Job Discussion Forums

MattElz · Joined: 07 Jan 2004 Posts: 92 Location: New York, NY, USA

I am certain that in the next six months I will be either in China or Japan.

Which one will be a better experience and why?

(Considerations are: student loan bills to pay, no teaching experience or certification - although I do have a BA, am a native English speaker, and have published several articles as a freelance writer - not sure if that will help but I suspect it may.)

Glenski · Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 12844 Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

student bills to pay
How much per month? In Japan, figure on having 70,000 yen left over after a regular monthly salary at a conversation school if you have a moderate nightlife schedule.

no teaching experience or certification
Neither is needed in Japan at the conversation schools. Depending on your nationality, you may have to qualify for either a work visa (bachelor's degree) or working holiday visa (no degree needed, 18-30 years old, proof of financial support).

Publishing articles will not enhance your chances of getting a job in Japan as a language school teacher.

From what you have cited here, you fit the mold of a classic language conversation school teacher clone. Interview well, have a good resume, and write a good cover letter.

Which country provides a "better experience" depends entirely on you and how you adapt to either culture and the lifestyle. Opinions vary with the individual. If you ask more specific questions, it'll help.

MattElz · Joined: 07 Jan 2004 Posts: 92 Location: New York, NY, USA

"From what you have cited here, you fit the mold of a classic language conversation school teacher clone. Interview well, have a good resume, and write a good cover letter."

Glenski - thanks for the optimism. I was basically talking about the two cultures and the difference of lifestyles in each country. At first, I was all about going to Japan, but it seems that culture (from my limited knowledge) is a lot more uptight and pressured than that of China. Also, it seems like reputable schools (found w/the proper amount of research) offer more - accomodations, travel reimbursement, etc. Still, I could be wrong.

There are many parts of Japanese culture which intrigue me, but I just want to make sure that it isn't Reagan America on overdrive. That would be a lot to take.

And I'm sure this applies to most overseas teaching experience, but I already attended college and would like to steer clear of the lifer fratboy scene. (From reading these boards, it sounds hard to avoid in Japan.)

denise · Joined: 23 Apr 2003 Posts: 3419 Location: finally home-ish

MattElz · Joined: 07 Jan 2004 Posts: 92 Location: New York, NY, USA

That's the other extreme.

Gordon · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Posts: 5309 Location: Japan

MattElz · Joined: 07 Jan 2004 Posts: 92 Location: New York, NY, USA

Well ... Job Information Journal for one, but more so from returned ESL teachers. Anyway, I was not trying to make a statement, rather offer up somethings I had heard and see how accurate they were.

Gordon · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Posts: 5309 Location: Japan

I'd take the job info journal with a grain of salt. IMO much of it is exaggerated or posted by disgruntled people.

Atlas · Joined: 09 Jun 2003 Posts: 662 Location: By-the-Sea PRC

I never taught in Japan, but I've got a friend who did. He told me you work long hours there, work your * off. In China, you only work what you really want, how much you really want to blow on the weekend, or if you want to save you can do that too. Come to China, take vacations in Japan, have a lot less pressure! Living expenses are a lot lower here in the middle kingdom, and so is pay, but you know Japan is proportionately more expensive.

Both countries will sometimes make you feel like something brown on the bottom of a shoe, but only sometimes. Sometimes, you will be honored like a celebrity, beyond what one really deserves. Both countries have various cultures that have great things to teach an observant & diligent person. Or if it suits you better, both countries have bars and taxis and beautiful people. Both languages are tough to learn--but Japanese romaji (romanized) spelling is something like Spanish, a little easier to swallow, than the pinyin stew. Just takes time, is all.

I spent many years studying Japan culture/history and virtually nothing about China; and when it came time to choose, I chose Shanghai, and am loving it. Haven't taken my Japan vacation yet. Feel like I got the best of both worlds! One man's opinion.

BTW, Matt, your credentials no prob here in Shanghai, if you dress nice and act professional, you can talk yourself into the job you want. Other teachers can also give you a line on jobs. Student loans: you'll cover them, and still have a normal lifestyle--restaurants, nights out and everything--if you work steadily, schedule efficiently, and dont waste energy commuting a lot between jobs, or calling in hungover.

It's important to remember that this isn't such an unalterable decision--try one country this year, the other country next year, you'll be able to do it either way! Just get your butt over the pond! Don't worry, you'll love it!
In a little time, the bank account will fill. You'll see.

Ja mata & zai jian!

khmerhit · Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:24 pm Post subject:

And dont forget to try Cambodia! Very Happy

johnslat · Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:41 pm Post subject: Make mine Cambodia

Dear khmerhit,
From the frequency of your promotion of Cambodia, I get the feeling you REALLY like living/working there - or are you just lonely? Well, whatever the reason, please be careful where you walk:

"Cambodia's on a slow mend, but there's nonetheless a continuing potential for sporadic violence, petty crime and banditry, and landmines and unexploded ordnance. Cambodia is one of the world's most heavily mined countries, with up to six million undetonated mines dotted around the countryside."

Regards,
John

khmerhit · Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:58 pm Post subject:

PresterJohn,

Yeah, a bit of both, mate. Rather sad, isn't it? In my defense I can only say I'm still in culture shock--plus I've got family over there.

Also, quite sincerely, it's a country people do get attached to. When I lived there I was amazed to see visitors constantly coming back-- a bit like a dog to its vomit sometimes. But once you get a taste of it you understand. I suspect there are a few --a few-- other countries made in the same mould, probably African ones. Oh, and Afghanistan. If I got a taste of Kabul I would probably stay there for good.

As for that landmine stuff, it's true for unfortunate people who live in certain rural areas, no question. The locations of the mines are well known,
but there are lots of people, such as farmers and forest dwellers, who cannot avoid going into dangerous areas.

It's safe for everyone else. And hey, as I say ad nauseam,
Try it and see!! Very Happy

all grooviest
khmerhit

johnslat · Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2004 10:34 pm Post subject: The lure of the exotic

Dear khmerhit,
I know what you mean about getting "attached" to countries some might consider, well, too exotic at best, downright weird at worst. After all, I did go back to Saudi Arabia 4 times and ended up spending 19 years there. I'm not so sure I'd unqualifiedly recommend it for everyone, though:

"Try the Kingdom and see!"

Nope - doesn't have quite the same "ring" to it as your tag line. Besides,
while Cambodia may well appeal to a wider range of EFL teachers, you have to be, I think, a little weird yourself (at a minimum) to stay in Saudi Arabia for the long haul, to keep going back or both. But if I weren't such a geezer and wasn't embarking on a new "career" here in Santa Fe, well, I'd be tempted to

Try Cambodia and see.

Regards,
John