Job Discussion Forums

[millsy99]

If you are working on a 10-month contract, and the school decides to fire you 2 months into it, are they liable for some sort of penalty for breaking the contract? There was no legitimate reason given, and I have been told that the power-hungry principal just does these firings all the time for no reason. I have certainly upheld my end of the contract and done everything asked of me, plus more. By the way, they have been completely legitimate with all my visa/expert certification/air fare issues so this was a bit out of the blue.

I was told they wanted me to stay until mid-December, and that I would be paid my salary (half-month for December) and given a proper release letter. So that is a plus, because I really want to stay in Shanghai. I have some money in savings so it's not an immediate concern but it will be soon. So I just wondered if there is some sort of penalty if they just spontaneously decide to break a contract with no reason given?
I would like to hear from some people who can advise me, either through Daves or at [email protected] THANKS!

[Voldermort]

It should be written in your contract that they must give you 30 days written notice otherwise they are liable to pay the breach penalty. They don't really need a reason why.

In your situation I wouldn't mess around with them too much since really, they are letting you go on good terms. Try explaining to them about the breach penalty and maybe you could come to an agreement on a suitable figure, but don't hold out for it.

[millsy99]

There is nothing specifically stated in the contract about them having to give a certain amount of notice or pay a penalty if they don't. Probably because this is the game they play.

Someone had mentioned even if it isn't spelled out in the contract, there is a certain amount they have to pay if they break it without cause. That's what I was wondering about....the amount, if it's even worth it to pursue, etc.

Thanks!

[Voldermort]

Really you should have a contract issued by SAFEA and appended to that should be the contract from your school.

Having looked at my contract it states

"If Party A asks to cancel the contract due to events beyond control, with the consent of Party B, it should pay Party B's return expenses"
"If Party A cancels the contract without valid reason, it should pay Party B's return expenses and pay a breach penalty to Party B."

So, either way you should get your airfare, but that breach penalty will end up being your word against theirs. Make sure you get everything in writing with the schools chop. First I would try to make an agreement with them about a breach penalty. If that doesn't work you could get a lawyer invloved but it really depends on exactly what is written in your contract.

[millsy99]

I have nothing from SAFEA and haven't actually even heard of that? Is it the labor board?

Does it make a difference if the school is quasi-Governmental? From what I've heard they are very powerful and basically are part of the gov't so maybe it won't be helpful to involve lawyers. Again, it would depend on the amount of money I guess. Thanks for your help though.

[North China Laowei]

[millsy99]

I realize I'm in a better spot than many have found themselves.... I was just preparing myself for the possibility that if I work out the remaining 2 weeks, I might not even get this letter I've been promised. Or the proper amount of pay. Yes, they have supplied my visa and reimbursed my airfare, but in every other aspect of the job they have been misleading, shady, and downright nasty. Welcome to China, I guess.

That said, I don't plan on doing anything as long as I have this letter in hand. I am quite content to slink away altogether with no fuss. I was just curious and my questions have been answered. Thanks again.

[brsmith15]

As you probably know, contracts here have no validity, anyway, unless you choose to go the legal route and the courts. Some have won; some have lost and were out their legal fees as well.

I agree with the others: Leave under the best conditions you can. Burning bridges here can only come back later in a way you least expect and don't want.

[Jordean]

Question withdrawn...

[Hansen]

Jordean, I'm often surprised by how little regard certain individuals have for their word. Used to be that being "a man of one's word" was considered a great compliment. China, being a land of liars, has no appreciation for the concept, although the Confucian ethic also commends those whose word can be depended upon.

While true that in many respects the West is in moral decline, simply as a matter of philosophy, apart from the ethical concerns, making a plan and following it through is usually accompanied by self respect and a sense of accomplishment.

A better job awaits me so I disregard my obligation. A prettier girl beckons, I forget my marriage, a lovelier dog becomes available so I discard my current pet. Where does it end?

[arioch36]

Don't totally agree. Resigning one's position because of a better offer elsewhere is common enough. Yes, if he left mis-semester I would call him slime. But if you give someone notice in a reasonable manner, maybe even help them find a new person, yeah a leader should perfectly understand that good jobs don't come every day, and while regretting your leaving, should allow you to leave

[Hansen]

Not surprised that you don't totally agree. That's my point. Few people display the kind of integrity to which I refer. The idea of a contract is to prevent either party from being left in the lurch.

If a school agrees to let you leave, that's another matter. It is strange that people here are crying about the unscrupulous Chinese when many of us have no scruples either.

[Jordean]

life's too short...back to work

[danielb]

As nobody has actually answered the original question, I�ll chime in. Under Article 47 of the Labor Contract Law, you are entitled to a termination payment of � of one month�s salary.

It is probably not worth chasing under the circumstances.

[arioch36]

If you are working here legally, that is you are here on a z-visa, I would advise you find out about the SAFEA. Do you have the Blue FEC book (most recent ones are blue, they used to be red). If so, you come under SAFEA whether you have their standard contract or not. SAFEA, i think is State Adminitration of Foreign Expert Affairs, or something like that. I have found them to be very cooperative, though not always very productive. In my city there are actually two such bureaus, both serve very similar functions. In the FEC book it says you have the right to arbitration. If you call them, they will call the school immediately. This costs you nothing.
They might be extremely helpful. They migh also just say that since you both are not pleased, it's best you both part ways. Such is the nature of arbitration. But it is very useful.

You have a residence permit (RP) in your passport? What is the date in it? Another option, more of a nuclear option, but very effective, is talk to the PSB FAO/waishiban, person who is in charge with matters dealing with foreign teachers. If the school is trying to end you contract before the expiration of the contract, this also comes under their jurisdiction has it effects the RP.

Labout "Law" in itself is sometimes not totally meaningful. Often it is all a game of chicken, who will blink first. Sometimes schools regurally try to do such things, especially to coincide woth a rise or fall in how many students. Such owners trust that you being a foreigner will be afrreaid or unknowing of how to protect yourself.

Big question, at this point what do you want? Stay their under the terms of your contract? Find a new school in China, but have him pay a bigger penalty for breaking his contract with you? Or just leaving China and going back home?