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taoalchemist
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 7
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 Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 3:01 pm Post subject: Teaching by RealGAP - an Irresistable Rip-Off |
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I was hoping I could get some opinions on this program I'm about to sign up for.
I'll be doing a RTW trip starting in October and would like to stop for six months in China to teach and immerse myself in the culture.
I found a program by RealGap
http://www.realgap.co.uk/Paid%20Teaching%20English%20Programme%20China
that offers the following for the outrageous price of $3200 USD:
Full TEFL Training Course in China (its a 108 hour program)
Orientation
Guaranteed Teaching job in China (paying 2000RMB a month)
All accommodation
All meals
Work placement in a Chinese school 24hr emergency&translation service Travel between job postings Mandarin lessons
Help processing China working visa Airport transfer
Welcome dinner
Support from China representative
Completion bonus (of 2500RMB)
Free time to travel in school hols
Cultural & social activities (they say two excursions a semester are included)
Now, from what I've read, 2000RMB is on the very low end of the pay scale. However, all of my food and accomodation is covered, and I really don't spend that much on going out.
It was hard to get over the $3200 charge, but the Certification, Mandarin lessons, and ease of getting in-and-out of the program is inching me towards paying it (as I'll be in the middle of a RTW and would like this part of the trip to be as effortless as possible, since the rest of my traveling is almost all hitch-hiking, improvisation, and scraping by on a backpacker's budget).
Though it seems like robbery, I'm finding the whole package damn near irresistible.
Has anyone done a Cert+Teaching deal? Did you do it independently? Do you think I'm getting ripped off hard? |
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Midlothian Mapleheart
Joined: 26 May 2005
Posts: 623
Location: Elsewhere
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Yes. |
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vikuk
Joined: 23 May 2007
Posts: 1842
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 3:17 pm Post subject: |
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I'd pay $3,200 just for the welcome dinner 
Personally I think an offer like this is an insult to EFL in China - and to the spirit of backpacking.
OP I think both FT's and Backpackers will agree on this one!!!!!! |
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taoalchemist
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 3:37 pm Post subject: |
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| I spose I should add that I'd like to teach English in South America afterwards, so I'd very much like to take the full 108 hour cert. |
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brsmith15
Joined: 12 May 2003
Posts: 1142
Location: New Hampshire USA
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Your choice, of course, but surely you can find something better than this. I was surprised this is a UK venture; must have some Chinese ownership somewhere. |
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SnoopBot
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 740
Location: USA
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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Looks like another outfit to make money off the backs of the backpackers, adventurous and recent graduates.
1. I would not place too much emphasis on the TEFL cert; I think it is a potential dodgy one that gives you basic information on the host country and basic teaching tips. In the real world, it would not be worth much for better jobs. (Things not to do while in the host country) The accreditation TEFL certificate needs to be explored more.
2. Mandarin lessons: Many schools offer this but load you up high with workload that you cannot take advantage of these offers. Do not expect them to Cater to your learning or travel preferences. You are there to teach period! (Earn money for them) You will learn more with a book and experimentation.
3. 2000 RMB a month with no specifics is on the very low side. (However, others who post on Dave's would think this is bargain because they can live on three RMB a day)
4. $3200 fee for the honor of teaching for them in China while lining their pockets more. This part is the biggest Whopper of them all.
I would not touch this program, but... I guess some would.
The only good thing I see is short-term contracts, but I am sure you are not legally able to teach in China under those short-term contracts.
Therefore, you might be in danger with immigration + fines.
If they did not demand money upfront (application fee, processing fee) I still would be cautious. However, they expect certain fees to be paid before you get the job position; this method has been connected with past ESL swindle outfits..
Potential Teacher Beware. |
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andrew_gz
Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 502
Location: Reborn in the PRC
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 8:00 pm Post subject: |
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I couldn't help but notice that the "working holiday visa" was not included.
Is there such an animal here on the Mainland? |
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Katja84
Joined: 06 May 2007
Posts: 165
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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I've had a look at the information given on the website, and I wouldn't say it sounds too bad. In saying that, I am assuming that you do not have a degree and that you do not have much previous experience of China? If you have a degree and enough experience of China to find yourself a regular job, I'd go for that, but it does entail more organizing and you'd be very lucky to get a job for just six months without a degree. In the end, if you really want to teach in China for only six months without a degree and without putting a lot of effort into finding a job, this type of schemes may be your best bet.
Find out more about the TEFL course - the website states that the certificate would be accredited from a school in Australia, it would be helpful to know more about the course and the school. A CELTA alone would cost about half of the fee charged, so if the course can deliver the same type of insight into teaching (without the international label, but oh well) then the fee might appear quite reasonable.
