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EF Indonesia
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Canadian Couple



Joined: 19 Jan 2003
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2003 4:20 am    Post subject: EF Indonesia Reply with quote

Hi!

We are in the middle of applying for ESL jobs with the English First company in Indonesia. Has anyone worked for them recently? Would you recommend working with them, or are they a company to avoid? Any info is appreciated! Especially about schools in West Jakarta.

Thanks!
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sperling
Site Admin


Joined: 22 Oct 2002
Posts: 117
Location: Los Angeles, California

PostPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2003 12:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just in case you don't get any replies here, there are entries on EF at:

http://www.eslcafe.com/jobinfo/asia/sefer.cgi?Indonesia

All the best,

Dave Sperling
Founder
* * * * * * * * * * * *
Dave's ESL Cafe
http://www.eslcafe.com
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Anda



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 2199
Location: Jiangsu Province

PostPosted: Sun Jan 26, 2003 4:15 am    Post subject: Best of luck. Reply with quote

English First had some write ups a while back I can't remember but I think there was some problems. Anyway try doing a Net search using the words; Indonesia, expat, english, teach. There are some good expat sites for indonesia on the net where you can post for info and there is a lot of info there already. Indonesia is a poor country and conditions are not exactly safe so I wouldn't recomend it as a first country to get into EFL. Don't dress and act like a tourist or you will have a hard time.
Oh Indonesians can and will cheat you out of your last dollar in a friendship but that doesn't mean that they don't like you. Money is a game to them so if they cheat you out of your life's saving then they will take you to dinner and shout you beer and help you out for a dollar if you need it. Of course this will be your money but. They will also lie to you and if you look like you believe them then they will tell a bigger lie and so on untill it's impossible to believe them. Kinda funny!!!!
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guru



Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Posts: 156
Location: Indonesia

PostPosted: Tue Jan 28, 2003 5:01 am    Post subject: ef is ok Reply with quote

Ef is ok. I worked at an EF school for 2 years. The teaching was very professional and the kids great. The money was enough to live but not save. Actually the money is a big issue.

tefl.com and eslcafe.com lways have ads for schools in indonesia.

If you're after better money, try a national plus school. They pay about $1500 a month and throw in accomodation also.
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bnix



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 645

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2003 5:18 am    Post subject: Please Be Very Careful with EF Reply with quote

Hi,
I suggest that you check out the Job Journal Section on Dave's Cafe.

I have never worked for EF,although they ahve tried to hire me in the past(Indonesia).I do not believe in making unsubstantiated claims for or against any organization,but the fact is that EF is a franchise operation .The franchisees have to put up money upfront to the parent company...and then the teachers take the flak(financial and otherwise) sometimes.Of course,since it is a franchise,some branches are different than others.

One thing that really turned me off was that when I was talking to them by email,I could not get any exact salary figure.I could only get things like"it will be enoughto live in Indonesia",and "the salary is sufficient"What does that mean?They will try to sell you on the fact that you "will have an experience".In my opinion,that is an attempt to justify the poor salary.

At any rate,I would advise caution.Make sure you know what you are getting into.I have been in this business for ten years.Personally speaking,I would vote hands down on this one.best of luck,but be careful!!!
Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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Winmar



Joined: 11 Feb 2003
Posts: 125
Location: Melbourne

PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2003 3:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've just finished a year at EF in Bandung, West Java. I found it to be a great experience. Of course teachers had the odd problem with management, but nothing major, and nothing more than you'd encounter at any other organisation.

The teachers and staff are all very friendly, and it is generally a very good working environment. All first-year teachers are offered the same salary, regardless of experience, and this increases each year you're employed by EF.

I can't comment on EF branches in other cities, but the Bandung schools get the thumbs up from me. Bandung is also the only Indonesian city I'd really want to live in. Miles better than Jakarta! Nobody who goes there dislikes it, and many stay longer than they'd originally intended. No safety problems either. The people are great.

I'd be happy to answer any questions you have. Good luck.
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reality



Joined: 13 Mar 2003
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2003 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EF tend to recruit Teachers based outside Indonesia, because few Teachers in Indonesia want to work for them.

