Job Discussion Forums

[alc]

Basically this is a continuation of my previous post about fiscal/visa concerns.

I got a job offer from a school last week with great pay, 8 weeks paid vacation, reimbursed airfare, free housing, etc. They do not provide an NPWP or multiple entry re-entry visa though. I turned the offer down yesterday because of the replies (no NPWP=illegal) I got to my previous post.

So I get another job offer today from a different language school. The pay and benefits are half what I was offered with the other job and again only single entry visa and no NPWP.

I got a call today from another language school. The caller was only checking to see if I was interested in starting the interviewing process. I said yes but I needed to know if they provided an NPWP. He said he wasn't sure what that was.

All 3 of these language schools are "major players" in Java (and Indonesia), not just random fly by night schools. The only place I have spoken to so far that provides an NPWP is Wall Street Jakarta. Unfortunately, I didn't get a job offer from WSI.

The first 2 schools I mentioned both assured me that even though they don't provide individual tax documents they never have problems (and everything is legal because they pay a group tax). This does sound shady and it's why I didn't take the first job. But now I'm sitting here without a job wondering where the hell all of these "reputable" schools are in Indonesia.

Is it absolutely illegal to work in Indonesia without an NPWP? If so, can anyone send me the names of language schools in Indonesia that actually offer NPWPs and MERPs? Or should I just give up and take a job in another country where I'm not as familiar with tax codes and hope for the best there?

I appreciate all the help and advice but I'm starting to run myself in circles here. I would really appreciate it if someone here could help me out! Thanks, Amber

[benbobaggins]

Hi Amber,

All i can say is that Indonesia can be quite confusing at times!!!

The new tax drive is new to us all. Lots of our employers are complying with the rules. However, this doesn't mean they are paying the full amount on our behalf.

Really, we won't know that till another year is down the line, and maybe people start getting letters from the tax office. I've personally asked for a pay slip from my company documenting such payments, as it could be useful when applying for loans or sorting out taxes in my home country - so far, no news on that front!

Here is the crux of the problem. I would hazard a guess that most of us who have been here 5 years+ have at one time been employed 'illegally' in Indonesia. It happens often considering new teachers are employed, and teaching, on a tourist visa whilst waiting for the Singapore trip to get their legal KITAS.

So, yes, a NPWP number would be useful. But, i also think that if it was me i would still take the job. You can always plead innocence and believe me, the tax authorities are not exactly switched on anyway.

If you really want the job, and the pay, conditions and general contract are acceptable to you, then take it.

But beware - you will almost always be in some kind of sticky situation in Indonesia - the lines are very grey indeed. It's not as clear cut as most countries in the West.

Hope you find and make the right decision.

Regards.

[basiltherat]

[alc]

Thanks again for the replies. I've been to Indonesia several times and I understand that certain things will always be beyond my control. Unfortunately I don't have any sort of savings so if I were to get caught by immigration owing back taxes, fines, etc at the end of my contract I would be royally screwed. You say that they rarely focus on the foreigners but with the situation as unpredictable as it is, that's not much comfort at this point. I'm pretty good at going with the flow on most things, finances is not one them. Especially since I have a university degree and CELTA and I'm from the U.S. I'm not some random backpacker looking for a shortcut. I don't really see why I should have to put myself on the line for an employer that's too cheap to pay their taxes. So maybe I don't belong in Indonesia after all. I really like the people, food, culture, and surf!! so I hope I'm wrong. Guess I'll keep looking for that elusive NPWP. If I don't find it, I'll go somewhere else first and wait for this crap to get sorted. I realize that might take a while (or forever) so I'll just have to see what happens. Got an offer for the Maldives today so I'll be sure not to research the tax situation there, ignorance is bliss!

[laughing_magpie06]

Hi alc, interesting what you said about the three schools and how only Wall Street offered you an NPWP. When I worked there a year or so ago they were the first and only school i worked for which did this. When I received my paycheck I could see the itemised tax figures unlike other schools which only showed the final net figure. They were completely transparent and switched on and operated as any Western company would.
I recently said to my wife if we were to go back to Indonesia that they were the only school I would consider working for. I'm guessing the other schools which offered you a position are EF franchises. Do I win the money?

[malu]

[alc]

LM, you're partially correct. One of the three schools I mentioned is part of the EF franchise. The others are not, but still very well known language schools.

