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Promotion / getting hired - if you want it
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Ability to do is more important than ability to talk about
Ability to do rules
87%
 87%  [ 7 ]
Ability to talk rules
12%
 12%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 8

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ktodba



Joined: 02 Aug 2006
Posts: 54
Location: UK

PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:02 am    Post subject: Promotion / getting hired - if you want it Reply with quote

After just over ten years in EFl / ESol / whatever you want to call it I've noticed a trend for people who can talk about how good they are and use education buzzwords such as 'added value, differentiation, inclusivity' - to get preferential treatment in the UK - surely the ability to play buzzword bingo is not indicitive of a good EFL teacher? Or have I missed the point?

Should we worry about using buzzwords to get the job in the first place or developing the skills needed to do the job? For that matter, is there any point having the skills without a piece of paper that says you have them?

I'm old fashioned I'm afraid and prefer to work with people who can do rather than people who can talk - does this make me less likely to get hired or promoted if people don't know me?
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thrifty



Joined: 25 Apr 2006
Posts: 1665
Location: chip van

PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 3:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you a native speaker?

Will you work for the pathetically low pay and conditons?

You have got the job.
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tedkarma



Joined: 17 May 2004
Posts: 1598
Location: The World is my Oyster

PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bullsh*tters are common in every occupation, but they don't usually last long.

Hang in there, do a quality job and things do come to you.

If nothing else - you have delivered value to your students.
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Deconstructor



Joined: 30 Dec 2003
Posts: 775
Location: Montreal

PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 4:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bullsh*tting is always fundamental especially in EFL. You gotta remember that most of the overseas DOSes (and many in Anglophone countries as well) are clueless as to what it means to teach English. If you actually did a kick*ss job, that is to say, if you immersed students in English, did not provide ready made answers and made the students work for them and depend on themselves to learn, if you provided interesting reading, listening and speaking materials and stayed away from bullsh*t grammar and vocab games and tasks, not only the DOS would hate you, the students would as well. The latter is particularly stupid because s/he want easy answers to something as complex as language. And you, my friend would be out on your ear faster than the DOS could say, YOU'L FILED! THE ENTIRE EFL INDUSTRY IS BASED ON DOING IT THE WRONG WAY, which means peddling easy answers and creating the illusion that something is being learned.
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Henry_Cowell



Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 3352
Location: Berkeley

PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Deconstructor wrote:
...if you provided interesting reading, listening and speaking materials and stayed away from bullsh*t grammar and vocab games and tasks, not only the DOS would hate you, the students would as well.

And this with an M.A. in English? Maybe you SHOULD get some training in teaching the language. It typically includes a class in grammar. Wink
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Deconstructor



Joined: 30 Dec 2003
Posts: 775
Location: Montreal

PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Henry_Cowell wrote:
Deconstructor wrote:
...if you provided interesting reading, listening and speaking materials and stayed away from bullsh*t grammar and vocab games and tasks, not only the DOS would hate you, the students would as well.

And this with an M.A. in English? Maybe you SHOULD get some training in teaching the language. It typically includes a class in grammar. Wink


Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Wooo your red ink scares the sh*t out of me. Funny how a "teacher" like you finds faults where there are non. Classic! Is this how you keep your students down and create the illusion that you're actually teaching?!
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Henry_Cowell



Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 3352
Location: Berkeley

PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, I'm not a teacher. And I sincerely hope that you are not a teacher as well.

If you can't find the error, you might want to get a refund for that M.A.

Oops! There's another error in the sentence that follows the one I quoted. Rolling Eyes
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Deconstructor



Joined: 30 Dec 2003
Posts: 775
Location: Montreal

PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Henry_Cowell wrote:
Actually, I'm not a teacher. And I sincerely hope that you are not a teacher as well.

If you can't find the error, you might want to get a refund for that M.A.

Oops! There's another error in the sentence that follows the one I quoted. Rolling Eyes


I had a suspicion that you weren't a teacher; and sorry to disappoint but I am and a damn good one, at least according to the zillion evaluations done on me.

You, on the other hand, shouldn't be so ecstatic because you think you have found someone else's error as you so readily pointed out. Everyone errs now and then and I'm no exception, but I dare you to show me mine in the sentence you have chosen.
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Henry_Cowell



Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 3352
Location: Berkeley

PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 10:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Daring can only lead to embarrassment for the person issuing the "dare." Wink
    Hint #1: Look up the term "comma splice."
    Hint #2: Look up the term "subject-verb agreement."
If you didn't continually and smugly rant about what sort of training is (and isn't) appropriate for English teaching, I wouldn't point out your own English errors. Cool
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Deconstructor



Joined: 30 Dec 2003
Posts: 775
Location: Montreal

PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Henry_Cowell wrote:
Daring can only lead to embarrassment for the person issuing the "dare." Wink
    Hint #1: Look up the term "comma splice."
    Hint #2: Look up the term "subject-verb agreement."
If you didn't continually and smugly rant about what sort of training is (and isn't) appropriate for English teaching, I wouldn't point out your own English errors. Cool


How pathetic to even point out your imaginary comma splice. Subject-verb agreement, you say? I bet you got your university "training" at Seoul Upstairs Language school? Rolling Eyes
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Henry_Cowell



Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 3352
Location: Berkeley

PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 3:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

He denies the mistakes even after they've been identified. So much for that "M.A. in English." Perhaps the elementary TEFL certification that he so despises would have helped him spot such basic English mistakes and correct them.

Ah -- the irony! The emperor has no clothes. Or, rather, the "deconstructor" cannot "construct." Laughing
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Deconstructor



Joined: 30 Dec 2003
Posts: 775
Location: Montreal

PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Henry_Cowell wrote:
Ah -- the irony! The emperor has no clothes. Or, rather, the "deconstructor" cannot "construct." Laughing


As usual, you are incomprehensible, and I suspect even to yourself.

By the way, you might want to check out the word IRONY before you use it next time. Hope you know how to google.

You're a waste of my finger tips.
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Henry_Cowell



Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 3352
Location: Berkeley

PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The deconstructor has been deconstructed. He continues to divert attention from the fact that he cannot recognize and correct errors that are taught in every beginning English class.

But no amount of diversion will hide the sad truth:
    His much-vaunted graduate degree in English never taught him what all four-week certification courses teach.
How's that for irony?
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guangho



Joined: 16 Oct 2004
Posts: 476
Location: in transit

PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Henry_Cowell wrote:
The deconstructor has been deconstructed. He continues to divert attention from the fact that he cannot recognize and correct errors that are taught in every beginning English class.

But no amount of diversion will hide the sad truth:
    His much-vaunted graduate degree in English never taught him what all four-week certification courses teach.
How's that for irony?


The ultimate irony, Mr. Cowell, is that the "much-vaunted graduate degree" will go a lot further than any certification course. Which answers the question of the original poster and nicely takes us back on topic. Very Happy
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Henry_Cowell



Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 3352
Location: Berkeley

PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

guangho wrote:
...the "much-vaunted graduate degree" will go a lot further than any certification course.

What about a recipient of the M.A. in English degree who cannot recognize simple grammar and punctuation rules? She won't get those jobs requiring an M.A. in TESOL, will she? The first day on the job will prove her a fraud. She should stick to deconstructing the writings of dead European authors. Wink
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