Job Discussion Forums

[spiral78]

I think the distinction is probably something related to quantifiable/qualifiable qualifications (wow). It's easy to screen candidates for degrees, certifications, and experience. It's harder to screen for things like focus, energy, interest, and sheer talent.

A screening process has to start with quantifiable (what have you got?) and good screening can move to 'soft' skills - no less necessary, just harder to pinpoint because they are quite individual. There's no specific formula for them.

[dmb]

[Gregor]

I'm not even 100% sure that an MA is relevant to training potential teachers for a CELTA or similar certificate. A DELTA and tons of experience in as many different types of places, where the candidate was able to learn the language as well as where the candidate didn't bother or have the chance to do so. All of that seems the most useful. The CELTA trains people for an entry level position, but that position for new teachers is going to put their lives into a completely unfamiliar situation. Education is fine, but what is really NEEDED of a teacher trainer is experience dealing with what the teachers are likely to deal with.
DoS experience is good too. Ideal, even, because a DoS has to do a lot of stuff for his teachers that a teacher trainer should do for his students. It's a very brief, very practical course. It should be taught by someone who well understands those needs.
By the way, a DELTA course tries very hard to teach the stuents to think outside the box. It may not be possible to do that effectively, but if you can't do it, the course is VERY difficult to pass.

[wildchild]

[Bayden]

[spiral78]

Also, remember there are MAs and MAs. I did mine by distance while I was working, so I was able to apply theory to practice along the way. The coursework required classroom research and extensive writing to analyze how things worked/didn't work. There were lots of opportunities for critical thinking about approaches and methods.

It doesn't have to be just sitting in 'dimly lit classrooms,' studying theory from dusty books.

Still, I am not saying that an MA or any other specific qualification makes a great teacher or teacher-trainer. But an MA qualification can mean a range of things, these days.

[denise]

Let's not forget about the face validity of the program when discussing whether or not MAs, DELTAs, etc., are valuable. A potential teacher trainee, when choosing from a wide variety of TEFL courses, may be a bit more impressed with someone who has more letters attached to their name than to someone whose biography reads "is a real people person" or "has a natural gift for teaching." Right or wrong, qualifications make a place look more prestigious. This was mentioned a while back by somebody... I think Jetgirly.

I was looking at the teacher trainer biography page of a training school here in the US, and something that would really have put me off as a trainee (and that I would try to avoid if I were in a position to hire teacher trainers) was that EVERY trainer had taught in Korea. Most of them had taught in a few different cities in Korea and one or two cities in the US. I know that there are zillions of jobs in Korea, but I would want to see a staff with a geographically broader range of experiences.

d

[sheeba]

I'm doing the DELTA and although it's early days I hope to see the theory that I am studying relate to my teaching. They tell me it will. I'm witnessing a spread of areas covered in the course - Theory,History,Phonology,Grammar and other specialised areas. I'm nearing my first project which concentrates on observing other teachers and evaluating my own teaching. I'll also be doing a topic which I hope to focus on syllabus design where I hope to look at designing a syllabus for an EAP course here in China. I have spoken to my boss here in China and she has agreed to show the management my syllabus. If they agree to it they will let me implement the syllabus and I will actually be able to start a new course next year teaching EAP here in China - My own course!

So I feel that the DELTA is very practical and it also does deal with Theory . The way I am studying it allows me to concentrate on certain areas more if I feel they are of importance. I do focus a lot on theory and I would say am gaining as much as a MA student would in his first year of studying - including theory.

Of course the MA would last another 2 years so I think that it is just a difference in time. My DELTA will allow me to be exempt from the first year Masters at Sheffield(where I intend to do it) and I'd guess that that was about right. The DELTA is equivalent to the first year of a 3 year Masters program. I'll check into the MA and make sure that I'll be using study in relation to my teaching.

To me I just see the MA as an extension of my DELTA. If I could get a 3 year DELTA course I think that would be better than an MA (for me anyway)

As for experience. I look back to my CELTA and see that in the class you have people with very different objectives. Some want to go to other countries, some want to set up a business(one day) and see the CELTA as an introduction to the profession, some want to teach ESL as opposed to EFL, some want to do Business teaching ,some don't know what they want. There were all these types in my CELTA class and as a trainer I would think that you have to accommodate for theses different needs. I'd say the more varied the experience the better . A range of countries taught in (Europe,Asia,South America) taking into consideration language error from different regions and cultural difficulties, ESL experience, teaching Kids(even though it is an adult course), Business teaching, DOS experience. I hope that over time I will gain all of the above skills and more - I already have some of them and then it'd make me feel confident with a fresh set of enthusiastic CELTA trainees.

[tedkarma]

[Guy Courchesne]

[spiral78]

Having seen new TEFLers come and go over the past eight years (in four countries!), I agree with Guy - the great majority fill a year or maybe two and then head 'home.' But I know a fair number of long-term teachers like myself who have taught in multiple countries. Maybe it's more common in Europe?
But, I think you're right, Guy - it's probably not that feasible for newbies, or who are not committed to the long-term, to really do the multiple country dream. I would have a hard time myself with moving from one entry-level position to another - too insecure, hours too long, etc. How many years can anyone really enjoy that?

[coffeedrinker]

I can't speak for TedKarma but I wonder if his point is more that TEFL trainees are not necessarily going to work only in the country they are training in?

The line of thought would then be that teacher trainers with experience only in that country would not prepare trainees as well for working ousite that country.

I guess there is some sense to this - a variety of experience is better than only one kind of experience - but, for example, in my CELTA we didn't learn just a bunch of classroom activities - it was general enough that I could apply what I learned to other countries. I don't know if a month-long intensive course is even long enough to set people's teaching style for life - they will have to adapt to where they are. Sometimes even different schools or classes within one country can require different things from the teacher.

[tedkarma]

I agree that many trainees don't work in more than one country, but I do think trainers need to present a wider perspective for those that might. And, that the plans of trainees are often affected by information and ideas presented in training. Thus an instructor with a wider range of experience may help the trainees expand their own possibilities.

I don't know that EVERY trainer needs multi-country experience, but I do feel it should be an important component in the package that a school presents to its trainees.

[ls650]

i think that multinational experience would be extremely beneficial. During my certificate course, one of the instructors had an MA in ESL and had taught for years in the local area, but had never taught overseas. The other instructor had a DELTA, no MA and had taught in about half a dozen countries over 15 years. The more travelled teacher was better simply because he brought a wider range of experiences into the classroom to share.

[Guy Courchesne]