Job Discussion Forums

[fox1]

Thanks Jim! I mean, yeah, in a perfect world, I would discipline using English all the time. Sometimes, after several attempts with these guys, you know, the "No talking" thing just isn't really working.

So, then, you have Japanese. It's not easy to know exactly how to say some of the things I want to say. Japanese is my #4 language. (I'm not one of these guys who barks out orders in stores in English to shop clerks. I always try to speak Japanese.) That's why I created this thread.. to correct and modify some terms. So, thanks! You're a lifesaver.

Also, I mean, it's not really that they don't understand "no". It's just some'll keep talkin/standing up/sleeping....

The "Am I speaking Korean"? line is DIRECTLY after ignoring "shaberu dame" 2 or 3 times. It's not, like, "kiite kudasai", but anyway......

[Mothy]

I wish I knew Japanese well enough to answer your questions since these people sure seem to not be doing so. Although personally I don't think that this technique of yours is best, if I had the Japanese knowledge to answer your question I surely would. Although giving advice to perhaps alter your methods is certainly an appropriate thing to do, the refusing to answer your questions and instead just lecturing you has turned a thread which could have been a helpful thread into yet another bickering fest. Not really surprising, but a bit disapponting nevertheless.

[Mothy]

Oops. By the time I had finished writing. jim had actually done just what I was saying should happen. Thanks Jim

[fox1]

I'm not sure some people know the extent to which some will keep talking, not do the handout at all (which is challenging, useful and interesting!), stand up and generally not do anything, all despite understanding it's not allowed. (It's not like I'm saying "koko wa bedroom ja nai" first time a guy sleeps.)

[flyingkiwi]

So, basically your problem is how to get the students motivated in English class, not what Japanese to use.

[gaijinalways]

[fox1]

[flyingkiwi]

EVERY student has a button that can be pushed to get them interested in, or at least participating in English class. The best teachers find those buttons. Keep looking.

And to one of the posts above: URUSAI can mean 'be quiet', or 'shut the feck up'. It's one of those handy Japanese words that translates into many terms that all correspond to a similar broad meaning.

[Glenski]

"Urusai" means loud or noisy, yes, but when spoken as suggested above, it means "be quiet". In the right tone of voice, it can be more gruff, like "shut up", which is why I stressed using a softer tone. I've seen Japanese teachers use it countless times, always in a soft tone, and it works.

fox,
Yes, hands on hips sometimes works. As does "minus points". I teach university students, and they get minus points for various things. Sure makes some sit up and take notice! You fail to realize that the average maturity level of many Japanese kids is lower than their age. Use that to your advantage.

You seem to have a classic case of "classroom chaos" on your hands. This late in the school year, you are likely not to resolve it much.

Do you have a Japanese co-teacher in the room? Sounds like you don't. Is this just one class of students, or everyone you teach?

Are your classes able to give the kids a grade? In some of my OC classes, no matter how much homework or assignments I provided to students, the class never got a grade from that work, and in some cases, what grade I did muster simply got diluted with another (Japanese teacher's grammar) course scores. In any case, if you are giving the kids things to do that are worth points, make it clear to them, and make it even clearer that they lose points for various things. Don't be a staff sergeant when you do this, but they still have half a year to go, so every point matters.

[craven]

Flyingkiwi and Glenski have already given you some pretty solid advice...and I'll second those saying stick away from direct translations of English sarcasm. One of the best things you can do to improve your "disciplinarian" presence in class is learn the kids names. By heart. Get class lists or use the school's photo book if you have too, but a general "urusai" will never be as effective as "TANAKA. urusai". For that matter, I've always found "TANAKA. quiet" to be even more effective This also helps with the negative points idea...write down names of those offending on the board, and single them out for some sort of punishment after. Make sure it's something you can actually follow through on (extra homework, docking grades...or if those are impossible, standing up a student and singling them out.
Do make sure you know the kid's background before doing any stern discipline...I once had a couple of sleepers, and once I talked to their homeroom teacher and established that they were just trouble in general, I stood them up and took their chairs away for 10 minutes. That worked for a couple of classes, then they were sleeping again. This time, I took EVERYONE'S chairs away. That worked permanently
You haven't mentioned your in class teaching situation...are you on your own? With a Japanese teacher?

[TokyoLiz]

In a few lessons, you could do so much damage by scolding your students in broken Japanese. If you use unidiomatic Japanese, the students will dismiss your comments as henna gaijin talk and you show weakness by getting angry and not using the language to best effect.

You never need use the expression Dame, since students are familiar enough with No and Stop.

Yelling or getting angry raises the whole volume and tension level of the class and may cause the noise and discipline problems to escalate.

As other posters have said, never, never mention Korean or Chinese culture or language in a derogatory manner. Besides the obvious problem of creating or condoning prejudice, you may deeply hurt Korean or Chinese nationals or descendants in the class, some of whom may be secret. Just dont go there.

If you need to get attention or get control of individual students, there are some workable and quiet methods of doing so.

Stand over the offender while you deliver the lesson or direct a whole class activity.

Move the offender to the back of the class, against the wall for a time out period of minutes. This prevents the student from baiting you or others. Japanese kids do not like to be isolated.

If they wont participate in a lesson, appear to lounge or sleep, make everybody stand while you do the exercise or activity.

Check the health of the class overall before you do any of these things. Go see them in homeroom to guage their behaviour with other teachers. Their group behaviour may be determined by more than just a lack of interest in your lesson.

One of my really good junior high classes broke down because the teacher was sick with cancer. They didnt disrespect her or me, but they couldnt keep themselves on task without a lot of management and pushing, and the stress of watching their teacher go through gruelling chemotherapy made them act out. They did fine at exam time.

Lately, one of my junior high students would not participate in an activity. I approached her and quietly did the speaking exercise with her. She did alright but wouldnt look me in the eye. Later, she told me she had severe cramps and went home. Kids are people, and they have their bad days like anyone else.

Find out how they are individually and collectively before you try to scold them. Make a human connection with them, as people, before you try to modify their behaviour. Find out what they think theyre there for. Ask them how they feel, really, when they start a lesson. Ask them what their previous lessons were, what they liked, what they hated, and why. It gets things off their chests and gets them communicating with you.

[fox1]

[fox1]

[fox1]

[shuize]