Job Discussion Forums

[valsedeamour]

I was thinking about teaching in Taiwan ( was thinking through Hess) or China and I have a few questions concerning some things. Maybe I didn't lurk long enough in the back entries, so this might be repetative so I apologize beforehand ha ha.

1) I have three years of Mandarin under my belt from university, and by the time I'm over there and finish up my degree.. I'll have about four years or so of instruction. Does knowing a sufficient amount of Mandarin help you for anything other than for peace of mind, over there? lol Monetarily I mean.. just curious if there would be any extra raises for knowing intermediate Chinese.

2) Would you suggest China vs. Taiwan for money? I have a hefty loan to pay off (English Honors, Theatre Double Major and Gender Studies Minor) and since I am equally interested in both places.. I'm curious as to what you all would suggest. Well, that sounds terrible.. I'm not solely interested in the money, as I really do love the culture and the language (spent enough god awful money on it!)... but you know how things are.

3) What is the female experience --- as a young, fresh faced twenty something female..... what would you suggest on advice I take? The culture is significantly different, that I am aware of.. but what has been the female take on moving out there alone? Is it easy to be taken advantage of... like getting ripped off from schools and the likes? What is your suggestion as a 23 year old female going over there? I'd like to see how it differs from a male's perspective over there (Ahhhh the gender studies in me comes out!)

4) I've heard the good and bad of Hess and if I do go to Taiwan, I think I will end up heading through Hess for some sense of security. Any do's,dont's and must's you would give? How does Hess compare to any similar postings/companies in mainland China? Good, Bad, Better, Worse?

Thanks for your help in advance, cheers!

[BigWally]

I'll see what I can do for you!

2) I've heard, and read in many articles that the money is better in Taiwan, and there are usually more benefits associated with the jobs in Taiwan. I was just reading an article here about teachers in china being poorly treated. Seemingly much worse than some of the stories seen on here. Dave's is even mentioned in the article.

Well thats about the only question that I can help out with. Best of luck.

Ganbei!

[markholmes]

If you are considering Hess I would also give www.kojenenglish.com .

They were pretty good to me on the whole. After reading about Hess Kojen definitely sound like a better option.

[valsedeamour]

BigWally - Ah, nali nali! Xie xie! ha Yeah I've heard the same kind of complaints which have made me a little iffy. I was going to live over there for a year and teach a university seminar through a sister Canadian school -- but it got cancelled because the government was losing money on the deal. However, my Professor praises the great money you can make in the private sector if you are smart about it it, so I was always wondering.

Markholmes - Cheers for the info, how did they differ? Class sizes or just overall independance? See, I'm not fooling myself .. I'm just a B.A student with no clue of teaching, other than directing children in clubs and theatres... so do they give good training aspects to get me on my feet, and atleast have some semblance of what I am doing?

[I_is_teach_English]

[markholmes]

I don't think anybody gives good training. That just doesn't occur anywhere. You observe classes for a few days then they throw you to the lions, who you have to tame before they eat you.

They will give you ideas about how to put together a class. Kojen (and I suspect Hess) have a large library of ideas and games that have been built up by teachers over the years.

By the sounds of it Kojen is a bit more relaxed. Fewer meetings, you may get away with not working weekends. You probably won't have to work split shifts. There are no wages withheld as 'security'. Not sure about Hess.

My personal info may be a bit out of date, but this is the impression I have gleaned from my own experience and from reading about Kojen and Hess over the last eight or so years.

[valsedeamour]

I_is_English : Ah, cheers you are a saint, doll! Thanks for the information. That's what I gathered; that it would probably only gardner me some sanity, more so than anything. But that is nice to know that it can help with contacts, which, (as always) will help you down the road. Do you find it easy to make relationships with the students outside of the classroom? Or are the teacher/student lines stringent in Taiwan?

See, I always find it funny that people complain about the office politics (which are legitimate!) but it's just as bad in any Canadian school. Coming from a child of a parent who was in the educational system -- there is some crazy blasphemy that goes on in any bureaucratic office space. So I can understand, and really, expect nothing less. I am pretty laid back and understandable, and pretty energetic as a whole. Do those kind of people as a whole fair well? LOL I've travelled and lived in European cities (which really is nothing like living in Asia, ofcourse) but I am pretty adaptable.

Oh? What is Taichung like then? Is it a fairly large city? I'd like to live in a less rural area, just because ..... well, I'm not a rural fan ha

Mark Too the wolves huh? Why must everything I do throw me to them lol As a whole are the kids pretty a-okay, or miserable tyrants? lol I've been reading up on Kojen and they sound fairly decent -- are they strict with the experience needed?

[markholmes]

Kojen and Hess will take pretty much anyone. When you have such a huge volume of teachers passing through your company each year you can't afford to be to choosy.

I could be wrong, but I think you would enjoy Kojen more.

[I_is_teach_English]

[valsedeamour]

I Teach Bless your heart --- you are so helpful and kind! Ah yes, or as a friend calls it "don't go peeing in your bath water". Ha, I've gathered as much. That is refreshing to hear though, that the parents are really friendly (generally speaking) with you as a teacher, and as a foreigner. Oh yes, being the foreigner... been there, done that, got the prize pony ribbon lol I expected as much from a collegue of mine who taught in South Korea, and a classmate who lived in Beijin for a bit. They said much to the same extent; an attraction lol The guy who was staying in Korea said like... random people would ask him to movies or nightclubs because he was foreign ha. Has that happened to you in Taiwan? Speaking of food ---- what kind of "american" brands do they have there? Or what is something similar to look for? And are vegetarian meals easily accessible there?

