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Mia Xanthi

Joined: 13 Mar 2008 Posts: 955 Location: why is my heart still in the Middle East while the rest of me isn't?
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Posted: Thu May 29, 2008 7:38 pm Post subject: selective universities |
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| Hold on there, Auntie Mia. They hired me (and you, not to mention His Excellency Uncle Scot, Uncle 007, and most of the other denizens of this board), so they MUST be selective (and have great taste, as well.) |
OF COURSE, they were selective when they chose us, John!
However, the point is that it is difficult to find people to come to the Magic Kingdom nowadays. I think that even institutions that would like to be selective find themselves hiring just about anyone who will come. If what I see around me is "selective" then it is hard to imagine what they are selecting from.
Again, John, I'm sure that when you were here, they were very selective. With me, they just got lucky.
Ghost, I have heard that looks play a big part in hiring in Korea, but I didn't realize it was to that extent. I do agree that in comparison, Saudi institutions tend to focus more on qualifications than on looks and age. |
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Never Ceased To Be Amazed

Joined: 22 Oct 2004 Posts: 3500 Location: Shhh...don't talk to me...I'm playin' dead...
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Posted: Thu May 29, 2008 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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Last edited by Never Ceased To Be Amazed on Fri May 30, 2008 1:22 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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scot47

Joined: 10 Jan 2003 Posts: 15343
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Posted: Fri May 30, 2008 6:13 am Post subject: |
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NCTBA
Those bad chemicals are building up in your brain again. |
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cmp45

Joined: 17 Aug 2004 Posts: 1475 Location: KSA
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Posted: Fri May 30, 2008 8:09 am Post subject: Re: selective universities |
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"Mia Xanthi"
... the point is that it is difficult to find people to come to the Magic Kingdom nowadays. I think that even institutions that would like to be selective find themselves hiring just about anyone who will come. If what I see around me is "selective" then it is hard to imagine what they are selecting from. |
Perhaps it's not so much the selection/ interview process, but more to do with the actual reality of life on the ground... once teachers arrive in the MAGIC Kingdom they can not cope with the KSA culture and religous laws and thus go through a transformation from that of sane, competent individual, etc. to a paranoid raving lunatic. It can be hard sometimes to predict how a person will react, or cope living and working in KSA. However, one should look carefully inward to analyze the self to see if they are able to handle the transition to the MAGIC Kingdom.  |
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Never Ceased To Be Amazed

Joined: 22 Oct 2004 Posts: 3500 Location: Shhh...don't talk to me...I'm playin' dead...
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Posted: Fri May 30, 2008 10:37 am Post subject: |
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NCTBA
Those bad chemicals are building up in your brain again. |
Whew! I think YOU'RE right! I just got PMed and after a little thought, I realize that it was my BAe co-workers that I first heard it from. They had it wrong and I just propogated the error. My apologies to MX, 007, et. al.
NCTBA  |
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ghost
Joined: 30 Jan 2003 Posts: 1693 Location: Saudi Arabia
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Posted: Fri May 30, 2008 5:08 pm Post subject: re |
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| If what I see around me is "selective" then it is hard to imagine what they are selecting from. |
Yes, that is right. They are selecting from the best, out of a reduced applicant pool.
First off - in the selection process, there are many less women to choose from, because there are not many 'qualified' women with M.A.'s who choose Saudi as a teaching destination for obvious reasons. Only a few places, to my knowledge, have teaching positions open to foreign women in Saudi. In Korea, the middle aged guys with M.A.'s are competing with young ladies for some plum Univ. jobs and guess who usually gets the offers?
Also - not many young, dynamic guys would choose Saudi, because there are, no doubt, other more stimulating places to work.
This means that middle aged applicants who would stand less of a chance elsewhere have more of a chance in Saudi - again, a reduced pool of applicants. Saudi has a possibly ill deserved reputation as being a very difficult place to teach in with a hostile environment. Scot and others have shown us that one can lead quite a jolly life in the Kingdom, provided one is resourceful and not in need of hand holding all the time.
Ghost |
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johnslat

Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 13859 Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
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Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 2:33 am Post subject: Change, change, change |
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Dear cmp45,
"It can be hard sometimes to predict how a person will react, or cope living and working in KSA."
Oh, so very true. I knew individuals there who actually BECAME alcoholics in the Kingdom, while others (such as myself, for example) turned into teetotalers (something those who knew me before my sojourn there would have found difficult, if not impossible, impossible to believe.) |
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Imdramayu

