Job Discussion Forums

[Taylor]

Dear Readers,

So, little Jonks.... being strict and having high expectations of foreign English teachers is now a form of 'terrible management practises"???

I bet you've never even managed a garage sale!

Taylor
Kaohsiung

[jonks]

[jonks]

[BigWally]

[Pop Fly]

Sorry Big W. Don't want to rein in your enthusiasm. It's good, yeah? But you really need to be here, experiencing it. By and large, most schools are "bums in the seats" and nothing more....I'd wager your school is no different. As I said, I have finally found a school that seems to really care about results. But if I was running a class that was dwindling in numbers, regardless of the few that remained getting good grades, I'd be turfed down to so few hours that I'd start to seek alternatives.

They are businesses, not schools. Try being Black or Asian North American. Those folks know all too well how "business" centered it is. You'd do better to think of yourself as a a care-giver rather than a teacher with kids, or as a coach with adults.

I worked at one school where a father of one kid complained so much that I wasn't teaching his kid (I was assigned to the Da Ban, his Prince was in the Xiao Ban) that the two teachers that were got fired. Two teachers let go based on the complaints of one parent. Actually 4 teachers were lost because of this decision. My then partner and I felt that this decision was abhorrent, so we skedaddled as well, of our own volition.

It's a business. First, last and always. You, Sir Big, are experiencing pre-culture shock (PCS) and it's normal. But give your feet a few days on the ground before ya go off saying stuff that may come back to bite you in the ass.

Just some humble feedback. Don't lose your zeal. Not one iota. I love it.

Cheers.

Pop.

[BigWally]

Pop...seriously...thanks for the candid reply...a lot of the posts that I read from you are less "candy-coated" than many others out there and I do appreciate it...

Again, like in posts before I should clarify (forums are such a hard place to have valid discussions ) my point. I realize that most, if not all, english schools are businesses first, but this doesnt mean that within those groups of businesses there arent 1st class and 2nd class schools. (or lower but just for argument sake we'll use 2 )

The way I relate this in my mind right now is using an analogy of restaurants. Sure you can get food at any place, but there is a difference when going to a fine dining vs mcdonalds. Both places want to take your money, both places want to get you in & out ASAP (fill the seats). The major differences are in the presentation & quality.

If you have directors that care about the students education, the teachers well-being & filling those seats, well I would think that would be better than a school who only cared about the bottom line. I think I would get more satisfaction from working for a school that cared about more than just money.

I'm sure a lot of my, in your words, "pre-culture shock", or as I'll call it, "excitement" is due to the fact that I really want this to be a good experience, and I want to take it all in. If it wasnt for folks like yourself warning of these "dangers" (for lack of a better word) I think I would actually have a less rewarding experience.

My intention is not to sound like I know what I'm talking about , and if thats how if comes across I apologize to whomever is reading. I am clearly not able to give 1st hand experience as I have none, and everything I'm going on is from the word of a friend, personal research & the information garnered from the posters here.

I'm simply trying to join in on some of the conversations that are going on here. Truth be told, what I'm really looking forward to, is being able to add more to the conversation with 1st hand knowledge/experience.

OK, much like Led Zepplin I love to ramble on, so i'll wrap this up.

Cheers

[Serious_Fun]

[jonks]

[Pop Fly]

[dangerousapple]

Darn right it's a business! Hell yeah! It takes a great deal of investment and several years of eating instant noodles before the returns start coming in. But any school owner that puts profit over quality ends up getting burned in the end. I push myself and my staff hard...not to fill the seats, but to continue improving the quality of the program. The students take care of themselves. Parents aren't stupid, just unaware of what a good school is. When they get introduced to quality they stay, and they bring their friends.

Run from any school that stresses student numbers, and stick with any school that stresses quality and professionalism.

[Pop Fly]

[shyarra]

I just finished reading through all of the posts on this page, and I still think what I originally thought about harrietthespy's post: It sounds like you were required to do what any professional teacher in America would be asked to do...if s/he took any pride in the job, that is.

