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How Long Must You Stay at the School?
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Miyazaki



Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 635
Location: My Father's Yacht

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 4:06 am    Post subject: How Long Must You Stay at the School? Reply with quote

A question for some of the teachers here who know about visa laws in Japan.

How long must one stay at the school that hires them and sponsors their visa before they quit? It seems to me that I have not come across any immigration policies that state a teacher must remain at the school until the contract has completed.

For example, let's say a teacher comes over on a 3 year visa, are they not legally entitled to quit working for the school even before they show up for the first day?

I ask, because when Nova was up and running, I'd heard about new teachers quitting during the first week - barely out of training - to go and work at in a different city or for other schools.
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AndyH



Joined: 30 Sep 2004
Posts: 417

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 4:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe you can quit as soon as you get your visa, if you wish.

Japan is not like South Korea, where you need to get a letter of release to continue working in the country.
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Miyazaki



Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 635
Location: My Father's Yacht

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 5:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AndyH wrote:
I believe you can quit as soon as you get your visa, if you wish.

Japan is not like South Korea, where you need to get a letter of release to continue working in the country.


Yeah, that's what I'm trying to figure out. I have friends in Korea and they have to: a) leave the country if they quit or b) get a letter of release, which can be really difficult to do at times.
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benshi



Joined: 16 Feb 2007
Posts: 48

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You don't have to leave the country before your visa expires. However, if you wish to renew your visa, you WILL need a letter of release from the company who initially sponsored it.
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Miyazaki



Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 635
Location: My Father's Yacht

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

benshi wrote:
You don't have to leave the country before your visa expires. However, if you wish to renew your visa, you WILL need a letter of release from the company who initially sponsored it.


Which country are you talking about: Japan or Korea?

In Korea, your visa is tied to your school. You stop working for your school and you need to: a) leave Korea and not return until your contract date has expired, or b) obtain a letter of release (this isn't always easy).

My question is, and it seems to have be answered in the first post, can one simply arrive with work visa stamped in their passport and then summarily quit their school and work for another school.

Can the 1 or 3 year work visa sponsored by school "A" be taken away or stripped from the new teacher for jumping ship to school "B" ?

The answer appears to be "Yes."
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Glenski



Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
My question is, and it seems to have be answered in the first post, can one simply arrive with work visa stamped in their passport and then summarily quit their school and work for another school.
Yes, you can. Bear in mind a few things, though.
1) Some people have not even met their employer/sponsor at the airport, and then mysteriously disappeared for work elsewhere.

2) If the next employer looks at your record carefully enough, he may have doubts about your reliability.

3) The first employer deserves a modicum of respect, IMO. Unless there is some mitigating circumstances, it is a pretty low thing to do, not only to the employer but to his students. Both have prepared to meet you.

4) To do something like that continues to put foreigners in a bad light for some employers. How will that improve working conditions here?

Quote:
Can the 1 or 3 year work visa sponsored by school "A" be taken away or stripped from the new teacher for jumping ship to school "B" ?

The answer appears to be "Yes."
Why do you say yes? Jump ship if you like. If the next school is willing to sponsor/hire you, all the better for you. In fact, they don't even have to sponsor you.
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Apsara



Joined: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 2142
Location: Tokyo, Japan

PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The answer is no. Your visa is yours. You can leave your sponsoring company and move to another job as many times as you like- I've done it twice myself on 2 different 3 year visas. As Benshi says though, when you next go to renew your visa, one of the documents you are required to provide is a letter of release from the company that sponsored your visa.

This is not always strictly enforced however- several months before my first Nova-sponsored visa expired (quite a few years ago now) I contacted Nova asking them to provide me with that document, they said they would, I waited; nothing. A few weeks later I called them again, still nothing, this continued right up until a week before my visa was due to expire, when beside myself with worry I finally went to the Immigration office to tell them I had tried unsuccessfully to get the letter of release. I was told there that it "probably didn't matter", and soon had my new 3-year visa.

In short, it's a totally different situation from Korea. There are no rules about how soon you can leave or about how many times you can change jobs on your visa. As long as you have a visa and stick to the categories of work that the visa is for you are fine.

As Glenski said though, if you start applying for new jobs straight away then potential employers are likely to notice that you apparently didn't work for your sponsor at all- you would have to have a pretty good story to convince them you weren't completely unreliable and likely to bail out on them as well.
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Miyazaki



Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 635
Location: My Father's Yacht

PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 7:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apsara and others, thank you for the info.

Once the visa is stamped in your passport, then the visa is yours for 1 or 3 years. You can work for whomever and wherever in Japn you want.

Got it.
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fluffyhamster



Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 3292
Location: UK > China > Japan > UK again

PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing that didn't seem to be mentioned is that it is extremely unlikely that anyone would get more than a one-year visa for their entry to and first year in Japan.

The Labour Laws in Japan seem a bit hazy. Employers are legally required to provide letters of release 'without delay' (Article 22.1, see below), and give 30 days' notice (or pay in lieu) upon dismissing an employee, but there doesn't seem to be anything about how much notice an employee is meant to give in order to receive at least the certificate of employment/letter of release, although I have heard that two weeks' notice is the minimum (with a month being more preferable) - perhaps this is left to individual contracts? In which case, some contracts state three months, but that seems excessive and could well be an illegal clause (certainly, clauses that hint at the possibility of deductions, claiming damages etc surely are).

Quote:
When a worker on the occasion of leaving employment requests a certificate stating the period of employment, the kind of occupation, the position in the enterprise, wages or reasons for resignation the employer shall deliver the certificate without delay. (The reason for resignation is required in cases where the worker is discharged by the employer.)


http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?p=482421#482421
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markle



Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Posts: 1316
Location: Out of Japan

PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fluffyhamster wrote:
it is extremely unlikely that anyone would get more than a one-year visa for their entry to and first year in Japan.

Define "extremely unlikely". Because I know that the chances of me sleeping with Gisele Bundchen are "extremely unlikely" but since I got a three year visa on the first attempt, things are looking up. Wife might not be too happy about that...
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Miyazaki



Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 635
Location: My Father's Yacht

PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

markle wrote:
fluffyhamster wrote:
it is extremely unlikely that anyone would get more than a one-year visa for their entry to and first year in Japan.

Define "extremely unlikely". Because I know that the chances of me sleeping with Gisele Bundchen are "extremely unlikely" but since I got a three year visa on the first attempt, things are looking up. Wife might not be too happy about that...


Now that was funny! Very Happy

Yeah, I've met guys coming right off the plane first time with a 3 year visa stamped in their passports - Canadians, Australians, British.

It seems random.
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fluffyhamster



Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 3292
Location: UK > China > Japan > UK again

PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, that's the first I've heard of anyone getting a 3-year visa straight off the bat. I guess it will help your application along then if you slip in not only some money but also some crack.
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ripslyme



Joined: 29 Jan 2005
Posts: 481
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fluffyhamster wrote:
Well, that's the first I've heard of anyone getting a 3-year visa straight off the bat. I guess it will help your application along then if you slip in not only some money but also some crack.


My first working visa was a 3-year. It is kind of random, but it happens.
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fluffyhamster



Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 3292
Location: UK > China > Japan > UK again

PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OMG! A plague of lucky bumper visa holders! Curses!

Last edited by fluffyhamster on Thu Feb 28, 2008 2:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
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ripslyme



Joined: 29 Jan 2005
Posts: 481
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fluffyhamster wrote:
OMG! A plague of lucky bumper visa holders!


My luck didn't hold as every visa I've had since then was a 1-year. Crying or Very sad
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