Job Discussion Forums

bish · Joined: 26 Feb 2008 Posts: 30

Shanghai or Beijiing?

I'm looking into coming to China from September. I have 2 years experience (including 6 months in a bad job in Beijing) a CELTA and a BA in English.

I'm looking to earn and save as much money as possible so I guess there are more oppurtunities in Shanghai and Beijing... Out of the two, which places are the best to live and earn/save money?

I know Beijing quite well and know some people there, so that is one advantage...

william wallace · Joined: 14 May 2003 Posts: 2869 Location: in between

I'd go with Shanghai.

therock · Joined: 31 Jul 2005 Posts: 1266 Location: China

Come to Beijing to earn as much money?? Just took a quick look at the Beijing Foreign Langauge University website, they are looking for teachers for September.......they offer 3200RMB if you have a Bachelor Degree and it goes up to 3500RMB for those who have a Master's.

william wallace · Joined: 14 May 2003 Posts: 2869 Location: in between

...and I used to work for them at 200 RMB per hour - My how time flies Crying or Very sad

Moon Over Parma · Joined: 20 May 2007 Posts: 819

bish · Joined: 26 Feb 2008 Posts: 30

Yeah, I've been finding Shanghai seems to be much better for pay...

If you work at a University do they usually allow/give permission to do part time work elsewhere? The hours and pay are low at University so I would be looking to do more hours and supplement my income...

SnoopBot · Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 740 Location: USA

Shanghai!

Beijing salaries are the worst for the cost of living ratio!

For BCLU (the university mentioned above) the salary is a joke but very common for this area. They still can find teachers at this pay rate too. However, those with a master's degree tend to go to better paying positions. (if you can find them these days)

The hours at BCLU are reported to be low, average of >12 hours per week. Which somewhat offsets the low pay.

My advice for any qualified REAL teachers with an advanced degree and experience.

Don't come to Beijing and expect to be successful, it is now common to find Chinese teachers earning more/higher pay than many of the FT's who have top qualifications in this field. You been warned, many better cities in China which have a lower cost of living and higher pay levels.

SpedEd · Joined: 31 Jan 2006 Posts: 143 Location: Shanghai

I want to offer my take re. the entire working in China scene and how it's relating to the Olympics being hosted here. It's my feeling that China has become the flavor of the month because of the Olympics and some clever marketing by it's government targeting wealthy western countries over the past number of years. This has enticed a lot of foreigners to come here who otherwise wouldn't have bothered pointing to China on a map.
I can't help but wait in anticipation for the mass exodus of foreigners, in addition to those who merely came here to take in the Olympics, to occur after the Games are over. Then we shall see the market readjust the salaries appropriately higher, as they should be, and has Adam Smith warned us about. For now, it's not a good scene to be working in, but stay tuned....

Moon Over Parma · Joined: 20 May 2007 Posts: 819

A'Moo · Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:00 pm Post subject:

Have to agree. These are China's olympics, and are marketed as such. Most foreigners I've talked to back home, IF they plan on coming here, make plans to come either two months before or after the games....
As far as sporting events go, the Olympics isnt what it once was...Doping, friendly relations between former enemies etc.
I think the World Cup is the pre-eminent event worldwide now...

SnoopBot · Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 740 Location: USA

The new visa restrictions are a big farce. They fear some protestors (pro-Tibet, Falun Gong..take your pick on which groups) will show up here to disrupt the Olympics on world-wide TV.

Thus, the visa restrictions for the average Joe-Blows which includes the lowly FT without the international business $$ backing. Those that have a valid Z-visa NOW must fly back home to their host country and renter China if their Z-visa expires during this period.

This is especially true for those that wish to change institutions after contract completion. The university area is hard-up for English teachers at this time. A fellow teacher's phone "rings off the hook" for privates here in Beijing.

The solution has been easy, the universities short teachers just raised our teaching hours. I have been over 20 hours a week since the end of April with the possibility of it being well-past 30-hours in July.

The pay has NOT gone up, they still will balk at the rates above 200 RMB and if they agree to these rates will double the class sizes to turn a higher profit.

Here is what seems to be happening as of today:

1. Severe shortages of new FT's for the Beijing area and Summer-camps.

2. Mass recruiting going on in Beijing, trying to recruit teachers from in-country as many FT's cannot get a visa if outside China. (Salaries being offered are lower or marginally higher than what existing FT's are already earning in their non-Beijing positions. Institutions are trying to use "Come watch the Olympics" as a market ploy. An offer of 5000 RMB a month DOES not GO as far here in Beijing than in some smaller area. Be advised.. the costs are much higher here.

3. Pay scales still low except for the odd-ball class that is scrambling to find a White face for their programs. Expect double class sizes and hidden non-teaching hours-travel time to offset this agreed "good pay."

4. Expect to work at least 20-hours a week with extra hiddened office hours, English corners or other non-paid hours. Those coming to Beijing might end up with a contract that dictates +30 hours. Those in Beijing are having their hours increased and contracts pushed to the limits of "breach of contract terms." Many of us are asked "as a favor" or "to help out" out of good faith. Be careful, once you give them "good faith" they will often consider you as a sucker for all non-paid and penny-pinching activities. It is better to "just say NO" early in the game and stick to the contract limits.

This is the stage most of us are at right now. The wages have not gone up yet, the teacher shortage has resulted in more hours and non-paid grey area contract hours. However, opportunity does exist for weekend private teaching as some places are running classes on weekends because most weekdays FT's are too busy with their primary teaching jobs. So this is a positive for those that want to spend their weekend earning extra money. I do not, as my current hours being over 25 (teaching in classroom) are pushing me towards the burned-out region.

Those that do take weekend hours, do not accept lower than 200 rmb an hour! (you're a sucker if you do)

In the Wu dao kou area, they are passing out business cards to the Chinese language students, bar-goers, and back-packers to teach English for them. Some high school students are now being courted for possible FT positions. (These are students here for a few months to party and take a few Chinese classes)

I am sure they will exhaust all possible avenues before increasing the salaries to a competitive level to retain and attract more FT's.