I'm a newbie at this (teaching abroad), planning on going to Taiwan in a few months, and I'm seriously looking at Hess. I'm not convinced that it wouldn't be a good fit for me. However, this is not because I like working absurd hours (and I refuse to teach kinders - I'll look elsewhere if they insist on that), but because I want to TEACH. And I think what a lot of people forget is that teaching is not about getting in a classroom and instructing students. It's about the preparation, the extra details (like putting on skits), and the grading. Somebody who is in teaching for the long haul should be able to handle all this.

I understand that Hess is a large corporation, but to be honest, its bureaucracy doesn't sound any worse than California's public school system. After working and observing in California's system since the age of eleven, Hess almost sounds like a walk in the park!

[harrietthespy]

Shyarra,
I�m really glad you wrote. I had stopped checking back on my post since it started to disintegrate into the sort of redundant discussion about contracts and bosses. My intention in posting was to let people who are interested in Hess know what they are in for.

It sounds to me like we are coming from really similar situations. I am also a veteran of the California school system (student and teacher) from the Santa Cruz area. Your comparison of the bureaucracies of Hess and California schools is right on. They are amazingly similar: lots of paperwork, meetings of questionable value, co-workers who seem to have lost all touch with any original love for teaching. Let me also say that I am not one of those teachers who are in it for the money (HA!). I�m a teacher, and have been for more than 10 years, because I think kids are great and there�s nothing better than being able to hang out with them and watch the wonder of learning take place.

But let me tell you a little secret. You don�t have to work as hard in Taiwan as you did back home. It�s a much easier job. And that�s not because I�m lazy or don�t care about my students. It just doesn�t have to be as time consuming as Hess or CA schools make it. For my first year in Taiwan, I worked just as hard as I ever did back home. Now I�m finding that that�s just not necessary. It�s completely possible to be a great teacher without working yourself into an early grave.

I now work for two tiny schools. I didn�t find them online or through job ads. I got on my bicycle and rode around my neighborhood dropping off resumes at small English cram schools. There are thousands of them. They don�t advertise. I�m sure that having Hess on my resume made me a much safer hire than had I been fresh off the boat. But being a qualified American teacher, female and white with one year already in Taiwan are huge plusses for Taiwanese employers. I still put in extra unpaid hours. I stay after school and read books with my students, just because I want to and it�s so cool to see how much they�re learning (never did That at Hess). I still do plenty of skits and open houses and materials preparation. I do more than I have to and it�s not a burden. The difference is there is no obligation to do so, no stupid paperwork, no regular humiliation rituals, no required wearing of the monkey suit. You think I�m exaggerating. Come to Hess and you�ll see.

And it�s not just the amount of work that makes my new schools better. Hess seemed to really play up the division between foreign and Chinese teachers. And there seemed to be a lot of expectations for failure. I don�t punch a timecard anymore. There aren�t any punishments in my contract. I don�t get appraised or formally observed. I don't grade homework. I trade advice and stories regularly with the Chinese teachers. My classes are all small. I�m not just helping my students learn English, but also my bosses who are working their tails off to make their small businesses successful. I�ve heard the horror stories and I saw overcrowded schools with crazy bosses during my job search. I was really careful, but I found several schools that met my requirements.

I also want to say, from one American teacher to another, that being overworked, underappreciated and underpaid does not make you a good teacher. It makes you tired and poor. I have a friend who says Hess likes to hire American teachers because they�re already used to being exploited.

I hope that you decide to come to Taiwan to teach. It�s totally worth it. And I still think Hess or any of the chain schools are good for a soft landing into a hard transition. It�s not easy to leave behind every single thing you take for granted. But know what you�re in for if you sign up for Hess. DO sign up if you need the soft landing or you are brand new to teaching ESL. DON�T sign up because you think being a good teacher means working your ass off. I have lots of friends who have worked for Hess for many years. I don't get to see them often. They're always working or tired.

[Aristotle]