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lajzar · Joined: 09 Feb 2003 Posts: 647 Location: Saitama-ken, Japan

[quote="arioch36"]I still don't understand going to hospital. What does it mean? Are you saying that for Brit speak, hospital can be a verb meaning what? I am going to become hospitalized? Where is Jones when we need him?[quote]

Hospital is not a verb, any more than "London" is. Consider...

I am going to hospital.
I am going to London.

In this context, hospital is a noun that does not take an article when used with a particular meaning in British English.

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

No, going to school, and going to London are totally different. We use a different rule for going to a city or country. I can say I am going to the hospital, I am going to the city. I can not say I am going to the London, or Going to the China ...proper name are different. I have never heard I am going to city.

Sorry. Really, I don't understand why you say it differently if you are a doctor or patient. You haven't explained anything, just told me that you say it. Why does it make a difference?

I understand why we say I have classes, or I have school, I go to school, just like we say I go swimming every day. I can't explain it by rules, but it is not just a place, but an activity

Capergirl · Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2004 2:01 pm Post subject:

dmb · Joined: 12 Feb 2003 Posts: 8397

I don't know if it is UK/US thing but this is what I tell my students(This is off the top of my head as I haven't taught above Pre-int in the past 18 months and I have no books at hand)

I'll keep to hospitals and schools, as they have been the examples mentioned.

Think: What are hospitals for? Ill people. So if you are requiring treatment or giving it then there is no need for the definite article.{Doctors, nurses and patients- no "the"}

If you are a visitor(or a taxi driver taking someone to the aforementioned place) then you need "the"

Without doubt I think the use of articles is the trickiest thing in the English language.

I remember a couple of years ago I was leading a DTEFLA session all about articles. After a very heated debate we decided that there was only one rule about articles. That being we use a/an before singular countable nouns when we talk about occupations.
i.e. I am A teacher

Think: school What are schools for? Education. So if you are a student or teacher then there is no use for the definite article.

If you are a parent visiting the school for discipline purposes(not education) then you need to use "the"

Then again I could be wrong and wish to be enlightened

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

Okay, I accept that people have said it. I am not from the Great White North, I am your dumber cousin from south of the border, upstate NY, Vermont. I have never heard it anywhere in the states. Explain, please? And why doesn't the doctor go to hospital, but the patient go to hospital.

Enquiring minds want to know. Please???

dmb · Joined: 12 Feb 2003 Posts: 8397

To answer your question arioch I have two answers.
In Qatar the answer is '' Alishan"
In Turkey the answer "Iste"
Translation -Just because. There aren't always rules to language. You just have to accept

Capergirl · Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2004 2:28 pm Post subject:

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

Oh DMB, are you sitting on the mountain? And the wonder of internet, I didn't even have to climb. Are you intent on becoming the new guru, has Hamish is unwilling to wear the crown?

Where is Stephen Jones when you actually want him.

PS Capergirl, I think guys like you and Denise are truly women. I really do appreciate posts from women like you guys Wink

Capergirl · Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2004 2:45 pm Post subject:

lajzar · Joined: 09 Feb 2003 Posts: 647 Location: Saitama-ken, Japan

Mike_2003 · Joined: 27 Mar 2003 Posts: 344 Location: Bucharest, Romania

Arioch36, think about it this way...

Which would you ask someone?

"Where did you go to university?"
"Where did you go to the university?"
"Where did you go to a university?"

I think you would use the first, with the meaning of "in which city did you obtain an education through the use of a university".

Similar logic applies to schools, hospitals, and so on.

Think of it as a new kind of multi-word verb, "to go to hospital" = "to receive the particular service of a hospital".

So, as someone was trying to say, when you are a patient you would probably prefer to say "I can't come to my lesson next week because I'm going to hospital" (to receive treatment). However, if you were just visiting a particular friend who is "in hospital" (receiving treatment) you would probably visit "the hospital" (defined by "where he is").

And to back up DMB's point, do you "go to home" or "go to the home"? Wink

Iste ingilizce...

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

In England do you the teachers say I'm going to school, or going to the school? Going to work, or going to the workplace?

Thanx

PS Mika Nakashima Yuki no hana, beautiful song

PPS, Brits really say "cooker" ??? but I know they say oven and stove. So is "cooker" that this awful Brit text I am using refer to like a pressure cooker? or what?

johnslat · Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2004 3:05 pm Post subject: Home is where the heart is

Dear Mike_2003,
Good post (as is lajzar's). But in this example:

And to back up DMB's point, do you "go to home" or "go to the home"?

"home" isn't a noun - it's an adverb (where you go), so you "go (where?) home".

Regards,
John

Mike_2003 · Joined: 27 Mar 2003 Posts: 344 Location: Bucharest, Romania

Thanks John. I stand corrected.

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

A cooker is something that cooks. Thanks pal, always a wise guy in every bunch. So the British girl says in the text/tape my cooker is by the door, and over there is my stove. ????

We would ask;

Which university did you go to

or Where did you go to school (going to school being an activity)

When i am attending my university, I tell people I am going to school, I have classes, not I have university

We wouldn't say where did you go to hospital, but I guess a brit would? w would say which hospital did you go to.

Which and where are interchangeable in England?.

If you say I am going to work, then that kind of contradicts the