Job Discussion Forums

[Nabby Adams]

Been teaching a while and feel good about my teaching. I still suck at grammar and spelling it's true but I have got better and learned to work around it and almost never give myself away in the classroom.

Of course I know I can still teach the 4 skills; reading, writing, reading, speaking better, but I've probably learnt nearly all I can from my own experience and so want to learn from others.

So I guess what I am talking about is courses and/or books.

Anybody got any great book recomendations? Not on theory, but on practical skills and activities a teacher can use in the classroom. I'd be especially interested in books on how to teach writing and speaking as these are the areas that I seem to work in most.

Finally does an MA or a DELTA give a teacher practical skills rather than knowledge on how to teach and are they worth it to a teacher with experience who doesn't need the qualification as such?

[Justin Trullinger]

Books (in the order that I thought of them, not anything coherent.):

About Language, by Scott Thornbury. (The stuff you're worried about giving yourself away on is in here. And other stuff!)

The practice of English Language Teaching, by Jeremy Harmer, if you haven't read it already.

Something old by Stephen Krashen. (Either his 1978 or 1981 books, say basically the same things.)

Anything at all by Earl Stevich. (I'm honestly not a fan of Stevich. But he gets referred to enough by others it's nice to have an idea what he's about.)

Techniques and Principles in Language TEaching by Diane Larsen-Freeman.

From Input to Output, by Bill Van Patten.

SOmething about Lexis, by Michael Lewis.

How Languages are Learned (I think is the title, don' t have it with me here) by Lightbown and Spada.

Teaching With Your Mouth Shut, by Donald Finkel.





Okay, sorry, long list. Don't feel pressured to read all, and I'm sure some others with post with other ideas, and disliking some of my selections. But if you're enjoying teaching English, which it sounds like you are, virtually any of those will give you interesting, stimulating, and potentially useful food for thought about what you think about teaching.

Courses are, to me, a harder question in your case. If you don't need the qualification as a qualification, it's hard to justify the expense. (The good ones tend to be expensive.)

I'm not a DELTA fan, though some teachers I respect very much swear that it often reinforces stronger practical skills than many Masters programs. (Probably true- as some MAs are a heap of bull. But a GOOD MA would be as practical as a DELTA, and deeper, imo.)

I am pursuing a masters through Aston University in Birmingham- a program that I would recommend if you're a selfstarter and can handle studying very independently. But it does cost some cash, so I don't know if I'd do it if I didn't think there was a raise at the end.

Another possibility might be non-degree courses in education through a local university? Where are you?


Best,
Justin

[Nabby Adams]

Thanks Justin, a very detailed response. I'll research what those books are about. I'm in Japan and very settled in my job which I love. I'd spend the money if I thought it was worth it, but it wont help my pay packet.
If you don't mind saying, I'm curious as to how your MA will help your pay situation in Ecuador as it isn't, as far as I know, a country where high paying MA required positions are available.

[fluffyhamster]

Nabby, if you feel so good about your teaching (despite sucking at grammar, apparently), and can teach the four skills (very satisfactorily, you no doubt negelected to add), what's the problem? You're probably already doing some if not many of the things that the countless skills and recipe books suggest, and yes, why spend money forcing yourself through courses that you have no interest in? (I'm thinking MAs here, of which there is quite a range, rather than the hallowed DELTA).

Excuse me whilst I shake the irony that's dripping from my keyboard.

Right, that's better. What I'd actually like to suggest is simply that you try to brush up on "grammar" and start reading around in applied linguistics (whilst continuing to teach). But if you really do have no idea of what might take your fancy, isn't that ultimately a (large part of the) problem?

[Justin Trullinger]

Who took the sunflower seeds from the hamster? Geez- that was a bit harsh, wasn't it?

What in heaven's name is wrong with a teacher being happy where they're at, and also wanting to be better????

A guy posts a general question about wanting to improve as a teacher and learn more bout the field...and you tear his head off.

Really surprising.

By the way, Nabby, Ecuador doesn't have a LOT of well paid MA required jobs, but there are a few around. But I'm not Ecuadorian, or married to Ecuador. It's just where I'm based at the moment- but I work as a TESOL cert trainer, and the best paying work for this, worldwide, takes a masters. (I'm actually in Korea at the moment, training on a 2 month intensive...)

Best,
Justin

[fluffyhamster]

Sorry, I didn't think I'd come across as being harsh (at least, not unduly harsh). I suppose that ultimately I am not a big fan of books on methodology (they are sometimes, hell, often! quite divorced from empirical findings and other genuinely "principled" or "actually-give-a-t*ss" selectional criteria). Language itself is very suggestive of contexts, activities and thus methodology, and if you start to study and eventually organize enough of the lexicogrammar, chances are you'll have come up with better classes for your own students than most publishers could ever provide you with. But I appreciate that some schools can be very insistent that a teacher use only "approved" materials, and often there is not time, even when one is ostensibly "experienced" (i.e. has followed "recommended" methodology and materials to the letter) to come up with alternatives (where one would be allowed and wanted to)...still, how many actual textbooks and activity books can and do people wholeheartedly recommend? It's interesting that even though that was what Nabby was asking for, the books that you (Justin) have recommended are probably more "theoretical" than "practical" (though that is a dichotomy of sorts - Lewis said or quotes 'There is nothing as practical as a good theory', and usually theories come with illustrative activities attached, so people can get the idea of how to apply them), and the ones I'd be tempted to mention, not for the first time, more about data, about language items. A lot of teachers seem to just shrug and say 'I don't have time for something half-formed, I cannot be expected to flesh things out with my own ideas', and to some extent, guys like Lewis have left their ideas sorta hanging themselves...but again, the majority of standard textbooks aren't too satisfying either. Anyway, I'll suggest Thornbury & Slade's Conversation: From Description to Pedagogy again and for a start; Thornbury invented ELT 'Dogme' (to cut through the profusion of dodgy materials), which complements the analysis of natural conversational discourse (likely provided mainly by Slade) earlier in the book. All a bit too detailed yet subtle for some, but definitely worth reading if you are serious about trying to "teach" (more like accurately portray, demonstrate and encourage) actual conversation in the classroom.

[Nabby Adams]

I knew as soon as I wrote anything self promotional that somebody would have a go, but really I just wanted to get the point over that I'm not desperate to get better. I'd give my teaching 7/10.....I just want to know how I can reach 8,9 or even 10.

See if a beginner came to me I am sure that I could help them be a good teacher. At least "good" in the sense of what is required for Japan. I just wonder if there are practical guides to make a good teacher even better.

Thanks for the replies so far.

[Sonnet]

I'm not sure if there is a practical way to improve from where you say you are: certainly, teachers who reflect on their first couple of years' experience can become quite effective language-school teachers.

Any "jumps" after that come from looking inside the black box; you have the teaching toolkit, now you need to find out about how the engine (SLA) actually works, and how you can refine your teaching to better meet your learners' needs. As with learning a language, it's mostly down to input, input, input: attend workshops, seminars, distance-learning courses. Read books (good suggestions have been made here) and free stuff online (iteslj.org, tefl.net, hltmag.co.uk), and eventually you'll find you're looking at teaching & learning in a new way.

Good luck: the world needs more teachers who're interested in improving themselves!

[surrealia]

Nabby:

It sounds like you are off to a good start. Here are two books I've read recently that I found very inspiring:

Group Dynamics in the Language Classroom
by Tim Murphey, Zoltan Dornyei

AND

Doing Task-based Teaching
by Dave Willis, Jane Willis