Well you have me sold on Taichung It seems lovely and Ms. Lee sounds adorable.. I'll be sure to give her a check out for housing. Would you suggest sharing an apt or just getting one by yourself?

Thanks for the FYI on the kids -- I imagined as much. Poor kids, then again, I was like that as a child so.. ha ha. So then the best would be to make sure you have a lot of active participation games set up?

[I_is_teach_English]

Taiwanese aren't quite as forward as Koreans, but they'll definitely start talking to you in a bar. I met one of my closest Taiwanese friends, Tequila, in a bar. I had to put up with endless jokes about being a lonely alcoholic every time I told people I was going for a drink with my friend Tequila, until a few friends met him I have since helped him give his kids English names and he has offered me a house to live in for free, when it looked as though I might have to move out of my apartment.

[kuberkat]

VDA, a few good questions there. Here's my two kuai's worth.

1. Techncally you don't earn a penny more for your knowledge of Chinese. However, it will make your landing softer, your stay more meaningful and your teaching better. You will know why students are making mistakes from direct translations and be able to anticipate their problems. Also, you will be able to build relationships with administrative staff who aften don't speak much English but can wield surprising power. You will also know what concerns parents are whispering to the Chinese teacher. All these things do add up to factors that can, eventually reflect in your earnings.

2. Taiwan, Taiwan, Taiwan. There will be more excitement in China in the time before the Olympics, but even so you will appreciate your small freedoms in Taiwan. Chinese culture is intense enough without adding political spice to the brew. You are likely to have a freeer contract than in China, which seems like something someone with your background can put to good use. By the way, set up your avenues of loan repayment and savings before you leave home, since financial services in Taiwan can be limiting.

3. As to being a female in Taiwan, yes, there's some serious gender studies material there. There are attempts by unscrupulous types to rip off all foreigners, regardless of gender. Even so, most Taiwanese are amazingly honest and helpful once you get to know them. And there, your knowledge of the language and culture will be priceless.

Your experience will depend a lot on where you live and work. Things can be tougher in the smaller towns where foreigners are completely alien. They might take some winning over, but if you speak Chinese and have good (Chinese) etiquette you will be welcomed warmly.

One more thing: you will be stared at and often laughed at by children and even adults. "Waiguoren!" is funny sometimes, but it can be the last straw on a bad day. It's easier said than done, but don't let it get to you. I did have a colleague who had long, flaxen blonde hair and a Barbiedoll figure. She is the only woman I know of who suffered serious harrassment there. Just like anywhere else, if you use your head you should have no problems.

4. No matter which school you choose, things will not be perfect. That I can guarantee. One absolute advantage of Hess is that you have all the evidence of what can go wrong right here on this forum. And as the saying goes, better the devil you know... Despite all its flaws, I do still believe that Hess offers the best option for a newcomer. You will have problems, but you will have those no matter where you go. The optimist sees the doughnut; the pessimist sees the hole. You will nove that many posters who see the hole in Hess seem to see the hole in everything else, too. A year with Hess will set you on the road. If you want to carry on in TESOL after that, your options will be open and you will have some precious experience.

And finally, don't hesitate to PM me if I can be of any help at all. All the best with your studies and future plans.

[BigWally]

[valsedeamour]

BIGWALLY LMFAO. Yes, I have come across the symbol. I was with a friend in the asian market buying some food, when we came across some noodles that had the sign on it. My friend was like ".. are these anti-semitic noodles?" and laughed and we were quite put off and put them down, questioning communistic ideals. Later on, I brought them in to ask my professor the meaning..... and that put me back to ease lol Thanks for pointing that out though ha ha That is a good thing to let people know ha

KAT So I've been told! In the long run though, it seems like it will be helpful to keep up with my Mandarin then. That is the thing I've always thought would be hard; having the parents whispering behind your back and not understanding a word of it. How does it work with the Chinese teacher in the classroom? How does it make you feel? Do you get frustrated having to have things translated and not always getting the direct meaning? Have you found it easy to accustomate to the accent? ( I know the dialect will be a killer, since each region is different.. especially compared to overseas classroom mandarin). As for the teaching, do the children as a whole easily catch onto the english.. or is it a struggle to teach them it? (More so, teaching towards high levels when tight grammar comes in... vs kindergarten?)

Oh, that is a good point. How do you mean setting up repayment systems? How did you go about it? Yes, Chinese etiquette.... there is so much to learn about that. I'll make sure I brush up on it before I go.. that is for certain. Oh no! I'm a natural blonde.. I better bring some hairdye with me! Speaking of the sorts; how are beauty products there?

Ah, that is what I've gathered. I'm not going over there expecting things to run smoothly at all. Nothing in life, or moving, ever flows smoothly. I think a lot of people make the mistake of ESL as a full-time vacation, which it isn't --- it's work. Easier work? Yes, but it's still work. So I think I might take a ride on the "hippo" and bite the bullet. It seems, like you said, the lesser of the two evils. It seems with Hess, the worst possible scenarios have already been played out and they seem less traumatic than other places (for first year teachers anyways).

Thanks! I most certainly will PM sometime when it comes closer to the date. I'm gathering up information to make a game plan and see what is out there. Oh, another odd, though slightly relevant question --- I'm a split theatre major... so ofcourse I am wondering.... are there any good opportunities for acting/tv/etc for foreign people within Taiwan? I'm certainly not under any moral scruples to play the token Canadian! ha

[I_is_teach_English]