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Never Ceased To Be Amazed
Joined: 22 Oct 2004
Posts: 3500
Location: Shhh...don't talk to me...I'm playin' dead...
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 Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 12:38 pm Post subject: |
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I work in a neighboring country and pull in over 18,000. Besides the extra pay...a life. If Saudi floats yer boat, then by all means. If you want 15,000+ for a Master's, then there are much, much better places.
NCTBA |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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I am quite happy with my life where I am. I see colleagues regularly jumping over the fence for the sake of a couple of thousand riyals a month. Not for me thanks, I will stay where I am.
And anyway Dar Al Uloom is in Riyadh. I would sooner work on one of the planets orbiting Proxima Centauri.
Last edited by scot47 on Sun Feb 22, 2009 3:55 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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sheikh radlinrol
Joined: 30 Jan 2007
Posts: 1222
Location: Spain
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| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Never Ceased To Be Amazed wrote: |
I work in a neighboring country and pull in over 18,000. Besides the extra pay...a life. If Saudi floats yer boat, then by all means. If you want 15,000+ for a Master's, then there are much, much better places.
NCTBA |
When I was in the sandbox I was getting much more than Scotty gets now. I was teaching military personnel and the work was ''dull'' to say the least. I'd imagine that Scotty's job in a university is much more satisfying than the one I had. But, for heaven's sake! Why live in KSA to pick up 12,000 riyals? |
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Never Ceased To Be Amazed
Joined: 22 Oct 2004
Posts: 3500
Location: Shhh...don't talk to me...I'm playin' dead...
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| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 3:23 pm Post subject: |
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I heartily agree, but you know, there are some...not to be indicating any poster here...that find Saudi to be a lifestyle paradise. It takes all kinds SR. 
NCTBA |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 3:57 pm Post subject: |
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As Cleo has pointed out on another thread there is something strange about the "stalking" behaviour of the golf-obsessed Hispaniophile called Sheikradlinrol.
And as for the cybernetic advert for Guiness, he is intent on proving to all and sundry that he is doing well. Methinks he doth protest too much. |
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Stephen Jones
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 4124
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| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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It's a question of age. A couple of years back I worked out that when I was in Saudi all I did was surf the internet, post to online forums, sit in cafes and read books. When I wasn't in Saudi all I did was drink beer, surf the internet, post to online forums, sit in cafes and read books.
To go and live somewhere else when the only change to the lifestyle would be drinking every day twelve months a year instead of drinking every day four months a year didn't seem worth it either for me or my liver.
The SR12,000 is without the Masters. I believe you get a couple of thousand more if you have a real masters as opposed to the 'buy one get one free' Oxbridge variety, or the Masters-as-first-degree Scottish kind, and maybe more again if you have a PhD.
The work can be very pleasant. My last lot of students were lovely, and I've had some of the best classes I've ever taught in Saudi here and elsewhere. |
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Never Ceased To Be Amazed
Joined: 22 Oct 2004
Posts: 3500
Location: Shhh...don't talk to me...I'm playin' dead...
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| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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| scot47 wrote: |
And as for the cybernetic advert for Guiness, he is intent on proving to all and sundry that he is doing well. Methinks he doth protest too much.
Unlike you have, Scot, I'd attempt to pscho-analyze myself, but small, dark places scare me.
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johnslat
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
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| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 4:49 pm Post subject: |
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And so, once again we see the truth of this: Everyone has their own, private Saudi Arabia.
Some like it; some hate it; some tolerate it (I sort of doubt that any ex-pat loves it, but I could be mistaken.)
And a few can't seem to understand why not everyone feels the same about the Kingdom as they do.
Regards,
John (I liked it, but I'm admittedly a little weird: self-contained, like to read a lot; don't need much outside diversion; interested in different cultures/societies, even those I might not find too appealing. Besides, I really enjoyed my work there and made a number of very good friends, most of whom I'm still in contact with.) |
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Cleopatra
Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago
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| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 5:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| And a few can't seem to understand why not everyone feels the same about the Kingdom as they do. |
Several of those very people are active on this board.
While I'm personally reasonably happy with my life here, I am perfectly well aware that KSA is absolutely NOT for everybody and am always the first to point that out to potential newcomers.
However, a few of our posters seem to believe that just because they and/or their unemployable spouses didn't fit in in KSA, anyone whose experiences have been different is automatically misguided. Not everyone is yearning for the deep cultural and social thrills of Abu Dhabi or Kuwait City. |
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Never Ceased To Be Amazed
Joined: 22 Oct 2004
Posts: 3500
Location: Shhh...don't talk to me...I'm playin' dead...
