Job Discussion Forums

leby26 · Joined: 30 Jan 2004 Posts: 68

Hello out there,

So I�ve worked up the courage to post a message here, and I hope that I won�t get too many personal attacks on either my writing, my silly questions, my naivety, and some other things I�m sure some of you might think of. I�ve been reading hundreds of messages on this site that sometimes really just scare the crap out of me! There is so much negativity; so many horror stories; so many people complaining of almost anything they can think of, it�s making me think I should just scrap all of my plans to teach ESL altogether!

I must admit that I am your standard clich� University student who wants to travel for at least a few years after graduation to gain some experience and perspective, see what else is out there....blah blah blah, I know I know you�ve heard it all before. But it�s the truth. I have wanted to teach, in some capacity, for as long as I can remember; but, (here come the attacks) I don�t have any real practical experience in teaching. I know - you say you�ve wanted to be a teacher forever, but you�ve never even taught before - anything? I know - I know its just silly, but I�m working on it.

I dread to think of myself as ending up just like so many others - working the 9-5 under flourescent lights; waiting for the paycheck; waiting for the weekends; primetime TV; waiting for those yearly vacations so you can travel; waiting for retirement so you can travel (!); basically just waiting, and waiting to die! (ever seen the opening to �Trainspotting�, yeah) Aarrggh! Don�t get me wrong though, I�m not trying to insult those who do that, its just that from my perpective it looks that way - and I�m not everybody. As I get older I may crave that life, and that security, but right now I need to see what else is out there. I need to get out there and discover the world, take chances, and experience all that I can (clich�, clich�, clich�) to get to know what I really want from life - if I even want to be a teacher, if I want to go back to school, or if I want to sell fruit on the corner, who knows?

I first found out about teaching english overseas because a group called �Oxford Seminars� likes to post flyers all around my school, and it sparked my interest. I started to look into it, and it sounded great for a back-up plan after graduation - it�s only around $800, its a few weekends adding up to 60hrs, you�re almost guaranteed a job, and its offered locally (as well as in a lot of other Universities in Canada). I thought, hey - sounds unbelievable! Then, as I start to research more, I found a mountain of other certification courses and read that apparently although there is no one exclusive agency or standard, the recommended international standard is apparently that the course has 100hrs of class time, at least 6hrs of teacher training (to foreign students) and that the place be externally moderated. Ofcourse, the �unbelievable� course I was going for now had 3 strikes against it.

As I keep doing more research, I keep getting more and more overwhelmed. I�m finding so many different certification courses out there, but I don�t know who to trust, and I don�t want to spend thousands upon thousands of dollars and then get hosed! (who does?) I�m currently deciding between getting my TEFL certificate through �Via Lingua�, or �TEFL International�, or getting my CELTA through International House. I�ve had my heart set on Europe and the UK, but from reading all the messages on here about these areas, I�ve almost given up hope! Should I just go to Asia w/o a certificate and teach there for a few years and get out? Is it even worth it?

Sometimes I think - �who cares about the crappy pay you�ll keep getting, you�re in (insert amazing location here) it�s worth it!�, and other times my prudent and practical side kicks in and I feel like just forgetting the whole thing. I still need to pay off my student loan, for all the travel expenses, and if I decide to continue my education either in the EFL world or in Teacher�s college back home or in the UK - so its hard for me not to be worried about paying thousands of dollars on a course and then getting paid less than I do I at my part-time job now. And then my other side kicks in again and says - just go for it Laura! You�re not living if you�re not taking risks like this, you just have to trust it and dive right in - no regrets! And then my doctor reminds me to take my medication! Smile

Now that I�ve rambled on long enough, I should take a breath. Maybe I�m just asking for some hope here or some encouragement - but I don�t want you to lie to me either. Can any of you tell me more about either Oxford Seminars, Via Lingua, TEFL International, the CELTA at International House, or any good certification courses? I really need you help, whoever�s out there, b/c right now I�m just really scared and feeling as if its all just hopeless! And I already realize how silly I sound, and how ridiculously long and rambling this post is, so you needn�t waste time in reminding me Wink

Thanks in advance for all of your help, information, or advice. I sincerely hope to hear from you soon, and take care.

Best Regards,

Laura

khmerhit · Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 5:08 pm Post subject:

Laura, it sounds to me like you are already on your way.

The Celta is a good course, I don't know about the other ones. After the celta you will be ready for anything.

Have you heard about the VSO scheme wherein they will pay for you celta training if you commit yourself to them for a couple years?

Personally I recommend you go somewhere far from Europe, like Mongolia. You can alwasy see Europe. And there are lots of jobs out there, plus the oportunity to save money, especially in Korea and Taiwan. But the really interesting places, like Vietnam and Cambodia, Mongolia and Indonesia, also make it possible to save. Best of luck and Godspeed!