The website also states that you may be able to choose region - consider this carefully. If you end up in Beijing, 2000 yuan will probably not cover your costs, whereas in much of western China 2000 yuan is a very reasonable salary.
| Quote: |
| The only good thing I see is short-term contracts, but I am sure you are not legally able to teach in China under those short-term contracts. Therefore, you might be in danger with immigration + fines. |
It's a UK company though... Surely they must have made some kind of arrangement with the government if such work would normally be illegal, or else risk getting in trouble themselves? |
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SnoopBot
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 740
Location: USA
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 9:21 pm Post subject: |
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It's a UK company though... Surely they must have made some kind of arrangement with the government if such work would normally be illegal, or else risk getting in trouble themselves?[/quote]
This is true, but... This is China. If they cannot sponsor a Z visa the teacher would be working illegally. (The long arm of the Law might not reach to the UK as no UK laws are broken)
Possibly, the teacher is considered a volunteer and NOT paid by the school directly. The organization pays them.
So this might skirt the immigration laws, they are classified as "language exchange or unpaid volunteer." No work is paid, so the program supports the role as learning culture and Chinese language exchange.
Tourist visa is accepted- or study visa.
My biggest alarm bell is the fee, what if something happens is the fee refunded?
$3200 is a large chunk of change to pay. In the past web pages popped up demanding fee's and upfront costs and once paid did not deliver. They closed down to to emerge as a new company doing the same thing.
I would suggest that he goes to some district office to meet directly with some staff members first.
Second, check the organization rep by actually talking to former FT's and/or a good internet search.
Other Canadian outfits do the exact thing but the cost are lower.
I feel part of the cost (at least I hope is Air fare) since most places will not offer air fare for a low month contract, maybe this places includes it as part of the package.
Air fare = Round trip ticket as part of the $3200. Too many details are left out, you are correct 2000 in Beijing doesn't go far. |
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kev7161
Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Posts: 5880
Location: Suzhou, China
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| 2000RMB is on the very low end of the pay scale. |
That's an understatement! The lowest end for a majority of teaching jobs is actually about 4000 (plus accomodation and often free on-campus meals plus several other "perks"). |
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Anda
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 2199
Location: Jiangsu Province
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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Wake up, as it is a joke. The Full TEFL Training Course in China of 108 hour is worth something like $600 to $800 all up.
Jiangsu Education Services for International Exchange in Nanjing offers TEFL plus a job teaching in goverment schools for way more then the offer you have and there is no charge up front.
http://www.chinatefl.com/jiangsu/teach/jecie-4.htm |
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taoalchemist
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 11:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Katja84 wrote: |
| I've had a look at the information given on the website, and I wouldn't say it sounds too bad. In saying that, I am assuming that you do not have a degree and that you do not have much previous experience of China? |
I have never been to China. I have a Bachelor's Degree in Information Systems from a private university in the U.S.
I've seen a lot of my skepticism reflected in posts here, thank you all so much for your helpful comments - especially those who weren't condescending to a person new to all this. The biggest selling points to me were the teaching (I love to teach), the cert (as an investment like you said clark), the advertised Mandarin lessons, the 6-month commitment (perfect for my trip), and the supposed support structure in the organization.
The income is a major concern, but I was willing to drop the 3Gs as, like you said, an investment. I'll look further into the cert and see how legitimate it actually is.
I considered that the 2000RMB would be a pittance around one of the major cities.
I'll enquire about the visa situation and the refund policy. |
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vikuk
Joined: 23 May 2007
Posts: 1842
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 1:42 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| I've seen a lot of my skepticism reflected in posts here, thank you all so much for your helpful comments - especially those who weren't condescending to a person new to all this |
Well what can you expect from the posters who suspect yet another scam project to make profit out of gullible tourists � all of which hangs under that dark cloud of undercutting the wage rates of existing FT's.
The posts on this thread seem to hold a pattern of - the more experienced the FT the more comical they find this project (price/wage/recognition of TEFL/standard of TEFL/visa arrangements .....and of course lets not forget the welcome dinner). While the posters who seem to try and find a positive spin on it ...... well why not ask them if they're in China working as an FT, and on what kind of China experience does their wisdom ride on. |
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johnchina
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
Posts: 816
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 2:07 am Post subject: none |
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I believe Language Link in Beijing offers a CELTA course. CELTA is recognised worldwide and Language Link can certainly help arrange accommodation, visa and employment. In the meantime, while studying, you can probably pick up some private students.
(For the record: My connections with LL are that I once met the DOS there and two of my mates took the course and were extremely happy with it.) |
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taoalchemist
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 2:23 am Post subject: |
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I realize I'll have to make some compromises (the CELTA class and some of the others I've been referred to seem great, but the timing is off + most seem to require the one year commitment which I understand but am trying to work around) - but I have another question:
Once you've taught for a while, is the quality of certification that big of a deal when it comes to getting jobs? |
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