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Otterman Ollie
Joined: 23 Feb 2004
Posts: 1067
Location: South Western Turkey
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 Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:18 am Post subject: The thin end of the wedge |
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| I see in yesterday's Turkish daily news the pm wants to overturn the ban on headscarves ,anyone hear alarm bells ringing ? |
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Golightly
Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Posts: 877
Location: in the bar, next to the raki
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 8:24 am Post subject: |
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No, but I hear the distant rumble of tanks coming over the hill....
Remember kids, Ataturk's always watching you! He always knows who's on the good list and on the naughty list! |
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hobo
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 91
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 8:28 am Post subject: Re: The thin end of the wedge |
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| Otterman Ollie wrote: |
| I see in yesterday's Turkish daily news the pm wants to overturn the ban on headscarves ,anyone hear alarm bells ringing ? |
I do, but it's a fire dill in the office. |
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justme
Joined: 18 May 2004
Posts: 1944
Location: Istanbul
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 8:29 am Post subject: |
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Is he checking it twice?
Is lifting the ban on headscarves the beginning of the slippery slope?
Or is it just relatively small and symbolic, and nothing will change?
I don't know. I'm just throwing it out there.
I will suggest, however, that Islamic democracy is still relatively untried in the world, and it can always take a face Westerners don't particularly care for.
If they lifted the ban on the fez, would it herald an era of cool hats, or a major fashion mistake? |
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dmb
Joined: 12 Feb 2003
Posts: 8397
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 8:57 am Post subject: |
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| Is the Fez still banned? I'm pretty sure that law was repealed otherwise you wouldn't get all those tourist fezes in Kapali Carsi |
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justme
Joined: 18 May 2004
Posts: 1944
Location: Istanbul
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 10:53 am Post subject: |
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Hmm. I just figured it was okay to wear the fez as part of a costume, but not wear it for real, as a hat.
It's the sexism built into the law, I think, as there isn't really any type of dress, like a headscarf, that men are required to wear as part of their religion. I mean, beards are looked down on, but not forbidden, and a very religious male can hold whatever job and enter/attend/work at a university, but a woman of the same convictions is banned from doing so because of the dress required of her. |
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hobo
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 91
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 11:22 am Post subject: |
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| justme wrote: |
Hmm. I just figured it was okay to wear the fez as part of a costume, but not wear it for real, as a hat.
It's the sexism built into the law, I think, as there isn't really any type of dress, like a headscarf, that men are required to wear as part of their religion. I mean, beards are looked down on, but not forbidden, and a very religious male can hold whatever job and enter/attend/work at a university, but a woman of the same convictions is banned from doing so because of the dress required of her. |
By the same argument isn't the religion itself sexist for only forcing women to conform to dress codes?
Last edited by hobo on Fri Sep 21, 2007 8:27 am; edited 1 time in total |
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justme
Joined: 18 May 2004
Posts: 1944
Location: Istanbul
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 1:09 pm Post subject: |
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| That's a whole 'nother can of worms... |
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hobo
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 91
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 1:51 pm Post subject: |
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| justme wrote: |
| That's a whole 'nother can of worms... |
Well yes,
Interestingly enough, the ban is not just on headgear, it's on all theopolitical symbols. So it could include male headcaps and Muslim style dress as well as obvious crosses and Jewish skullcaps. |
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dmb
Joined: 12 Feb 2003
Posts: 8397
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 3:05 pm Post subject: |
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| What about bearded women? |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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There is a ban on wearing religious kit of any type in public. On my last visit I was approached by a Greek monk in full clerical garb,looking for directions He had just got off the train from Salonika at Sirkeci. I did not have the heart to use my rusty Greek to tell him he should be in civvies.
Last edited by scot47 on Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:26 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Golightly
Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Posts: 877
Location: in the bar, next to the raki
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 9:02 pm Post subject: |
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What were you doing with a rusty Greek in Sirkeci in the first place, and how were you intending to use him?  |
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tararu
Joined: 07 May 2006
Posts: 494
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| Posted: Fri Sep 21, 2007 7:41 am Post subject: |
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| justme wrote: |
Hmm. I just figured it was okay to wear the fez as part of a costume, but not wear it for real, as a hat.
It's the sexism built into the law, I think, as there isn't really any type of dress, like a headscarf, that men are required to wear as part of their religion. I mean, beards are looked down on, but not forbidden, and a very religious male can hold whatever job and enter/attend/work at a university, but a woman of the same convictions is banned from doing so because of the dress required of her. |
Perhaps they should let women wear beards and men wear headscarves, then everything would be fair. |
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cut-off resonant
Joined: 18 Sep 2007
Posts: 2
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2007 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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| justme wrote: |
Hmm. I just figured it was okay to wear the fez as part of a costume, but not wear it for real, as a hat.
It's the sexism built into the law, I think, as there isn't really any type of dress, like a headscarf, that men are required to wear as part of their religion. I mean, beards are looked down on, but not forbidden, and a very religious male can hold whatever job and enter/attend/work at a university, but a woman of the same convictions is banned from doing so because of the dress required of her. |
First of all , I'd like to say hello as this is my first words on this forum
It is not headscarves or something. It is patriachy that is put into practice by not only AKP stuff but other governments. Today, Those other alternative governments that fall back on that 'Atat�rk' concept are not far better than the current government.Why is it always women's clothes being made an issue while men are able to do what effing (sorry) they want ?So as you've said , it is totally sexism.This is not about freedom in clothes issue. This is obviously 'ruling' issue interfering in every aspect of life. So I am not apprehensive whether headscarf is banned or not as I am aware of what the real intention is. I am totally worried about how far they could go in the near future. What AKP or others are really interested in is to get their jerry cans of petrol and money stashed with a grubby collusion with US .They put community in a state of confusion by disconcerting declerations such as headscarf. |
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FGT
Joined: 14 Sep 2003
Posts: 762
Location: Turkey
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| Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2007 12:09 am Post subject: |
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I can imagine the back lash but I'll say it anyway: -
Isn't there a difference between ALLOWING women to wear a head scarf and forcing people to adopt a code of dress? |
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