[basiltherat]

malu
well, perhaps i stand corrected, then. i really do hope things change for the better because despite having had bitter experiences there in my final couple of years and the bitterness i still often show toward the country most likely because of that, indonesia will always be part of my life - it is still where i spent about half of it.

frankly, im still rather pessimistic about substantial, long-term changes coming to fruition in the country (at least in my lifetime) because of such an ingrained culture of corruption and embezzlement but ...... here's to hoping.

In my final years there, I personally thought that indonesia needed a fresh, whole new generation of people who sincerely believed in and who were academically and domestically educated towards working for the good of the country and not just solely themselves. Maybe this is a start.

Would anyone wish to second (or third) what Malu has said ? Maybe I've missed something by leaving.
best
basil

[Marquess]

academically? But you do not even have a degree.

[malu]

What changes have occurred are not the result of a new generation of enlightened technocrats as Basil hoped, but rather a smaller number of ruthlessly honest bigwigs who are prepared to wield the big stick. Sri Mulyani has made progress where none thought it possible in the tax and customs offices. An in-law of the president was recently sentenced for corruption which is something quite novel. OK, the guy won't serve even half his sentence and he will have TV, fine cuisine and someone to do his laundry - but can you imagine anyone that closely related to the first family getting so much as a reprimand in the past?

A case in point from my inbox today: an old friend of mine has been teaching here for years but now, at the age of 65, her employer can no longer bribe a work permit for someone over 60. The guys at the manpower ministry are sh1t scared of losing their pensions these days. Once upon a time you could have got a KITAS for a cocker spaniel for a few hundred dollars...

[basiltherat]

malu
i really appreciate where you are coming from.

the only caution i would put forward is that scaring people into doing the 'right' thing is very different from successfully educating people to do what they know or believe is 'right' and 'just' and to have genuine consideration and sympathy for others.

until that is part of the culture among the majority of the population (through a corrected moral upbringing), the notion that everything will from now on be completely different is, i believe, a false assumption. Sri Mulyani and her bigwig, stick-wielding personnel may be doing a great job but i'd guess there are many who, underneath, can't wait for her to disappear and then get back to old, more lucrative' habits. I believe it will take a long while, if ever i my lifetime, for the 'indonesian leopard' to changes its spots.

These new steps you mention will, i'd say, amount to nothing unless it is continuous and in conjunction with a progressive change/development in social mentality and welfare which i still maintain will take generations to achieve; that's even assuming sri mulyani and others like her carry on with the efforts required.

OK,i concede i'm no longer there and you're on the ground there, so to speak, so you have a better look at the exact circumstances.

anyway, let's see how things develop. i'll probably be more pleased than you, perhaps, if things turn out as u say. i can't wait to be proven wrong.

over and out before we are accused of going off topic.
best
basil

[Vertumnus]

In all the years I've lived and worked here, I've never been offered a MERP, so I don't think you should consider it a condition of employment.

As for the NPWP card, if you don't have it, make sure the company gives you the 2.5mil when you want to go out of the country, and ask them to help you with getting a MERP, and that you can go out on vacation.

I have had a lot of trouble with employers paying the taxes. I was once told that I'd be deported if a prior employer didn't pay up. They did, finally, so I was safe, but it certainly was nerve-wracking. Employers here like to underpay taxes, and bribe people, whenever possible, and I've had friends who paid the price.

Having the NPWP card does not guarantee that your employer won't cheat on taxes. I have friends with NPWP cards and some have already been screwed.

Pick carefully.

-D

[alc]

Well, after all of my posts I ended up accepting a teaching job in the Maldives starting August 1. Unfortunately I didn't get a job offer from WSI-Jakarta and they were the only ones offering an NPWP. I didn't really consider the MERP an absolute necessity. I do plan on living and working in Indonesia long term so I'll try again next year. I'm sure there are hundreds of ways to get screwed by employers and the government even with an NPWP. I just don't see much point in working for an employer that doesn't even attempt to look legitimate for their employees. If I was going to take that risk I wouldn't have bothered to take the CELTA.

Thanks to everyone that's replied to my posts! I'll probably start assaulting you with more complicated questions again early next year! -Amber

[Synergy101]

I know that some branches of TBI provide NPWP, I'm not sure if all do yet.