NB. I believe VSO accepts North Americans. I did my Celta in Toronto with a woman in her 60s who was on her way to Mongolia. VSO paid for the celta course.

tammy · Joined: 07 Jan 2004 Posts: 45

Hi Laura!

First of all I want to say please don't be put off by comments that have been made on this forum. Take a look at another thread called 'getting courage to take the first step' and this might give you an idea of why you shouldn't let negative comments put you off.
I'm fairly new to the world of tefl myself and was in a similar situation just before I made the decision to pay a thousand bucks for a CELTA. I had just graduated and wanted to do some travelling but wasn't sure if TEFL was the right choice, and the idea of having a 9-5 job for the rest of my life was oh so depressing! Anyway - long story short - lots of thinking and many sleepless nights later I decided to take the plunge and it's the best thing I've done with my life so far, I'm almost certain that any other people who reply will say the same thing.
This doesn't mean, however, that tefl is all about being in an exotic location and living it up in a foreign country. Wherever you end up, you're there to do a job and as long as you're mature enough to understand that, which I'm sure you are, then you'll fit into the tefl world just fine.
It's possible to get a job in some parts of Asia w/o a teaching qualification, and it's very difficult to get a job in Europe if you're not a member of the EU. From my experience, having a qualification makes life a lot easier and opens a lot more doors. I took the Cambride CELTA at a private college in my home town and have never been told that I have the 'wrong' kind of teaching certificate - most employers will ask for a recognised teaching qualification but tend not to specify which one they want. I don't think there is a preference really.
I hope I've answered some, if not all, of your questions! Don't feel that your post is silly or ridiculous - a lot of people started off with the same emotions and can understand how you feel.
All the best!
Tammy! Very Happy

Guest · Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2004 9:34 pm Post subject:

Dear Laura

Do not be put off by the postings you read here. Just follow your heart and take the Course.

A lot of the people on this forum have nothing better to do with their time but to put other people down (I am one of the ones who was flamed initially).

It is a truly wonderful life over here (China) and I would be happy to discuss any of your concerns with you even though I have only been here for five months.

Just PM me.

Glenski · Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 12844 Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

Laura,

People find it easier to post negative things than positive ones, so just take heed on what the negative points are and move on. People like me tend to post the realities of the teaching world, but if you read carefully, it is not negative, just practical. I do my best to explain that certain things MIGHT happen, for example, or that certain things are COMMON. I'm sure you can understand that the Real World is not black and white with situations; everything is shades of gray, but I prefer to give people a heads-up, be prepared outlook just so they don't take someone's "hey, come on in, the water's fine!" approach blindly and then get burned.

You don't need teaching experience or even a teaching-related degree to teach in many countries. Many places hire on the basis of being a native English speaker. Consider what type of places do that and you will be forewarned about some of the work situations. In the teaching world, just like the rest of the working world, there are very few ideal jobs, and if one is not prepared vocationally, there is a better chance of failure or disappointment.

leby26 · Joined: 30 Jan 2004 Posts: 68

Hi everyone,

Thanks so much for all of your replies so far - I really do appreciate every one of them! 'Khermit', thanks so much about the VSO suggestion -do you know if it's offered anywhere else? Where in Toronto and through who did you get your CELTA in TO (I'm only a little over an hour away)? I'm going to keep looking into VSO myself, and again - thanks ever so much! But do you really think that I should just give up on Europe? I'd really hate to have to do that Crying or Very sad

And Tammy as well, where did you get your CELTA? Oh, and no worries, I'm not thinking of this as all just fun and games; living the easy life or anything - I'm counting on it being a challenge, and I'll do my best at whatever I do - there are no 'easy' routes in life, just ones that you may enjoy better!

'Rhonda place' I'll be sure to PM you in China to ask questions in the near future,and thanks thanks thanks!

'Glensky', thank you for your support as well, and for not trying to lie to me about it either. That's why I'm here, and researching all that I can now so that I can try to prepare for the good and the bad before I decide on anything. By the way, I don't think that I would seriously ever get into this blindly; walk into a school with no certification and expect them to hire me - I realize it could happen, but something like that could turn out for the worst as I've heard. Apparently you can get burned enough as it is with a certification, much less without one. No, if I'm going to do something, I'm going to do it right - I will get certified (no worries). Also, I don't plan on doing any of this until I've graduated from University (I haven't put in 3 yrs so far for nothing!) No, I would never quit school!