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| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 5:48 pm Post subject: |
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| johnslat wrote: |
And so, once again we see the truth of this: Everyone has their own, private Saudi Arabia.
Some like it; some hate it; some tolerate it (I sort of doubt that any ex-pat loves it, but I could be mistaken.)
And a few can't seem to understand why not everyone feels the same about the Kingdom as they do.
Regards,
John (I liked it, but I'm admittedly a little weird: self-contained, like to read a lot; don't need much outside diversion; interested in different cultures/societies, even those I might not find too appealing. Besides, I really enjoyed my work there and made a number of very good friends, most of whom I'm still in contact with.)
Again, as always, very wise and precise words, John. I'm one of those who 'tolerated" it...but that was because Boeing required us to leave for holiday twice a year on their dime. Gratefully, they got the message from most of us who wouldn't renew if kept on the crappy B-2 and O-3 compounds and moved us to the fabulous Seder...and, then to the fantastic Jadawel compound...until it got bombed.
It's gratifying to note posters like you who could find the "pearl" in Saudi...I never could.
But, I never had a "bad Saudi reaction" as I termed it by some folk who JUST ABSOLUTELY LOST IT! Like my wife's apron that she got at one of those bazaars at the Yamama II compound sez, "If you can't take the heat, get out of the Kingdom".
As Cleo opined, the "KSA is absolutely NOT for everybody". It has, and can, trigger purile reactions in many. 
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darhell
Joined: 11 Feb 2009
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 10:21 pm Post subject: Re: DAR AL ULOOM COLLEGES |
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| bergerac wrote: |
Can you be more specific as to what part of the contract was not honoured?
Stamps in passports with a busines visa are usually only extensions of the business visa and there is nothing illegal about that. It is standard practice in the Kingdom and does not reflect any bad intention or double agenda on the part of the institution.
Visa regulations are sometimes complicated in Saudi Arabia for all employers and can be a real headache for the employee as well as the employer!
What I know of DAU is that they have one of the best packages for TEFL teachers, good basic salary (between SAR 14 000 and SAR 16 000) plus generous benefits. Settling in allowance and furniture allowance plus up to SAR 50 000 for housing.
Salaries get paid on time and benefits as well, even people being sacked get their due!
If you know another place which offers that in Saudi with a BA and /or MA, you let everyone in this forum know about it.
I am also curious to know what other institution, anywhere in the world would tolerate their employees posting that sort of libelous literature about them.
If you are working with these people and are still working there after writing what you wrote, I think it is a telling sign that they can't be this bad, because I am sure that they must know who you are by now.
Take care.
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Dearest Bergerac,
Welcome to Dave's ESL Job Forum. I am happy to have one of my DAU former/current (?) colleagues posting some propaganda on my post. I see you joined Dave's Job Forum a few days ago, to reply to my post I can assume. The package is good, but it is proof they are buying your silence, you are on 2 salaries with the uni aren't you? You know they dont honour the contract and that you are the prime example of the unqualified backbiting that happens in the college. And the people fired, in fact did not get their due. But, you can taint what I say all you want, I just want people to be warned about the environment they are joining. Almost all teachers have a monthly battle with HR or the poor coordination/management of the college, MONTHLY. The coordinator has no idea about ESL pedagogy or methodology or assessment or coordination.
TEACHERS CONSIDERING DAU: I am simply putting this information on this forum FYI only. As you know colleges in Saudi offer a lot of stress, just know, that DAU is not an exception. It is a good salary, yes. But money isn't everything, now is it? When you pay a salary like this, in an environment like this, you get teachers who only care about money, not the profession, development, or professionalism that I find much pride in my career. And, teachers who only care about a salary, aren't much fun as colleagues.
I will not be engaging on this forum with current/former (?) colleagues, but will answer your specific questions/concerns in messages. I am a professional and just want you to be warned. If you want to join DAU, do it with all the facts, not blindly. Thats what this forum is for, for us professional ESL teachers to support each other. |
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bergerac
Joined: 17 Feb 2009
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 6:50 am Post subject: |
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You are right, there is no need to make this into a personal thing.
You jump to conclusions too fast though, assuming I am a current/former colleague.
I was just pointing out to some obvious discrepancies in your post and clearly you have some private accounts to settle. This does not go well with objectivity.
