Job Discussion Forums

[Brooks]

I have been teaching a culture class, and I taught my students about hidden culture. Hidden culture includes the things that people learn when they live overseas. I think it was Edward Hall who coined the phrase.

Hidden culture may be things that may contribute to culture shock.
Hidden culture might not be found in books, and can be unexpected.

Before we came to Japan, we might have known about the tea ceremony, when we have to take off our shoes, and could have read about holidays or festivals. But that is visual culture.

Examples of hidden culture are the sempai/kohai system, the different ways of saying goodbye (ja ne vs, sayonara vs. osakini), staying late at the office when there is nothing to do, etc.

If you know of any examples, please share them with me. It is something my students like to talk about.

[PAULH]

Boy do I have a list for you- I taught 'expression' or hyogen where students had to describe aspects of Japanese culture in English. Try these for size

Japanese refusing to speak Japanese to foreigners
They speak to you in English when you ask them a question in comprehensible Japanese
chotto
meaning of 'kawaii'
ninjo/giri
o-miai
o-chugen
reikin
shikikin
yoroshiku
ronin
sado
who is a 'sensei' to Japanese? (Eikaiwa teachers?)
shushoku katsudo
toilet slippers
oshibori
undokai
sumimasen/gomen nasai
yakyu/ MLB
bowing
iki-nomi
nyugaku-shiken
gaiji senshuu (baseball)
shudan shugi (groupism)
pornography/pubic hair
o-seiji
sleeping on trains
obatarian
Giri-choco
White Day
Loose socks

[ellienihon]

A few more for the list

tatemae
enryo
lack of comprehensible street addresses
appropriate ways to meet someone (introductions, where acquaintances can meet, etc)
Japanese understanding of religion vs. religion in Japanese life
Rules for eye contact
Treatment of strangers

[Lynn]

enjokosai

[Brooks]

what was that, Lynn?

[PAULH]

Brooks

My eyesights not as good as it used to be, but I can make out 'enjo-kosai' which is 'compensated' dating between high school girls and 30-ish salarimen. High school prostitution, if you like.

[guest of Japan]

Thanks PaulH, I couldn't read it either.

[fat_chris]

Would shenanigans, hijinks and tomfoolery that happen behind the closed door of soaplands be considered "hidden culture?"

[Brooks]

thanks Paul.

I will make sure I don`t use enjo kosai as a topic of discussion.
I am familiar with the term.

I teach at a high school and 61% of the students are female, so I won`t mention soaplands either.

[fat_chris]

Would that be sopurando?

[flaco]

is it really true that most japanese will not speak japanese to a foreigner if they know english? i was hoping to be able to gain some proficiency in the language while i'm living there by having SOME conversations in japanese. i suppose a fair amount of japanese people don't speak english, though...

[flaco]

is it really true that most japanese will not speak japanese to a foreigner if they know english? i was hoping to be able to gain some proficiency in the language while i'm living there by having SOME conversations in japanese. i suppose a fair amount of japanese people don't speak english, though...

[Gordon]

Where I am, it's not a problem to get Japanese people to speak Japanese as that is all I will get. When someone says they want to learn English, I am shocked. I ask why since there is very little need to know English.

What is it about the Japanese fascination with English or should I say Engrish?

[cafebleu]

Hi flaco, from my experience you are correct. The fact that Japanese people who know English and are willing to speak it do, can be both good and bad. If they are your friends it is okay (real friends, that is) and if they are really your friends even if they speak in English to you, they will expect you to likewise practice your Japanese on them.

I have lived here for a while and one of the biggest lessons I have learnt in Japan is to not worry about brushing people off and not to be used in the cause of good international relations. I was taken advantage of any no of times in my first two years here. Don`t give free English lessons.

Example - I worked in a small eikaiwa in inaka (countryside and certain women would always come early. Their purpose really was to get free English outside of class. I would say, `Sorry, you are a little early (eg they would come 15 mins before class and talk to me - not acceptable as it is my free time just before class) and go about my biz without speaking to them.

Example - high school students who invited themselves over to my house, hung around speaking in their broken English to me but would not reply when I spoke Japanese. They then asked me to hook them up with homestays in the UK,my home country. These girls never asked me to go anywhere or never offered to show me around. This was when I was new to Japan and very isolated in the countryside. Guess what - those girls have never been hooked up with anybody in my country for a homestay!

Another example - students who wanted to be so called friends outside of class but never spoke one word of Japanese to me to help me along. They always wanted English because of course it was free at those times. I found that with ex students - the purpose of the socialising seemed to be for free English so I asked very nicely if they wanted a private class. When they of course said no, I told them I was a little too busy to be spending so much time speaking in English outside my job.

Watch out for those cases. If your Japanese friends are real friends they won`t just leech English from you for free. Insist that if they are getting the benefit of English, you get the benefit of Japanese practice.

[fat_chris]

Spot on, cafebleu!

Although I have never been to Japan, I am very familiar with the concept of English Vulture.

Like Ron and Nancy said in the 80's, just say no!