Job Discussion Forums

[cr]

just curious on how bad english first is - i have heard more bad than good, but am a bit curious if the whole franchise is not worth the time or is it only certain schools throughout indo?

cheers

[guruengerish]

Wow, you're opening up a whole can of worms.

But to be brief, they're a money-making venture, and first priority is to make money and to keep students. (and to teach them English?).

Teachers come a bit lower down the scale, and are rarely treated as professionals, and management forgets that a TEFLA course costs thousands and pays $350.00 a month up, depending on where you are.

However, it is a good learning experience for newbies, a stepping stone to better things, and the majority of the students are nice kids and keen to learn.

The text books for the standard classes are woeful, and the tapes are worse. It gets interesting when you go to senior classes with quality text books and tapes. A lot depends on what you put into it, in the way of preparation, activities and the odd outing.

There are no Indonesian standards for teachers and their welfare, only for the schools. Housing is sometimes offered, but not always.

Indonesia as a whole is how you interact, make friends with the locals, learn the language and enjoy the culture, the sounds, the scenery, but you need to get out of the big cities to do that, IMHO.

[laughing_magpie06]

EF is bad but yes is an entry level position. One thing to consider is regardless of your qualifications, you will always been seen as nothing but a puppet or clown for a bunch of rich, spoilt Indonesian kids who have been raised by nannies and drivers since they were born. And if any of these kids complain management (who of course are locals) will always take their side over yours.

[wailing_imam]

What textbooks are used in senior classes?

Are they photocopies?

[ezekiel]

I worked, briefly, at the Medan EF schools before they closed down the first time in 2005 and I only ever saw photocopied books there

salam

ezekiel

[guruengerish]

Anyone in recent years who has been at EF Kalimalang deserves all that s/he gets!

There have been so many warnings about this place, it's unbelievable.

There is a close family link with this school and the EF schools in Central Java, so be warned!! (They were the worst-paying schools in the country. I wonder if this title still holds good)?

In regard to the text books, some EF schools actually do provide originals of the UK series of the better English books, such as 'Headway'. They're normally for level 11 and above. Other schools just provide photocopies, and the Teachers' Guides are of course copied from the one original the school/Head Orifice has bought.

The tapes are of different English speakers around the world, and not some actor pretending to be Welsh or Aussie or North American, but of course, these are all copied.

More professional schools do provide the students with their own CDs and original text books, but are far from cheap.

[jhemmila]

To say that all EF's are bad is like saying all McDonald's are bad because you heard that a few of them undercooked a burger.

Remember that EF branches are franchise owned, and they are not all run the same. I will agree with the vast majority that says Swara group isn't very good. However, the school I work for has been nothing but great. Saturday classes can be a pain, and the General English level textbooks are awful, but the staff and students are, for the most part, great to work with.

As for the pay, compared to a national plus school, of course it will be lower. I haven't been able to save anything while working here, but I have taken trips to Bali and Sumatra and all around Western Java. I also go out a lot. It has been a great way to spend a year, and depending on the offer, I may stay.

Oh, and all textbooks at my school are original, the only things photocopied are master copies of tests.

[java_gila]

if you don't mind jhemmila,

can you tell us what is the name of the great school you are working for?

[sherlock]

I must preface this by saying that I have never worked in an EF, only spoken to teachers who have.

I think Jhemmila is right, they are not all bad, but I think what a lot of people are getting at when they say they are entry level places is that there are better out there so why would anyone want to risk it. You can go to schools that don't make you work Saturdays, give you extra holiday leave and treat you well, so why take a position that could be dubious and doesn't have the same benefits. To that end, they are really entry level places.

I know most language schools where I live take anyone they can get. They all seem to have similar packages, not Sat work, 25 teaching hours, holidays, flights, shared housing, all KITAS organised (properly) and all have good reps, so EF is really the bottom of the barrel compared to them.

[ngantuk]

Interesting comparison J - no need to discuss the similarities between these 2 franchises n why this is the case. Remember there has been more than 1 complaint about more than 1 EF. Not everybody can be wrong.

Anyway Hungry Jacks always make a nice burger.....

[jhemmila]

[malu]

[benbobaggins]

Hi,

I worked at EF Kelapa Gading, and I learnt a great deal there. It was well ran with a good, compassionate DOS who had to put up with the usual b******s from half-arsed teachers. Quite good considering actually...
I did 2 years and fulfilled my contract. I then went on to bigger & better things. So, no, not all EFs are bad.

[laughing_magpie06]

Yes, one of my friends here used to work at Depok and said it was easily the best EF he worked at or knew about. Said that education was truly valued and if the students didn't show up they would have to repeat unlike the other mills. In my own experience I found EF West Jakarta to be particularly poor and Cibubur to be not much better. They did, however, treat their teachers better for a while.

[englishgibson]

the students would've to repeat sounds like they'd fail a grade sorry, i don't mean to be rude, but why would you guys go on about this mill