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Obarnicle
Joined: 11 May 2006
Posts: 5
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 Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 1:34 am Post subject: Taiwan Visa Applications (Exciting Summer Reading) |
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I've been communicating with one of the well advertised agents in Taiwan about work there for a year. He recommends (as standard procedure) that I get the visitor visa, then, the school I end up working with will eventually convert this into the ARC.
I'm working from the premis that I secure a job from a phone interview. My question is: Wouldn't it be in good faith on the school's end to supply me with an ARC if I truly have a job with them before I arrive there? It seems the visitor visa allows them to back out of long term commitment.
This has caused me to think, why don't I just get an ARC myself?--I'm still in the States. It seems I might need evidence of employment in Taiwan. Otherwise, the fee is the same as for a visitor's visa, $100.
A second question, is it advisable to just book a flight to Taichung on a visitor's visa, cut out the middle man, and count on finding work in a nice school with everthing coming up flowers when I get there? I've a BA, a TESOL minor, no cert., 27, and fairly resourceful, but on a budget, though with only the basics of Mandarin.
-Thanks for any insights. |
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Aristotle
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 1388
Location: Taiwan
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 9:52 am Post subject: |
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Getting an ARC for a job before you arrive is the official policy of the occupational government here on Taiwan. Like so many other official polices it exist only in the minds of a few naive foreigners who have never tried to get an ARC for work on Taiwan. I have heard rumors that it is possible to obey the laws and actually get an ARC before arriving as the official ROC regulations mandate. In all my years on Taiwan, I have never met a teacher that was able to do this.
There is no rule of law on Taiwan only the rule of the most corrupt. To truly understand what that means you need to come to Taiwan and see it for yourself. Teaching in Taiwan is more of an educational experience than anything else. Keep in mind that some lessons are harder to learn than others.
Get a Multiple Entry Visa for Business for Business purposes before you arrive.
Please read this,
10 Steps to Success on Taiwan!
Good luck!
A.
Last edited by Aristotle on Thu Jun 01, 2006 12:47 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Ki
Joined: 23 Jul 2004
Posts: 475
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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A big YES to your second question. Cut out the middle man. Certainly come here first. Don't use a recruiter from overseas. Always sign with the school. It is the school which issues an ARC, like you suggest, recruiters cannot do this.
The recruiter cannot secure you a job just on the basis of a phone interview. When you get here you will find that you need to be interviewed by the school itself as well as do a demo.
Just because an agent is well advertised it doesn't mean that they are well behaved. It doesn't necessarily imply the latter either. Check out buxiban.com about the agent specifically. |
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SanChong
Joined: 22 Nov 2005
Posts: 335
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 5:48 pm Post subject: |
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I agree with Ki about signing WITH an agent. Never sign a contract directly with them (IACC, for example).
However, some agencies can assure you of work before you arrive in Taiwan. They have good relationships with schools and can guarantee you a job. You should be sure to email with a teacher at that school beforehand to be sure that you are going to a good, comfortable and honest shchool which matches your wishes, first, before you commit to anything.
See Buxiban.com for recommended agents/recruiters and schools. |
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Obarnicle
Joined: 11 May 2006
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Fri May 26, 2006 2:21 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for all the replys. I realize not to sign anything with a recruiter/agent, the process I'm involved in so far seems to be with a legit school, who I am to phone interview with directly. The agent so far has been prompt in emails, phone calls, and considerate. What more can one ask.
Still, I have reservations filling out a visitor's visa with the purpose of travel as tourism, rather than work,which is, well, accurate. Is the former really the common practice?
I have to admit though, the picture I'm getting of this whole process of working in Taiwan is full of contradictions and impending subterfuge.
Another big question for me right now: Is there any merit to the above poster's direction of not accepting work in HsinChu under any conditions? What's that based on? Illegallity? |
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clark.w.griswald
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 2056
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| Posted: Sun May 28, 2006 1:55 am Post subject: Re: Taiwan Visa Applications (Exciting Summer Reading) |
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| Obarnicle wrote: |
| I'm working from the premis that I secure a job from a phone interview. My question is: Wouldn't it be in good faith on the school's end to supply me with an ARC if I truly have a job with them before I arrive there? It seems the visitor visa allows them to back out of long term commitment. |
This is a very good question, and the answer comes in several parts.
