Job Discussion Forums

[mhoffman]

Hi,

I would be interested in moving to Istanbul to teach. I have a Master's degree in Educational Technology, a graduate degree in translation, and a BA in Classics. I have taught in Paris, France many years ago for 5 years (businessmen), and I work in language testing here in Canada for the federal government. I have also taught during a few months in 2 dershane in Istanbul. Would I still have to complete a CELTA in order to get a good job in a private school there, or would I be accepted with the degrees I have? What salary can I expect with my qualifications?

Thanks

[mhoffman]

no answers?

[Listener]

It all depends on what you want to do, but I think everyone will pretty much want to see a TEFL diploma of some kind, even a lot of the ones which don't get you a work permit.

[mhoffman]

Thanks for your reply. I am just wondering why a degree in Education + experience isn't enough in Turkey.

[Listener]

If you don't mind working illegally, it's fine. The thing is here that when your papers get shipped off to the Ministry of Education for approval for a legal job, they want to see some exact wording. I guess they have a list somewhere . If your qualifications don't use those exact words they won't approve you. I met a lady who's been working at a very reputable high school here who has a masters in literarure and has been teaching in Turkey for years and every year the Ministry refuses her papers the first time, and the school has to fight to get her approved. It's much easier for them to just reject you.

By the way, there was a very good article recently, I can't remember lately, about how a new employment package is coming through parliament and one part of it is cracking down on illegally employed foreigners, with the intention of freeing up jobs for up to 500,000 Turks. I would assume that this would also impact the issuing of work permits. Why hire a foreigner when there are unemployed Turks?

Wish I could remember where that article was....

[ladonnaoscurata]

It's true that the government is tracking down foreign teachers who are working without permits. Just a couple of weeks ago a small preschool was raided by the police and since most of the teachers don't even have residence permits they were all deported and the ones who did have residence permits were told they can't work until they get one. Some of the teachers who were deported had been in Turkey for 10 years! I definitely think we all need to be more careful if we're working without a permit. Now the school is left with only a couple of Turkish assistant teachers with around 70 kids in the school, and those teachers might be leaving too. Not a good situation. Everyone be careful out there! I remember having to leave that school one day when some officials from the Ministry of Education came to check things out. All of us foreigners snuck out the back and didn't return for a couple of hours! Absolutely ridiculous.

Good luck with your job search and hopefully you'll find a school that provides you with permits!

[mhoffman]

My husband is Turkish so I wouldn't have trouble getting working papers, I hope. Would this then mean that with the proper working papers, I wouldn't need to be approved by the Ministry of Education, or would one still need to go through that process? Also, if I do need an additional certification to teach in a good school, what would be the best, shortest and cheapest one to obtain (CELTA, for example?) ?

Thank you again for your responses.

[ladonnaoscurata]

Being married to a Turkish man will make it easier to get residence permits, all foreign nationals married to Turks have that privilege. However, to work, you need to be sponsored by a school. There is no such thing as a general work permit. The government needs to know for whom and where you are working. Also, most schools will make sure that your work permit is only for the time you will be working for them and if you quit and move on to another school I'm pretty sure you need to get a work permit for that specific school. Your old permit becomes invalid once you leave the school. I would recommend choosing any old TESOL program, the cheapest, the shortest. With your qualifications they really only need the TESOL or CELTA certificate for the Ministry of Education. It doesn't matter where you certificate comes from when you have as many degrees as you do.

Hope this helps!

[mhoffman]

I have heard of these "online" certificates. Does the Ministry of Education accept these, or they are just bogus?

[mhoffman]

Just noticed, you are from Vancouver. Have your recently spent time teaching in Istanbul? And if so, what was your experience like?

[ladonnaoscurata]

Actually, I need to change my location on my profile because I haven't lived in Vancouver for 3 years! I taught in Istanbul for 2 years, one year at a private international preschool and one year at a private Turkish school. I'm now in Cyprus with my husband (he's Turkish, not Cypriot) who is studying at a uni here. However, I will be moving back to Istanbul to work again in order to save money for our move back to Canada

My experiences in the workplace have been polar opposites. My first year I really enjoyed the school, the staff, the children but the pay was low, no housing, no residence or work permit. That's why I took the opportunity to work at a private Turkish school the next year. However, despite the good pay, free housing and my legal status I had such a hard time that year. The office politics are ridiculous, no curriculum and no chance to give ideas, I felt so alone there as the only foreign teacher in the preschool and was actually scolded by the preschool principal in front of all the other teachers because I asked for more support in my classes.

So, I personallly recommend that you look for international schools or Turkish schools with a good foreign national to Turk ratio in the staff. I don't know much about working at dershanes as I only worked in one for a month and I couldn't stand it! If you are in it for the money mostly and can handle a year or two of giving up a lot of your free time and people talking behind your back when you take a sick day, then I'd say that the big, private Turkish schools would be good for you. They give you a good opportunity to save money. If you have any specific questions let me know!

Oh, and I should probably mention that I have worked in preschool for the past 2 years so that's where my experience is but I do know a bit about how elementary and highschool teaching is, I've heard enough of my friends complain!

[ladonnaoscurata]

One more thing. With your qualifications I wouldn't accept anything under $2,500 a month (this is after taxes which all schools will deduct from your salary). A lot of schools go by years of experience teaching so I think that I may be underestimating your salary. My first year at the Turkish private school (one year previous experience) they offered me $1,900 + housing which I think is worth a total of $3,000. For every year of experience I would expect at least a $200 raise. Hope this helps!

[mhoffman]

I assume you are talking American currency? Do the schools actually pay in that currency?

Actually, cara donnaoscurata, maybe I should be helping you find something for when you return to Canada! I might be able to give you some good leads. My Turkey project is a bit iffy, I have it good here in Canada (weather notwithstanding - I am from Montreal, not Vancouver!) and even though I love Turkey, I don't know that I would love it past the "vacation" feeling!

[ladonnaoscurata]

Yes, I'm talking about American currency. In my experience, they do and they don't pay in that currency. One year I received cash (working illegally) in American currency and the other year I received the Turkish lira equivalent of my American dollar salary into the bank account provided by the school.

You definitely are right in thinking you might not like Turkey past the 'vacation' feeling. If it weren't for my husband, I'd have left for Canada a year ago!

I would totally appreciate some good leads in Canada, keep in touch! I'm sure to be lurking around this board for a long time to come

Let me know if you have anymore questions

[mhoffman]

I will let you know when something comes up in language assessment if you are interested. I hope your hubby likes Canada, mine hated it to the point where he couldn't stand staying here past 2 months, but then again he is a special case.