Job Discussion Forums

upchuckles · Joined: 11 Jan 2007 Posts: 111

EF has changed in three years? Can a leopard become a vegatarian? I think not.. Same exploitative salaries, long hours and disjointed franchise owners who don't follow the rules..

englishgibson · Joined: 09 Mar 2005 Posts: 4345

exactly...and the same farce owners run their farce EFs around china today as they did 3 years ago Wink

Sonnet · Joined: 10 Mar 2004 Posts: 235 Location: South of the river

Alright, alright...

- Yes, EF has changed massively in three years. Whether new or old, franchised or company-owned, EF schools in China are much more homogeneous these days than they used to be. Occasionally the consistency can seem like a straitjacket, but ultimately, it's difficult to deny that the chain has reached a level of consistency & standards which just didn't exist a few years ago.

- This "president" you mention has never been the president of EF English First in China, or EF English First as a whole. Maybe he had a job with englishtown which he later lost, but the overall, and China-based (and Indonesia-based, Thai-based & Russia-based, for that matter) presidency has been Swedish-held ever since the beginning.

- Blended learning? You mean E1D? That was scrapped as flawed in 2005. The current system, which has been in place for over a year, utilises the new coursebooks, in-school social/professional activites, and an online element which was designed from scratch after E1D died. And, well, all the new stuff actually works and links in together. E1D was a nightmare, I agree. The people in product development have since got their act together. All schools, either franchised or company-owned, are using this system, and have been for quite a while.

- The former AOM's who you mention now have relatively menial jobs, and have no influence whatsoever on the way things are run here. Much like with DoSes, the overall standard (experience, qualifications, performance) of AOM's has increased massively over the last few years.

- Control over academic affairs? I have complete control, and always have done. I know a number of other DoSes, and they'd say the same. Why would anybody work in an academic management position where they didn't have this control and responsibility?

- Exploitative salaries? I know people who work (not with EF) for 4500RMB/month with only on-campus housing provided and no other benefits. Even that's not exploitative, when you look at the profit margins of the institution. Believe it or not, but the vast majority of EF centres aren't huge money-spinning machines - they're schools which turn over a smalish profit, but could hardly afford to pay anybody any more without seriously hiking their course rates.

- Long hours? Meh. I've known only one centre where they would enforce the 40-hour office week. Otherwise, teachers do their prep, teach their classes, finish their paperwork & go home. Nobody at my school has worked a split shift for a year now - they're pretty easy to avoid with sympathetic scheduling, y'know.

There you go. That's, hopefully, an answer to some of your questions. Any more? Keep 'em coming. And, since I've been really good and given you some actual information, I dare you, just dare you, to respond without using a single emoticon now. I've broken my habit of inexpression - can you break yours of slapstick overexpression?

eslstudies · Joined: 17 Dec 2006 Posts: 1061 Location: East of Aden

Shan-Shan · Joined: 28 Aug 2003 Posts: 1074 Location: electric pastures

clark.w.griswald · Joined: 06 Dec 2004 Posts: 2056

I think that the concerns with the number of hours and lack of housing vs. salary are worth thinking about.

However, the actual work that you do and the position that you would be in as compared with work in other schools may be something that makes the deal a bit sweeter for you.

EF work environments are generally very clean, well equipped, situated in convenient locations, and professional which is not always the case with other schools.

You will likely find that the staff, students, and school in general have an understanding of your needs and will do their best to respect these which is not always the case with other schools.

So perhaps in considering whether to accept this position or not you need to consider what alternatives will be available if you turn the position down.

OGFT · Joined: 24 Jun 2006 Posts: 432

vikuk · Joined: 23 May 2007 Posts: 1842

An earlier post said a lot about who's needs seem to come first in EF -

englishgibson · Joined: 09 Mar 2005 Posts: 4345

HOW?
this might be just a long shot, but there's been a DoS once..this DoS was fired for his poor follow up on the CM's email requests..i only know 'cause the CM of that EF center bragged about it at one EF conference..then, he tried to hire me there (on the spot)...well, that farce Center Manager became the CM of that year in China (presented a big award at the conference)..that's how they looked after that DoS Wink

now, when my EF employer in Huizhou decided on her fireworks with me, she spent a few hours on the phone with the EF head office and that a couple of days prior to the event...i was on my two days off when my employer contemplated my replacement then... i learned about the phone call 'cause a couple of employees (marketing manager and sales consultants) listen in to the long and probably interesting conversation..anyway, my at that time employer/center manager (daughter of a former government official) decided to sack me the legal way and with a reason that THE COMPANY AND I (DOS) HAD DEFFERENT VIEWS ON HER BUSINESS (EF CENTER)...when i got my dismissal letter employees of the EF center had already known...then, when i tried to call the head office about my news, they had already known too and maybe so they did not wish to discuss it with me Smile

by the way, as soon as i came to my EF flat after presented my dismissal letter, the phone in my EF flat was disconnected Crying or Very sad

...later, i've been told someone tried to contact me Confused

peace to the facts of the farce EF operation
and
cheers and beers to the ones who believe in changes Laughing

englishgibson · Joined: 09 Mar 2005 Posts: 4345

Staying on the topic of EF DoSs in China, there was yet another change three years back and that was with the DoS contracts. The Head Office (ambicious Kate B) took the annual 10 percent raise out of the DoS contracts, although left the raise in teachers/senior teachers contracts. Sonnet has that been changed again or are the DoSs� second, third year contracts up in their employers� hands as their employment is?

Now, I hope for all readers� forgiveness �cause of my below lengthy follow-up on Sonnet�s previous post. I just somehow believe that we�re going to come up with some interesting changes in the EF operation that we do not know about.

Teatime of Soul · Joined: 12 Apr 2007 Posts: 905

Claims and counterclaims aside, doesn't it seem self evident that FTs should exercise due diligence and contact FTs working at a particular location prior to accepting a position?

How is this different from any other school?

If the FTs who are working there are satisfied and give a clean bill of health should one reject the offer based on the contrary claims of someone who has never worked at that particular location?

How do you weigh the evidence?

tw · Joined: 04 Jun 2005 Posts: 3898

Note to self: bypass this thread, there is nothing worthwhile to read anymore.

englishgibson · Joined: 09 Mar 2005 Posts: 4345

what else would be worthwhile to read on this thread?

clark.w.griswald · Joined: 06 Dec 2004 Posts: 2056

SnoopBot · Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 740 Location: USA

Since we are the topic of EF again.

Anyone have any experience with the EF in Guiyang, Guizhou province?

Search reveals nothing and only 1 EF school is located in Guiyang.

Maybe this isn't the typical EF school?

Razz