Also, when you quoted me to point out that I may not be ready for any job right now, I think you may have slightly misunderstood me, sorry about that. I don't mean that all office jobs, or many others out there, are so terrible at all - I just mean that personally, I would not be happy with that right now, but you'd I suppose you'd have to know me to understand - I've lived in a pretty small town all of my life; I'll be the first one in my family to have graduated University; nearly everyone in my family and in my town stays within driving distance to eachother; and I've never been away from home, never even been on plane (!). Right now, I know that there has to be more to life than that - or, at least, I want to find out! Who knows, I may end up doing such a job in the future, but I may find one that I truly enjoy, and then I'll think it's wonderful ('The mind is its own place.....') but I want to find out what else is out there first. I may decide to go back to school for my MA, to Teacher's College back home or in England, or find something completely different, who knows? Oh, and I actually did mention the areas I'm interested in (UK and Europe), but I know it may've been hard to find in that massive post!

Alright, so I've rambled on again even though I didn't mean to - sorry. Thank you all again for all of your replies, I sincerely do appreciate any replies I get, so again, thank you - did I say thank you? Also, again, if anyone knows anything about Via Lingua; Oxford Seminars; TEFL International, the CELTA through International House or another good organization you may know of, or about International House in general, please let me know Very Happy

I look forward to hearing from you, don't hesitate to be in touch!
Best regards,

Laura

Roger · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 9138

I can't understand someone fresh out of a long learning career wanting to switch sides to be a teacher herself...
I mean being a student must have been enough of torture; why on Earth wanting to be the most hated actor in the whole drama?

denise · Joined: 23 Apr 2003 Posts: 3419 Location: finally home-ish

Laura,

Here is attempt #2 to respond, as #1 got eaten by my computer. (Damn! Wasn't there just a thread about this very thing happening?!?)

As I was saying before technology got the better of me, I think you've got a great frame of mind--enthusiasm mixed with a desire to research your options. And, as many other posters have said here, don't worry about, and please don't be put off by, any negative comments that you read here. TEFL teachers come from all walks of life and all backgrounds, and I'd be willing to bet that many of us, myself included, didn't have too much teaching experience before getting into the field. I got into TEFL after finishing a degree in Peace and Conflict Studies, and I have managed to succeed as a teacher despite, in years past, being so shy that even introducing myself in my university classes was a major ordeal.

One thing that you mentioned in your post that I don't think I've seen a response to is your student loans. If you need to be sending back money every month, then many European nations might have to be crossed off your list of options East Asia and the Middle East would be better from a financial point of view.

Again, please don't be put off by negativity, and best of luck!

d

Wolf · Joined: 10 May 2003 Posts: 1245 Location: Middle Earth

leby26 · Joined: 30 Jan 2004 Posts: 68

Thanks everyone for the replies - I was scared of posting anything, but all of you have been super supportive! I still have some time to decide since I don't graduate from University until Spring/Fall 2005, which is good because I still have so much more to learn on my own and from all of you Embarassed

By considering all of your advice so far, I think it may be wise of me to do (a lot more) research, get certified (either go through NOVA, JET, Via Lingua, TEFL International, or the CELTA either through VOS or somewhere else - I still have to decide on that one first), and probably count on going to Japan or Korea (any suggestions?) for at least a year or two - until I can get enough money to pay off my debts, and save for Teacher's College - , and then teach for a while in Europe.

From all of the advice and info I've been reading, I should not expect to make a lot of money in most of Europe (not to mention all of the hassle of being a non-EU citizen as I've read) so I'll teach there for a while once I've saved some money and paid off debts. Does this sound reasonable? I will always appreciate any advice, info, and suggestions from any of you out there.

Thanks again, best regards,

Laura

leby26 · Joined: 30 Jan 2004 Posts: 68

denise · Joined: 23 Apr 2003 Posts: 3419 Location: finally home-ish

leby26 · Joined: 30 Jan 2004 Posts: 68

James_T_Kirk · Joined: 20 Sep 2003 Posts: 357 Location: Ten Forward

monty97 · Joined: 12 May 2003 Posts: 24 Location: Hong Kong

Hi Laura,

I did my CELTA with International House in Newcastle in 2001. I highly recommend IH, very professional and they frequently advertise for new teachers. It was, however, one of the more pricey CELTA courses, about a grand.

After the CELTA you should try to get some summer school work in the UK. There are loads of jobs, but be choosey, some are downright cowboy organisations. 4-6 weeks residential work at a summer school could easily cover your CELTA fee.

Your next step could be the reasonably well paid and well established JET programme in Japan. I'm afraid you've missed the deadline for August 04 entry but you could apply for 05. I think the application deadline is end of Dec 04 and you would have to be in the UK for Feb/Mar 05 interview. You can remain a JET for up to three years.

If you take this route then you will need some short term winter work. A friend of mine managed to string together several short term contracts in Europe over winter 01 and 02, after she had finished summer school.

Best of luck.