Job Discussion Forums

[corporatehuman]

I'm leaving Mexico exactly after a year. The main reason being I have no want to continue a career as an ESL teacher, and that opportunities for cultural activities (like plays, galleries...just artistic cosas in general) are very limited in Chiapas.

Also though I hate to admit it there are many people I don't like here. I love everyones view of Mexico, in general, and the love for the people, and I share that but mostly for the 40 and up crowd. Basically I don't really like the youths, except for a party, and a few special people, many just piss me off. But I live in a small town anyway.

And of course, MONEY. I want to make money. However, I am positive I will return to Mexico in the future.

C

[suite1718]

While I'm not a member of the 'leaving Mexico' group, I would like to thank all of them for the information that they have shared with us less experienced people.

I have learned tons from this site, and especially from several of you that are leaving. I'm sorry to hear that you are going, but I hope that you find happiness with your move.

[danielita]

Sadly, I am in the leaving Mexico crowd. If I had my way, I wouldn't be leaving, but unfortunately other forces are making the decision for me. I plan to come back as soon as I can....hopefully in February if it all works out...

D

[samizinha]

Wow, seems like half the form is taking off. I'll be back too, I have a Latin soul.

[Samantha]

Danielita didn't mention what the forces are so I hope it's nothing too serious and that she will make a safe return in February. I am not alone in hoping that everyone of the long time posters leaving will stay in touch. It won't be the same without y'all and it will be interesting to see what you get into after you leave Mexico.

[samizinha]

I'll elaborate on a couple of things that were asked in the OP.
The original plan was to teach for two years and then head back to Canada, but I fell head over heels in love with Mex. The process of moving back was like leaving a long term relationship.
Nobody understood unless I said I was going because I missed my family. The going away parties started three months before I left, until I said I would only have ONE party on the last weekend. I gained ten pounds from all of the lunches, dinners, coffees, and tequilas that I was invited to. Back to jogging...
I had really tried to make a life for myself, so when it came time to leave, I had to give up everything. I lost a lot of money from selling things for about a quarter of what I had purchased them for. In the end, I was happier giving my things to charity, because I knew that the items would be appreciated and used. Fortunetly, the experience wasn't really about physical momentos, so the best things I brought home were my photos, music, and memories!
The reverse culture shock has been bizarre, even though I've been through this process twice before. It felt wrong to hear English from strangers, and even weirder to respond. I started blankly at the money. I found that people's concerns in Canada, such as having the perfectly cut lawn, to be a bit petty. And the sheer variety of products to buy has fascinated me but also made me feel ill, realizing that nobody really needs half of the stuff that they are bombarded wtih.
Getting back into the teaching system here has been a challenge, because all of the school boards have had their major interviews. I got offered interviews, only to have them retracted when they realized I couldn't just fly down in March. I'm still working on this.
This also means that I'm back living with my family. They're the greatest people in the world, and very understanding of the great changes I've made, but after being away for the majority of seven years, it's a bit strange and trying on all of us.
All of this, and it's only been a week! Paloma time

[Johnny T.]

I came to Mexico with my wife and my 8-year old girl almost exactly a year ago. I�ve been silent on this forum partly because I�ve been working so many hours to make my 2,000 pesos per week that I just don�t want to spend more time on the internet at the school, but mainly because I still believe my mother, �if you don�t have anything good to say, don�t say anything!� But now, on the eve of our departure, I feel this may be the time to speak up. I think I have been living in a different Mexico than most of you and I wonder where your Mexico could be? I have a friendly little family, all reasonably bilingual but despite our best efforts down here, we have made not one friend. There is so much animosity toward foreigners, because we are tall, pale and my daughter has red hair and is generally a happy little girl, we get nothing but stares, dirty looks (you know that feeling when you walk into a room where everyone is laughing and then they stop, go silent, drop their jaws, nudge each other, shoot you bitter and resentful looks, then guffaw amongst themselves - we�ve faced that every day we�ve been here) and sometimes even jeers of �Gringo!� from passing motorists. We have found Mexicans to be absolutely incapable of keeping their word (often their �enthusiastic yes� reply) when we have invited them to our own parties or even out for coffee; and an invitation to a Mexican party (the one or two we have received) is the kiss of death for any burgeoning friendship - they don�t give specifics and then as the time draws near, they disappear from our lives and we never see them again. It has just been very strange (and lonely), in a place with some kind of myth of �friendly� people, in our year here we have never seen the inside of a Mexican house or apartment! This is all not to mention the fact that my daughter is teased every day (and perhaps all day) because she is the only foreigner in her school.
My final thoughts on leaving Mexico (needless to say we are ecstatic!) is that I would never recommend this country to anyone who does not have relatives here, is not young and single and looking for a Mexican mate, or is a very serious Catholic making a pilgrimage.

[ls650]

Wow - I can't say I've ever experienced anything like that after three years in Mexico.

I'm genuinely puzzled. As you say, most posters have plenty of good to say about Mexico. Why do you think your experience in Aguascalientes is so different from that of the rest of us?

[lisa1968]

Why on earth would you put your family thorugh that for a whole year!!