Its not that EF are a bad school, but pay and conditions are the worst in Indonesia for expatriate English Teachers.

Ignore the fact , EF claim Indonesia is cheap. It is cheaper than the EU
and the USA, if you live on a local level. That gets boring for most people here, who do go to expatriate hang-outs and want better accomodation.
And you will want to go to these places to, after being here a while.

If EF, were such a great School, why do they regulary advertise for Teachers?. Teachers in Indonesia, know the answer.
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Winmar



Joined: 11 Feb 2003
Posts: 125
Location: Melbourne

PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2003 11:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really think it depends on the particular EF branch. I've seen much worse schools than EF in Indo.
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reality



Joined: 13 Mar 2003
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 9:41 pm    Post subject: EF Reply with quote

There are worse Schools than EF in Indonesia, but there are better Schools. A competent, qualified Teacher can find work in the better schools, so why settle for EF?. One reason, they regulary advertise for Teachers outside Indonesia.
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Winmar



Joined: 11 Feb 2003
Posts: 125
Location: Melbourne

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2003 4:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The working hours is one reason. TBI for example pays more, has better facilities and has a better reputation, but its staff have to do classes all over the place, time wise. I'd prefer to teach 1430-1930 or 2100 than start at 10 in the morning, and finish at 9pm with long breaks during the day. Depends what you're after....
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reality



Joined: 13 Mar 2003
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2003 10:36 pm    Post subject: Working Hours Reply with quote

Through my own extensive experience in Indonesia. The majority of Schools offer the same type of working hours. EF do not differ to most
other Schools.

Every School I worked for offered working hours from 2/2.30-7.30/9.00,
depending on your contract hours. Some Schools only insisted I was at
School, for my scheduled hours.

I know EF Teachers, and several former EF Teachers, and their hours are no different to any other School. The only difference was I earned 30% to 50% more than Teachers at EF, and most of my friends do for non-EF Schools.

I also noticed most EF Teachers who remain in Indonesia, after their first contract move to other Schools. This usually does not happen at EEC, ILP
or EEP, unless the Teacher moves to the Korean School.

I am not saying EF are a bad School, but they are at the bottom of the ladder. When it comes to choosing a School for Teachers based in Indonesia.
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Winmar



Joined: 11 Feb 2003
Posts: 125
Location: Melbourne

PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2003 5:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That might well be the case generally (I wouldn't know), but I can only speak for Bandung. The teachers there do often have worse hours than we did at EF - they've told me as much. It depends a lot on the AC and franchise owner too. If you get a prat of an AC or owner, life at the school's not going to be much fun. EF Bandung (again, I can't speak for any other EF) was good in that respect.

On the pay, TBI for example pay more than EF initially, but its yearly increments are smaller, so after a few years you end up being better off at EF.
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reality



Joined: 13 Mar 2003
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2003 8:21 pm    Post subject: Rest my case Reply with quote

Winmar:

Comparing EF to other Schools in Indonesia, does not work. Your EF School in Bandung may be great, but I and other Teachers know much better Schools in Bandung.

No wonder EF in Indonesia, often resort to hiring non- native Teachers.
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Winmar



Joined: 11 Feb 2003
Posts: 125
Location: Melbourne

PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2003 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So if you haven't been comparing EF to other schools in Indonesia, what exactly have you been doing through this thread??? There aren't really that many schools in Bandung.......some things are better about others than EF, and some things better about EF than others. All of the schools in Bandung have non-native speaking teachers.

Have you got an axe to grind about EF or something? If that's what you "rest your case" on.......oh well, each to their own.
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willy



Joined: 29 Mar 2003
Posts: 215
Location: Samarinda,Kalimantan,Indonesia(left TW)

PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2003 7:13 am    Post subject: EF low pay Reply with quote

I applyed at severl EF schools and all offerd 40-50% less than ILP (the $`s are in TW) I dont like Jarkarta but the school is very good, thats the Main office :D NOT the CORP. :(
If you like to hit the bar and want to live a western life better make 10,000,000+, teaching pays from 4,500,000 to 25,000,000 :D
I would not advise working in Jarkarta unless you like really BAD air. :!:
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