 6:14 am Post subject: |
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| cornishmuppet wrote: |
| Despite what everyone says I still find it hard to believe that any company can be acting as illegally as everyone claims and yet the beaurocracy of Japan does nothing about it. |
Basic rule of Japanese beaurocracy: The bigger the hassle in changing something, the less likely anyone will do anything about it.
for example,
| cornishmuppet wrote: |
I had to get a form stamped and authorized just to say I had a place to park my car for God`s sake,
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You don't think Japanese people know there are easier ways to go about doing things? They do, it's just that it's a case of "That's the way it's always been done, and if you didn't have to get a form signed, then the person you take the form to would no longer have a job, creating a bigger problem, because government jobs are for life"
| cornishmuppet wrote: |
yet apparently all these dispatch companies responsible for the employment of thousands of people are acting completely illegally, especially when their clients are the government-run Boards of Education?
The system seems so tight on everything else. I mean, who says they`re illegal? Surely if its the government, who should be setting the laws, then they wouldn't be using them? |
BoEs are much more independent of the federal government than this implies. See no evil, hear no evil= there is no evil. Keep in mind that these companies benefit local Boards of Education by making ALTs (a huge source of stress for those involved) hassle-free and cheaper at the same time. Sounds like win-win (for the BoE- a pain in the ass-lose situation for the ALT, who pretty much doesn't count).
| cornishmuppet wrote: |
| It just doesn`t make any sense to me. |
Does it still bother you in daily life when the answer to most of the questions you have about Japan and Japanese people are met with the response "We are Japanese."? A lot of the time it doesn't make much sense to them either, it's just that life in Japan can be summed up with advice from Yoda:
| Yoda wrote: |
| There is no why. |
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abufletcher
Joined: 14 Sep 2005
Posts: 779
Location: Shikoku Japan (for now)
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 6:48 am Post subject: |
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Sounds to me like a classic sort of "vote with your feet" sort of situation. The only real way to force change is to somehow convince people not to take these sorts of jobs.
EFL is not a coal-mine. People DO NOT have to take such jobs just to put bread on the table. But I suppose as long as Japan can keep cashing in on it's "mystique" among young westerners, there will always be a long line of waiting for "their turn in Japan." |
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cornishmuppet
Joined: 27 Mar 2004
Posts: 642
Location: Nagano, Japan
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 7:09 am Post subject: |
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Gambate wrote
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cornishmuppet wrote:
Despite what everyone says I still find it hard to believe that any company can be acting as illegally as everyone claims and yet the beaurocracy of Japan does nothing about it.
Basic rule of Japanese beaurocracy: The bigger the hassle in changing something, the less likely anyone will do anything about it.
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Yeah, but surely someone had to set the laws in the first place?
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Does it still bother you in daily life when the answer to most of the questions you have about Japan and Japanese people are met with the response "We are Japanese."? A lot of the time it doesn't make much sense to them either, it's just that life in Japan can be summed up with advice from Yoda:
Yoda wrote:
There is no why.
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Nope, still drives me crazy, but I don`t argue about it as much as I used to! Just sigh.....  |
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Tottori-Dood
Joined: 27 Mar 2006
Posts: 44
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 9:57 am Post subject: |
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wonder why?
http://bigdaikon.org
note: not because of the website but because of the mentality of the people that post on it. Seems to me JET gets a lot of retards. |
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JimDunlop2
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Posts: 2286
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 1:07 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, I don't think that's too far from the truth... I wondered over the fence for a peek just to see what I was missing. Conclusion: not much.
http://www.bigdaikon.org/board/viewtopic.php?t=69551
And here we are debating the offensiveness of the word "gaijin." |
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ripslyme
Joined: 29 Jan 2005
Posts: 481
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 3:41 am Post subject: |
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| Tottori-Dood wrote: |
wonder why?
http://bigdaikon.org
note: not because of the website but because of the mentality of the people that post on it. Seems to me JET gets a lot of retards. |
A little perspective here.... After having done both JET and Nova, I feel that bigdaikon is to JET as letsjapan is to eikaiwa. |
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Nagoyaguy
Joined: 15 May 2003
Posts: 425
Location: Aichi, Japan
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| Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 5:35 am Post subject: |
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I'm not sure whether or not boards of education save too much money by using dispatch companies. Frankly, the amount wouldnt matter too much iMHO.
The key is that, when a BofE uses a dispatch company, they are buying peace of mind. The 'crat at the Bof E wont be responsible for the ALT, for their training, care, and so on. Plus, if the ALT somehow has trouble or goes nuts, the BofE factotum is not to blame. The dispatch company takes the fall instead.
It's a form of career insurance. The bofE signs the cheque and is done for the year. Never mind that the students more often than not get an inferior teacher who is not committed to education, and will probably be gone in a year or two. |
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Big John Stud
Joined: 07 Oct 2004
Posts: 513
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| Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 5:59 am Post subject: |
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| Actually the BOE does save money when the JET program provides an ALT(s). The central government pays the salary of JET ALTs not the BOE. |
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shuize
Joined: 04 Sep 2004
Posts: 1270
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| Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Nagoyaguy wrote: |
| Never mind that the students more often than not get an inferior teacher who is not committed to education, and will probably be gone in a year or two. |
Tell me how this is different from JET again ... |
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JaredW
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 105
Location: teaching high school in Sacramento, CA, USA
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| Posted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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| wangtesol wrote: |
Well, it is odd that the Ministry of Education is urging boards of education to use direct hires and the JET Programme as per its 2004 advisement, if it has been decided that the Programme is to be scrapped. I doubt if there has been any official decision. You can always email the man in charge of the ALT system, Mr. Kawano. His email address should be here...
http://alt.150m.com
The current private ALT system of using illegal outsourcing (gyomu itaku) currently under fire from the 90 or so ALTs of Kanagawa who lost their direct hire jobs to Interac. And It is the unscrupulous dealings by Brigham Young University that keeps it afloat by supplying Interac with hundreds of students for these illegal jobs. But hopefully ALTs will be hired directly just like Japanese teachers.
About 25% of the JET Programme has been privatized since 1999.
There is more on illegal outsourcing at the National Union of General Workers Tokyo South website....
http://www.nambufwc.org |
I just wanted to adress one thing only about your post. I attended all three campuses of Brigham Young University and graduated with a BA TESOL. I know with a certain degree of reliability that there are not hudreds of people clamoring to come work in Japan. In fact, the combined number of students of the Hawaii and Utah campuses that are enrolled in the TESOL program cap out around 40 each year.
That's all. About whether or not Interac is unscrupulous, I don't know. That's all.  |
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