[Samantha]

Johnny T, your experience sounds awful. Did you meet any other foreigners while you were there? There is a pleasant retired couple who post on one of the travel forums who have built a house in Aguascalientes and seem to really like it. Here is their blog, maybe you will recognize them if you bump into them before you leave.

http://judysny.googlepages.com/impressionsofmexico

Also, it's too bad you couldn't have tried another location before planning to return north. You likely would have had a completely different experience. Did you have your job offer there ahead of time? I hope there is something positive you will be able to salvage out of your time here in Mexico.

[danielita]

[danielita]

JOhnny T: I am surprised to hear you story. I have not had any experience like that. There are 4 foreigners in my town and none of us have experienced anything like you have. For the first bit, people would stop on the street and offer to help us because they assumed we were lost. Since then, I have built amazing friendships here and I have people here that I consider to be family. I can't tell you the number of times I have been to people's houses and had others over for dinner. They are so interested in my life back home, what I am doing here and what I think of life here. Sadly it sounds like Aguascalientes was just not the right fit for you and your family. Perhaps in another town you may have fared better.
Did you get involved in the community? I found that this really helped me build close ties and made me feel like I belong here. I have had lots of stares and had to deal with questions from small children like: "Why are you white?" and "Are you an albino?" but I know that it is just purely innocent on their part. I understand the problem with being a redhead. My husband and I have an amazing knack for terrifying small children under 3--not only are we GIANTS but we are different than any other person they have ever seen!

D

[Johnny T.]

First, in order to reply to Lisa 1968: We leased our house back in Toronto for a year and were only able to get it back 1/2 month early. Secondly, in order to rent an apartment here in Ags. we had to sign a one-year lease and have an "aval" also sign for us. Now, I guess one of the few good things to happen to us was that a student I once had was a bank manager and he offered to be the "aval". Even though once he left the class we never saw him again, being a conscientious Canadian, I would not have wanted him to be stuck for any portion of the year's rent - despite the advice from the Mexican teachers on staff that that is just how things are done here in Mexico - you don't have to give any kind of notice for changing houses, jobs, schools for your kids, etc. - just leave anyone in the lurch, as long as you can get free and clear without a hassle to yourself. Please don't tell me that I'm the only one who has noticed that this is the way Mexican society works! Anyway, that is why we could not return home or move to another city in Mexico and believe me, we have been dying to do that for 9 or 10 months. Speaking of being a conscientious Northerner and giving notice: I foolishly (once again, "tonto" according to the other members of the staff here at KIOSK) gave my boss one month's notice last week, and the very next day he found 5 or 6 reasons for dropping 5 or 6 of my classes - so for the last month I'm making about 2,000 pesos in total, way under the last month's rent that is due on the day we leave (which I will foolishly pay).
I really do believe that people in the D.F. and Guadalajara, etc. may have a less "provincial attitude" toward foreigners (the honest truth is that we have always felt we were animals in a zoo - and not well-liked animals - every time we appear in public places here. And it's worse if we speak English to each other.), but I can't believe that the aggressiveness and over-the-top Mexican chauvinism has not caused other people in other parts of Mexico problems. My wife volunteered in the English classes of my daughter's public school until the mother of another pupil made an outrageous claim that she had hurt her child. The school director had the nerve to tell us that it was the other mother's word against my wife's and that the other mother was a Mexican, so believe it or not, my wife was prohibited from setting foot on that school's property. Not one Mexican parent or teacher (whom my wife had assisted in their classes) stepped forward to either stand up for us or help us manouever through the legalities of changing my daughter's school. We have stuck with that school, and guess what - that other mother is there every day, all day, doing absolutely nothing. I tell you this because this is our experience of Mexico - better a Mexican doing nothing than a foreigner who could be of service.
And yes, we have contacted Judy of Ags. who has told us several times by e-mail that she was in our neighborhood but "forgot" to drop in on us. I just put it down to having lived here too long.
I really don't understand why no one else has experienced the "one disappointment after another" syndrome here when trying to make friends with Mexicans!

[Dragonlady]

deleted

unrelated to TESOL

[thelmadatter]

While my experience has not been as extreme as Johnny T's, I have experienced more than a couple of his frustrations. I always find it amusing to amazing how some ppl on this forum are so very very eager to defend Mexicans (or rather non-Americans) whenever something negative is said about them. Goddess forbid that we acknowledge the the saintly people in developing countries are just as ugly-human as we are.

The fact of the matter is that there is prejudice against Americans in Mexico and all that means is that there are ugly Mexicans just like there are ugly Americans.... and it isnt fair to either group when they are living (legally) in each others' countries. (if anyone is living illegaly in either country... you deserve what you get)

Johnny... I suspect much of your experience comes from a rather insulated community that is suspicious at best about the rest of the world and has an inferiority complex. People tend to degrade others when they themselves have self-esteem issues... its no different in cultural/ethnic groups than with individuals... in fact within groups, they can reinforce their notions even more strongly among themselves. Ive run into this in Toluca where I live, although most of the negative reactions I have received are more of a "deer in the headlights" glare when I speak Spanish with a foreign accent. Only 2x in 4 yrs has anyone made a negative comment (to my face) about the fact that Im American. On the other hand, like you, I have made no friends in Toluca. My entire social life is in DF... I agree with you that the more cosmopolitan the community, the greater likelihood of finding someone that can accept you as a person, and get beyond the fact that youre a foreigner.

Face it guys.... Americans do NOT have a monopoly on bigotry and prejudice.