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Toe Save
Joined: 04 Oct 2004
Posts: 202
Location: 'tween the pipes.........
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 Posted: Sat Sep 23, 2006 6:20 am Post subject: |
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Clark,
All due respect, I think it's called playing the odds. I chose Taiwan over Korea because there is less of a chance of being ripped off. I based this decision on research.
The same holds true for recruiters vs DIY. There is less of a chance of being cornholed if you DIY.  
That other guy (I've been forbidden to address Him directly) is being very general, I will give you that. There are some situations that using a recruiter does benefit some people. I was one of those people. I found myself suddenly in the deep end of despair. I needed to get back to Taiwan ASAP and into a job even quicker. I couldn't worry about finding accoms as I was in such a bad way, I just needed to get here, work and sleep.
Footprints Recruiters assisted me with a placement at KoJen. They demanded nothing from me and I got the "soft landing" that I really needed. There was a cost, however. I had to work for the KoJen Dragon Lady for a year....but I got my feet on the ground and my last 4 years have been very comfie indeed.
It is good that the resource of recruiters is available. Some folks do need it. Or at least, think they do. If your seed money is very limiting, a soft landing with a room waiting for you to rent is possibly the only way some folks can make a start here.
But you are playing the odds. There are few reputable ones and discussions such as this do separate the wheat from the cornholers. Dewey has been the reciepient of both good and bad reviews. So far, Reach to Teach has come up mostly favourable. Footprints out of Vancouver can indeed smooth the way into KoJen, if that's the way you want to go. Otherwise, I know of no other recruiters worth the time of day.
YMMV
Good Luck. |
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clark.w.griswald
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 2056
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| Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 3:02 am Post subject: |
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| Toe Save wrote: |
| There are few reputable ones and discussions such as this do separate the wheat from the cornholers. Dewey has been the reciepient of both good and bad reviews. So far, Reach to Teach has come up mostly favourable. Footprints out of Vancouver can indeed smooth the way into KoJen, if that's the way you want to go. Otherwise, I know of no other recruiters worth the time of day. |
And this is pretty much my point of view on this whole subject.
Suggestions that all recruiters should be avoided are pointless as there will always be people who see some value in using a recruiter. Having a general vibe that suggests to people that all recruiters are bad just serves to embarass people into going underground in their use of recruiters.
Let's acknowledge that recruiters are not necessary but can provide a valuable service for some people even if that service is just one of reassurance.
Let's try and help each other to identify which recruiters are likely to offer the most assistance.
Finally let's see some more comments - positive or negative - about specific experience with specific recruiters so that we can build the knowledge-base about recruiters that are active in Taiwan. |
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markholmes
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 661
Location: Wengehua
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| Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:04 am Post subject: |
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| Footprints out of Vancouver can indeed smooth the way into KoJen |
So what exactly did Footprints do for you? Kojen already pick you up at the airport and put you up until you find somwhere to live. I got this without using a recruiter. What additional services did they offer? Free taxi to Vancouver airport (just kidding)?
My thoughts on Footprints are not that they are good or bad, they are just surplus to requirement. Most paperwork is done within Taiwan and Kojen already has facilities and arrangements for new teachers, so what is it they do? Well, they make prospective teachers feel more comfortable in making the leap to work on the other side of the world. They make it easier for Kojen to find teachers. So, basically all they offer newbies is piece of mind. Fortunately, in this case, piece of mind seems to be free.
But Footprints aren't really a recruiter in the usual sense that is refered to here. Independent or not they are more of a representative than a recruiter. My understanding is that they only recruit for Kojen (please correct me if I am wrong) and therefore represent a known quantity. They don't place people in the middle of nowhere, they place people in a school chain with a reasonable record.
It would actually be quite difficult for them to screw it up. |
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Ki
Joined: 23 Jul 2004
Posts: 475
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| Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 5:54 am Post subject: |
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Recrtuiters are not necessary. But there will always be some who will insist on using them no matter what you say. I believe it is best to identify which recruiters are are honest and which ones are scammers. As long as teachers realise that it is them who ends up paying for so called free services like airport pick up. But business is business right?
It can be an odds game and research does help make those odds favourable, be it with a recruiter chain school or otherwise. Some people favour working for a chain school but they may just as likely send you out to the middle of nowhere as the recruiter. In the end though you will just have to take a chance. Stand firm though. If you are not happy with something then don't accept it. Otherwise you will be persuaded into a nightmare. |
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markholmes
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 661
Location: Wengehua
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| Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Some people favour working for a chain school but they may just as likely send you out to the middle of nowhere as the recruiter. |
That would be difficult in the case of Kojen as I believe all their schools are in the larger cities.
I think the basic necessity to research is the number 1 priority. I think the blanket statement of 'do not use recruiters' may not be fair to the few that actually do a good job, but for a newbie trying to sift through countless posts and pieces of information it may not be a bad policy to follow, if only to focus their attention on the job at hand - finding a good school.
The bulk of info on Taiwan is focussed on individual schools and therefore the pool of resources is much larger than the one for recruiters.
The main problem with recruiters in the past was that they were unknown and not researchable. Many came and went in a few months or changed their company names to hide past indiscretions. The only option was to research schools who had plenty on information already posted about them.
It does appear that some recruiters are making an effort to legitimize their businesses and be accountable. But ultimately, when you arrive in Taiwan, you will not be working with the recruiter 5 or 6 days a week, you'll be working at the school. Therefore surely it is better to direct your attention towards a school rather than a recruiter. |
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clark.w.griswald
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 2056
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| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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| markholmes wrote: |
| The main problem with recruiters in the past was that they were unknown and not researchable. Many came and went in a few months or changed their company names to hide past indiscretions. |
This is so true. The fact remains that there are some recruiters that are still shady but there are also some that are out there working hard and doing a pretty good job. We haver named them before on this board and no one has yet raised serious concerns about them so it does seem that the catch-cry of 'never use a recruiter' although maybe relevant years ago, is no longer accurate.
| markholmes wrote: |
| The only option was to research schools who had plenty on information already posted about them. |
Save for a handful of schools this can be somewhat difficult. There are probably a couple of thousand buxibans throughout the island yet the biggest resource that I am aware of with comments and reviews of schools here only maintains reviews of around 10-20% of this number. The other 80% remain unaccounted for which makes it somewhat difficult to research them. Word of mouth can be a good resource when you are already in Taiwan, but there is definitely a benefit for first timers to hooking up with a chain school or a good recruiter before you come. IN your second year here you can perhaps be a bit more adventurous. |
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markholmes
Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 661
Location: Wengehua
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