Job Discussion Forums

[Hansen]

Some of you real teachers, I have a question about contextualization. When teaching language, is using material far removed culturally from the students considered a good approach? They then have to grapple not only with language issues but a foreign context that may be nearly incomprehensible to them.

After struggling for a few years with OE classes, I have started using Chinese translation items for oral English exercises. A dialogue in Chinese is written on the board. The students then translate it into, as they are able, English. They then use this material as a basis for a dialogue in English with a partner.

I have continued using this method because it captures the interest of the students. They actually seem interested in the learning task. How about from the perspective of language acquisition?

[eddy-cool]

[LongShiKong]

[sheeba]

I agree with Longshikong and Hansen.Translation in class is pretty much needed. I've never been taught that it shouldn't be used in class and feel teachers who are against it often haven't learnt a foreign language themselves or Chinese so use this as an excuse to ban foreign language in class.

I've had good results(in class) with community language learning methods. Have a look into Charles A.Curran from Chicago and his thoughts on this humanistic method. I'm siding with community language learning these days as opposed to the silent method which I feel asks too much of Chinese students. the translation zones them into an area where they have the gist and learn off each other.

Good luck and share results. I'm going to be experimenting this term with this.

[eddy-cool]

[Hansen]

What I like about it is that more students participate in the exercises. Some students who usually sleep through class are now participating.

The alternative seems to be students merely reading dialogues out of a book. I don't consider this oral English, simply reading. Most have no idea what they are reading. Translating requires them to recall or learn new vocabulary.

They also pick up grammar during the exercises. Most of these students, although they supposedly have studied English for about 5 years, are unable to have even a simple conversation.

Perhaps this is merely a revelation of my own limited ability as a teacher, but it seems to be the best thing I've tried so far, measured by student interest and participation.

[sheeba]

'self-actualisation and self-esteem are the ideals the exercise pursue.The techniques build rapport, cohesiveness, and caring that far transcend what is already there....help students to be themselves'( Moskowitz 1978)

There is reported success of bilingual education and language alternation procedures.

The whole point of community language learning IMHO is the wholeness that students feel and that you pointed out Hansen you've seen in your class.

I prefer to use CLL in small classes myself and don't do it all the time. Like any method it has limitations but why not exploit it if and when it works. I've used the method with newspaper reports.

I've translated a lot to learn Chinese especially in those early periods of acquisition. I can't quite work out how else you'd learn the language. The context and concept checking method has serious flaws especially when teaching beginners.

[sui jin]

Do your students participate more eagerly because it is a translation exercise, or just because the topic is culturally relevant to them (or a bit of both)? I mean do you choose dialogue topics and references that are directly relevant to the students' lives and backgrounds? Do, or would they, respond the same way to a Chinese dialogue about 'western' cultural themes?

It seems to me that a beginner language learner has to translate all the time. Chinese students in Oral English classes at college may be at 'false beginner' level, so translation exercises must be a good idea. I also think many of their other classes with Chinese English teachers involve some kind of translation.

In my listening classes I have tried a 'running translation' exercise. The class is split into groups of 4 but the group members have to be sitting separately from one another. One student from each group reads a very short news item in English, runs to the second student and gives a Chinese translation; second student runs to third and gives an English translation, third runs to fourth who writes down the English dictation. Then the original item and the group version are compared. It was fun, lively and involving.

[Buck Lin]

I learned it was a no no. But if it gets them writing and talking I am all for it. Teaching EFL is different from ESL. Their reality with talking with foreigners visiting China is that the foreigner comes here to learn about China and wants people to tell them the folk tales and history of China. So what is wrong with your students talking about what the know already?

[Voldermort]

Usually I am against using any form of Chinese in class since I try to hide the fact that my Chinese level is quite high. I really don't want the students asking me for explanations in class since it takes away their thinking ability ( in English ). However, after reading this thread, translating a dialogue from Chinese to English ( and maybe vice-versa ) could be a great way of showing the students how those formal/informal/phrases/idioms are used in real life.

Does anybody know of a suitable website where short meaningful Chinese dialogues can be found?

[Hansen]

The Crazy English 900 or English 900 books have a multitude of English to Chinese expressions and dialogues. Both of these volumes were prepared for Chinese people learning English. The dialogues and phrases are written in both Chinese and English. Each chapter has additional useful sections such as FAQ, "Interlinkage" and vocabulary. Everything is in both Chinese and English. The English translations are quite correct grammatically.

The Crazy English 900 book I am now using appears to be rip off of the Crazy English name.

[Peter Wales]

[Buck Lin]

TPR is a term or method developed by Dr James Asher and exponded apon by David Krashen. What I found after teaching English in four countries is that the best people in learning the local language were not studying it. They were were workers in factories and doing labor that no local would do. TPR is a way to deal with Krashen silent perion. It is imparitive in nature. It works and it is how you learned your native language.

[LongShiKong]

[Buck Lin]

The problem with the translation approach is that things like idioms and proverbs lose meaning when translated. Also you have things in certain languages that have hundreds of meanings and in others a few( types of snow for Inuits). I want my students to some day leave their dictionaries at home.
My feeling is that the language spoken by the student should only be used by the teacher when there is a breakdown in communication. Tests should have instructions in their language to avoid confusion.
The one thing that gives me joy is to listen to native teachers teach their whole class in their language. They teach about the language. Kind of like swimming lessons where no one ever goes in the water, they just practice their strokes on the dry dock.
I will always have work in China.