Job Discussion Forums

beck's · Joined: 06 Apr 2003 Posts: 426

I have been offered a job. We have discussed and emailed back and forth and have agreed on the conditions of work, apartment etc via email.

The school wants me to sign the contract with them when I arrive on a tourist visa. They tell me that they will arrange for the proper working documents upon my arrival.

I have spoke to teachers who work there and they went to China with the same arrangements as I am being offered. No problems occured with them. I worked at the school before and they were great with me, very honest and supportive.

Should I trust them? Am I being paranoid in even asking this question?
What say you?

The Voice Of Reason · Joined: 29 Jun 2004 Posts: 492

Come on in, the water's fine.

Ahchoo · Joined: 22 Mar 2007 Posts: 606 Location: Earth

Just make sure everything, including this:

kev7161 · Joined: 06 Feb 2004 Posts: 5880 Location: Suzhou, China

Geez, I hate to say this, but trust nothing from emails! Get everything you want/need worded in the addendum of your contract . . . . EVERYTHING. Also, although not official, print off those emails before you come and highlight certain areas of "promises" and "guarantees". Of course, no contract is official until signed and stamped, but copy off the one they sent you anyway and go over it with a fine-toothed comb. Underline or highlight anything you don't understand or feel should be changed and contact them about it before you leave. Of course, they are not going to promise you the moon (or maybe they will!), but they are going to assure you and reassure you with promises and there's always a good chance they'll re-nig once you get here. Have you been reading Dave's for awhile? You know it could happen.

Then again, they may be the best school in China and everything will be smooth sailing - - - "may be".

cj750 · Joined: 27 Apr 2004 Posts: 3081 Location: Beijing

Pick someone who you've read and send them a pm....asking there advice..there are those that will tell you that the L visa is not Kosher..but it is done all the time ... however it is always a chance when dealin with the Chinese..and an email ain't sh*t....nor is any promise you make..the negotiation is just beginning when you sign...now as to the L..if it is a hoax..thn you will have time to pick your self back up if they cannot come through..but only if you bring enough money to hold you over..unless yu are very resourceful and can make it in any situation your situated in ... I have rarely taken much money with me to a new post ..preferring to relying on my wits ... so if you do take the bait..bring some money and have your wits about you...

jeffinflorida · Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2007 5:38 am Post subject:

Dude, did you never watch the X FILES ????

TRUST NO ONE !!!!

This country is the home of the experts who are skilled in promising you everything and giving you nothing...

The whole fabric of China is built upon them cheating and exploiting everyone they can. Don't believe what they tell you or trust someone just because he says he is a teacher and a foreigner...

A contract really means nothing to them and a promise means even less.

If you do come here based on these factors just prepare yourself to be cheated and if it turns out that this does not happen then be thankful...

Make sure you have the resourses to support yourself in case you need to go to plan B, really.

Then put lots of things in a contract but it does not mean they will honor it.

cj750 · Joined: 27 Apr 2004 Posts: 3081 Location: Beijing

In addition you should never trust any pay agencies or pay sites.....

patsy · Joined: 07 Oct 2004 Posts: 179 Location: china

good luck, the hunan women's college also promised me an apartment which is pretty basic for university teachers. Also through the email and phone conversations, they just sounded so "sweet" and above board. why would I doubt it? I was already living in China and had communicated with the school for months.

Upon arrival at the airport I am informed there is no apartment due to "housing shortage". And they "just" found out about that when my airplane landed. Let me tell you, it's been a nightmare of a year.

I wouldn't trust a word they say through email or phone conversations.

KES · Joined: 17 Nov 2004 Posts: 722

Why would they not send you the documents for a legal work visa?

If they are licensed to hire FTs then they have to do the docs anyway.

All they have to do is send you the docs (which proves they are legit).

The best proof that they are legit is them sending you the legal docs to get a Z visa!

Does anyone need three guesses why they might not to do this the simple legal way?

admittedly lame analogy:

ME: Give me your wallet and I'll give you the 10,000 RMB in my hand here.

You: Really?

Me: Absolutely

You: Show me the money in your hand.

Me: No can do. But it's there. Really.

You: How do I know. Seems all you have to do is turn over your hand and I'd have proof.

Me: Trust me.

You: ???

beck's · Joined: 06 Apr 2003 Posts: 426

Wow. You guys have me worried. The thing is I taught there before. They are a public university. They treated me fairly and with respect. Like gold in fact. I feel that I know the individuals I am dealing with. The first time I went there they sent me all of the docs for a z visa though. This time the procedure seems to have changed. In actual fact, why aren't email agreements as binding as contracts which are sent via email. Really, what can a foreign teacher do if the contract is not respected anyway? Aren't all of the contracts flexible in the Chinese mind anyway?

kev7161 · Joined: 06 Feb 2004 Posts: 5880 Location: Suzhou, China

It seems like you left out the fact that you've worked there before in your OP and it also seems like you've already made up your mind, regardless of "advice" we may give you. So, I say go for it and good luck. Maybe everything will work out for you - - - please let us know your success story. It's nice to read THOSE every once in a while too.

beck's · Joined: 06 Apr 2003 Posts: 426

Kev. With respect, I did say that I had worked there before. I'm just testing the waters here. I am looking for opinions. I haven't been in China for about two years. Maybe things have changed vis a vis the Z visa thing. I really liked the place and I, if truth be known, want to return. Can you ever Go Back Home? I jsut, like most of us, want to have a good experience.

tofuman · Joined: 02 Jul 2004 Posts: 937

OP,

Things have changed in two years.

Obviously. If they did things by the book before and now are trying to get you here under questionable circumstances, do you see a possible problem?

There is no good reason that the school should not send or fax you a copy of the contract, invitation letter, and so forth so you can get a z visa in your home country and then get your residence permit after you arrive in China.

Remember, the people that enforce immigration policy can and do assess fines of up to 500RMB/ day for violations.

Tell the school to either do things right or you will look for a school that does. You are only looking out for yourself, which is what you should be doing.

Incidentally,there are schools that insist on doing things the right way. Why work for a school that insists on doing them the wrong way?

kev7161 · Joined: 06 Feb 2004 Posts: 5880 Location: Suzhou, China

Yes, you did. Sorry about that. I glossed right over it.