Joined: 09 Feb 2007 Posts: 394 Location: South Korea
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Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 3:04 pm Post subject: US cultural mission (USCM) |
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Is it possible to have my US university transcript & degree certificate mailed to US cultural mission (USCM) with a payment and envelope to send it to my local Saudi embassy? That would be quicker than the US university mailing it to me, me mailing it back to USCM, then USCM mailing it to me. Wouldn't it? The Saudi embassy in Washington website states that some documents they certify will be automatically forwarded to the required embassy. See www.saudiembassy.net
In the US, is there an equivalent to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs which also must certify my US university degree certificate and transcript?
This is contact info for USCM in Washington. Their website is all about Saudi students studying in the US so they may no very helpful in answering questions.
Saudi Arabian Cultural Mission
2600 Virginia Avenue, Suite 800
Washington D.C. 20037
Phone (202) 337-9450
Fax (202) 337-2978
SACM E-mail [email protected]
http://www.sacmonline.us/new/
University Degrees (from www.saudiembassy.net)
For verification of university degrees, the following should be sent to:
Saudi Cultural Mission
2600 Virginia Ave. Suite # 800
Washington, D.C. 20037
Name of applicant & S.S#.
Name of Employer.
Name of the Courier Agency.
A letter stating the reasons of for requiring Authentication.
A copy of the employment contract.
A copy of the applicant's passport.
A certified copy of the applicant's college/university degree.
Updated official transcript (in a sealed envelope).
Name of the college/university and telephone number of the registrar or the records office.
Verification letter from the registrar's office including applicant's SS#. (School ID number), and the telephone number and the contact person in the registrar's office.
Written consent to allow the Saudi Cultural Mission to verify the degrees. |
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Mia Xanthi

Joined: 13 Mar 2008 Posts: 955 Location: why is my heart still in the Middle East while the rest of me isn't?
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Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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| In the US, is there an equivalent to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs which also must certify my US university degree certificate and transcript? |
I hope I am reading this right, and that this is your actual question. It's called the State Department. I believe you'll get Condy Rice's signature on your docs before it is all over.
There are courier services in Washington who will take care of these things for you at a very reasonable cost. Just google "courier services + Washington" and make a couple of calls.
Again, I find it hard to discern exactly what you are asking, so disregard this if it is not appropriate. |
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Imdramayu

Joined: 09 Feb 2007 Posts: 394 Location: South Korea
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Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 5:46 am Post subject: Your help |
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| Mia....this is what I need to know. From what you're saying, the State Department needs to certify my US degree certificate and transscript? What's their address? |
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johnslat

Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 13859 Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
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Axel Heidsman
Joined: 24 Jan 2008 Posts: 22 Location: Area 47
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Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 10:32 am Post subject: |
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| It certainly seems that, as far as one criterion is concerned, it's easier to be selected as a candidate for the US presidency than as an English teacher in a Gulf university. At the age of 72, John McCain - with an MA in TESOL and fifty years of experience - would be wasting his time applying for a job here. If a considerable proportion of the American public will probably vote to select JMcC for what is arguably the most important job in the world, why won't institutions of higher learning consider recruiting teachers over sixty? What qualities must teachers have that are not required of US presidents? Instead of reducing the qualifications needed for employment, why not raise the cut-off age for recruitment? Applicants are screened by interviewers to ensure that no youthful lunatics are selected. The same procedure could surely filter out the senile [perhaps with more success, I hear you say]. This would be more cost effective than broadening the catchment to include married teachers with children by increasing the education allowance. [Does this sound familiar?] |
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Cleopatra

Joined: 28 Jun 2003 Posts: 3657 Location: Tuamago Archipelago
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Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 11:02 am Post subject: |
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| What qualities must teachers have that are not required of US presidents? |
Usually (admittedly not always) English teachers are expected to have a very good command of the English language, a quality which is obviously not deemed essential for any POTUS. Conversely, English teachers are not normally required to start wars of choice in distant lands, or to prostrate themselves for foreign nations. A grasp of basic logic is also a requirement for English teachers as opposed to POTUS's, though again, said requirement is occasionally waived.
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| Instead of reducing the qualifications needed for employment, why not raise the cut-off age for recruitment? |
In fairness, I would say most countries would be reluctant to take on 'older' staff from abroad. Besides, I believe the age cut-off is imposed by the Ministry of Labour, not individual employers. It is also often ignored, especially in private institutions. I personally know of several teachers who were recruited when they had already passed their 60th birthday.
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| First off - in the selection process, there are many less women to choose from, because there are not many 'qualified' women with M.A.'s who choose Saudi as a teaching destination for obvious reasons |
I really do wish you'd stop telling people who live here about working conditions in a country you've never been in - you are making yourself look increasingly silly. The number of jobs open to female teachers is considerably less than for men, that is true, but there are more and more women's colleges opening up, and in my experience they do not have more trouble recruiting than men's colleges do. In any case, your point is moot: because of segregation, men - however old and unattractive - will almost never be competing with women - however young and beautiful. So relax, your no doubt superb qualifications will speak for themselves. |
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007

Joined: 30 Oct 2006 Posts: 2684 Location: UK/Veteran of the Magic Kingdom
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Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 1:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Axel Heidsman wrote: |
| At the age of 72, John McCain - with an MA in TESOL and fifty years of experience - would be wasting his time applying for a job here. |
Well, it seems to me that he is wasting his time there for the US presidency!
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| What qualities must teachers have that are not required of US presidents? |
How to speak very good English!  |
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