Firstly, it seems to me that any school that guaranteed you a job from overseas is probably one to be wary of in my opinion. This is a school that is willing to put a teacher in a classroom full of students (most likely kids) based upon what - a resume, a photo, and perhaps a chat on the phone! My best guess is that they are a school that is pretty desperate for a teacher (perhaps a bad reputation here locally), are offering a pretty crap deal (that no one who was here and able to compare jobs would even consider), or are maybe new to the game (and assume that this is the way things are done). I understand your reasoning behind your expectations, but perhaps when you look at things from another perspective you will get a bit of an understanding as to why they are the way that they are.
Secondly, while not suggesting that this applies to you, you would not be the first teacher to accept a job from overseas and then for any one of thousands of legitimate and so legitimate reasons choose to not come at the last minute. A body in country is a far better prospect for a school as it is far more likely that you will actually turn up!
Finally, the process that the government has in place effectively encourages people to come here first and then find work. This is a good thing in my opinion. You have referred to the fact that the school could back out at the last moment, but then so could you. If you arrive on your own visa and then find out that the deal is not nearly as rosy as promised to you from overseas then you can find a more appropriate position. If you come here on their paperwork and visa then you are pretty much stuck with them whether you like it or not.
| Obarnicle wrote: |
| This has caused me to think, why don't I just get an ARC myself?--I'm still in the States. It seems I might need evidence of employment in Taiwan. Otherwise, the fee is the same as for a visitor's visa, $100. |
The simple answer is that you can't. You need a reason to be issued with an ARC. This is generally work or study and requires paperwork from the sponsoring authority.
| Obarnicle wrote: |
| A second question, is it advisable to just book a flight to Taichung on a visitor's visa, cut out the middle man, and count on finding work in a nice school with everthing coming up flowers when I get there? I've a BA, a TESOL minor, no cert., 27, and fairly resourceful, but on a budget, though with only the basics of Mandarin. |
This is what most people do, but is certainly personal choice. Coming here and finding work is certainly a legitimate way to go for many people. Having said that, if your Mandarin is limited, if you haven't been here before, and if you haven't taught before then I think a good agent could probably help you. Just do your research and be aware that no agent is going to be able to guarantee you a job until you get here.
| Obarnicle wrote: |
| Still, I have reservations filling out a visitor's visa with the purpose of travel as tourism, rather than work,which is, well, accurate. Is the former really the common practice? |
I agree that this is a very 'non-western' thing to do, but it is in fact the way that the government seems to prefer things. They are obviously aware of how most foreign teachers arrive in Taiwan, and they in fact have made it easier for teachers who are in country to change visitors visas into resident visas once you find work. Doing this is in both your best interests and that of your school so it is a good thing.
Personally I think that they should add a box 'Looking for work' so that everyone can fill out the paperwork honestly and so that the government can get a real idea as to why so many people come to Taiwan, but until they do that then you don't have a legitimate selection to make. If you choose anything other than 'tourism' then you will have to have documentation to prove that so if you want to come here then the best suggestion is to check tourism.
| Obarnicle wrote: |
| Another big question for me right now: Is there any merit to the above poster's direction of not accepting work in HsinChu under any conditions? What's that based on? Illegallity? |
No. He has an agenda in trying to make Taiwan look bad but he never supports his claims. He is basing his comments on a drunken bar fight involving some foreigners that occured a couple of years ago now. If you wanted to avoid every city that had experience with drunken violence then you would probably need to stay back home. But then it is likely that your own city has not been immune to a drunken fight between young guys!
| Aristotle wrote: |
| Getting an ARC for a job before you arrive is the official policy of the occupational government here on Taiwan. Like so many other official polices it exist only in the minds of a few naive foreigners who have never tried to get an ARC for work on Taiwan. I have heard rumaors that it is possible to obey the laws and actually get an ARc this wa. In all my years on Taiwan, I have never met a teacher that was able to do this. |
Sounds like the group of naieve teachers includes you then as you cannot get an ARC when you are overseas. You never have been able to and you probably never will be able to and it is certainly not part of any policy that I have ever seen.
You can apply for and receive a work permit and resident visa while overseas so that you can arrive on this documentation. But you still need to be in Taiwan before you can be issued with an ARC.
More incorrect advice from Aristotle. |
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Obarnicle
Joined: 11 May 2006
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Sun May 28, 2006 7:13 am Post subject: |
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| Thanks a million for the insightful answers. I truly appreciate your time. |
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