I would like to read more from other people at Dar Al Uloom.
As you say, this forum should be informative and helpful and I think your kind of post is neither.
I have noticed that, most of the time, people use this forum to complain and describe their place of work as hell and warn others.
Although there are obvious rogue employers in the area, DAU did not strike me as one of them and I find it quite strange that people can be so openly critical and one-sided and still be employed.
As I said before, I don't know any employer, in any country, who will accept, from an employee, what you wrote.
In any court of law this would be considered libel and you would not stand a chance. |
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tudodude
Joined: 08 Mar 2007
Posts: 82
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| Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 8:43 am Post subject: |
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I see the " No sympathy for the newb" force are out in unified force on this one.
"Good Lord old chap, you din't even knbow this about KSA admin and HR..... Dear God you deserve all you can get."
Give them a break and empahtise. |
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darhell
Joined: 11 Feb 2009
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 11:30 am Post subject: |
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| bergerac wrote: |
You are right, there is no need to make this into a personal thing.
You jump to conclusions too fast though, assuming I am a current/former colleague.
I was just pointing out to some obvious discrepancies in your post and clearly you have some private accounts to settle. This does not go well with objectivity.
I would like to read more from other people at Dar Al Uloom.
As you say, this forum should be informative and helpful and I think your kind of post is neither.
I have noticed that, most of the time, people use this forum to complain and describe their place of work as hell and warn others.
Although there are obvious rogue employers in the area, DAU did not strike me as one of them and I find it quite strange that people can be so openly critical and one-sided and still be employed.
As I said before, I don't know any employer, in any country, who will accept, from an employee, what you wrote.
In any court of law this would be considered libel and you would not stand a chance. |
i didnt imagine i would face these threats inside and outside work. maybe you could teach law at DAU and pursue my libelous forum posts. or work for Hello! magazine to help them avoid it. i wasnt suggesting that you were current/former, it is apparent you are current. i was raising the question that i was current/former. luckily i am a former colleague, but i feel sorry for the currents that have to deal with your daily threats. are you going to sue them or threaten them that you "know" who they are? im glad you enjoy your large salary, but please stop being so disgusting to people who work under you. there is a way to lead in a way that people want to follow, not becuase they are forced to follow by the admin. you could do something wonderful with the opportunity you have been given. i encourage you to do so. |
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bergerac
Joined: 17 Feb 2009
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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| darhell wrote: |
| bergerac wrote: |
You are right, there is no need to make this into a personal thing.
You jump to conclusions too fast though, assuming I am a current/former colleague.
I was just pointing out to some obvious discrepancies in your post and clearly you have some private accounts to settle. This does not go well with objectivity.
I would like to read more from other people at Dar Al Uloom.
As you say, this forum should be informative and helpful and I think your kind of post is neither.
I have noticed that, most of the time, people use this forum to complain and describe their place of work as hell and warn others.
Although there are obvious rogue employers in the area, DAU did not strike me as one of them and I find it quite strange that people can be so openly critical and one-sided and still be employed.
As I said before, I don't know any employer, in any country, who will accept, from an employee, what you wrote.
In any court of law this would be considered libel and you would not stand a chance. |
i didnt imagine i would face these threats inside and outside work. maybe you could teach law at DAU and pursue my libelous forum posts. or work for Hello! magazine to help them avoid it. i wasnt suggesting that you were current/former, it is apparent you are current. i was raising the question that i was current/former. luckily i am a former colleague, but i feel sorry for the currents that have to deal with your daily threats. are you going to sue them or threaten them that you "know" who they are? im glad you enjoy your large salary, but please stop being so disgusting to people who work under you. there is a way to lead in a way that people want to follow, not becuase they are forced to follow by the admin. you could do something wonderful with the opportunity you have been given. i encourage you to do so. |
We are getting out of hand here.
I do not wish to continue on this line of argument as I have no interst in the matter.
This type of exchange leads nowhere and certainly not to better and useful information for other teachers, precisely what this forum is about.
I just wanted to add my contribution to this and disgruntled people are not necessarily right.
Presenting oneself as the victim is always easier because it attracts immediate unquestionned sympathy. Some people spend their entire lives developping the art of being a victim in order to avoid taking responsibility for their acts.
Whatever you do, it's always the other guy's fault, A bit too easy, don't you think?
I have read many posts and answered a few others in the past and I can make the same comment about them all.
Some things and people never change. |
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